A Washing Machine Factory Tests Italy's Industrial Future
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aquarius1984
Well-known member
self inflicted
Judging by what I can see and have seen over the years this has only been self inflicted by Italy's greed and desire to homogenise the appliance industry.
When our appliance industry went bang and Hoover/Hotpoint/Servis were each bought out by Italian firms they all did the same thing. Churned out OUR brand names on cheapened less quality Italian name machines and saturated the markets on unsuspecting consumers.
Once consumers had bought a Hoover machine that lasted just 3 to 4 years or a Hotpoint badged Indesit that did just the same they realized they were not getting the quality they were used to.
Little wonder a Turkish manufacturer realized this and started producing better quality machines and promoting their brand on especially on TV.
Turkey has realized greed isn't everything and markets very good quality machines at the same or bigger price points as the cheap Italian ones but then consumers get more for their money.
Hotpoint and Hoover have supposedly picked back up on quality but Electrolux hasn't in all but its TOL ranges that are way out of reach to most people needing a fairly priced machine.
Zanussi/Electrolux/AEG cheapened, cash cowed on the name and put themselves out of the market so they have nobody to blame. I think if they had kept the 2000's series of 'Aquacycles' at the £300 mark and beefed up the quality instead of flogging 1200rpm/1400rpm versions at £250/60 they could of been using a great name association on reasonable machines.
Everybody here went crazy, being able to get a Zanussi for less than £260 then went off them when they were lasting no longer than £200 Indesits. Now you can often get 1600rpm Zanussi machines for £220 but they look dated and dont have the features or quality that £250 Beko's have.
I think Italy needs to learn hard from its lesson and realise its cheap ways and cash cowing isnt the answer, cutting back on dominance and greed is the answer and competing with quality not quantity.
Judging by what I can see and have seen over the years this has only been self inflicted by Italy's greed and desire to homogenise the appliance industry.
When our appliance industry went bang and Hoover/Hotpoint/Servis were each bought out by Italian firms they all did the same thing. Churned out OUR brand names on cheapened less quality Italian name machines and saturated the markets on unsuspecting consumers.
Once consumers had bought a Hoover machine that lasted just 3 to 4 years or a Hotpoint badged Indesit that did just the same they realized they were not getting the quality they were used to.
Little wonder a Turkish manufacturer realized this and started producing better quality machines and promoting their brand on especially on TV.
Turkey has realized greed isn't everything and markets very good quality machines at the same or bigger price points as the cheap Italian ones but then consumers get more for their money.
Hotpoint and Hoover have supposedly picked back up on quality but Electrolux hasn't in all but its TOL ranges that are way out of reach to most people needing a fairly priced machine.
Zanussi/Electrolux/AEG cheapened, cash cowed on the name and put themselves out of the market so they have nobody to blame. I think if they had kept the 2000's series of 'Aquacycles' at the £300 mark and beefed up the quality instead of flogging 1200rpm/1400rpm versions at £250/60 they could of been using a great name association on reasonable machines.
Everybody here went crazy, being able to get a Zanussi for less than £260 then went off them when they were lasting no longer than £200 Indesits. Now you can often get 1600rpm Zanussi machines for £220 but they look dated and dont have the features or quality that £250 Beko's have.
I think Italy needs to learn hard from its lesson and realise its cheap ways and cash cowing isnt the answer, cutting back on dominance and greed is the answer and competing with quality not quantity.
arbilab
Well-known member
Globalization flarked me in the banjo in 2001. My 6-figure computer quality job went to China, which claims to do it for 1/20th as much. But what they actually do is, not do it at all and charge for it at the same time. Who wins? Definitely not me. Not Dell either, though it was their idea. Not their customers. Their product is crap, while I still use my 16yo Dell because even at Chinese slave labor rates I can't afford to replace it.
When Dell was the rising star of NASDAQ and splitting 2:1 every 9 months, their stuff was made by Intel. That I know of, nobody ever jumped off the roof of Intel. Meanwhile, Dell stock has stagnated around one fifth their value when they were a legitimate company. The only Americans left working there are lawyers and MBAs.
Slave labor? Google 'foxconn suicide'. Foxconn is the Taiwanese company doing all their business in China, which had to install nets around their factories to stop workers killing themselves by jumping off the roof. These are people who were desperate to start with and Foxconn made their life WORSE. And Foxconn doesn't only make Dell, they make HP, Apple, and many others.
Correct me if I'm wrong, Thomas, but in Brazil people kill each other over refrigerator boxes to live in. Kinda like Haiti but in a "first-world" country.
The breeders have produced so many bodies desperate to survive, labor is worth nothing but what it's propped up to be, unsustainably. Running out of food and the water to grow it, price of both expands while pay declines. Really hate to say it because I know a handful of young folks who will have to live through this, but I'm glad I'm old and won't have to watch it get a whole lot worse.
When Dell was the rising star of NASDAQ and splitting 2:1 every 9 months, their stuff was made by Intel. That I know of, nobody ever jumped off the roof of Intel. Meanwhile, Dell stock has stagnated around one fifth their value when they were a legitimate company. The only Americans left working there are lawyers and MBAs.
Slave labor? Google 'foxconn suicide'. Foxconn is the Taiwanese company doing all their business in China, which had to install nets around their factories to stop workers killing themselves by jumping off the roof. These are people who were desperate to start with and Foxconn made their life WORSE. And Foxconn doesn't only make Dell, they make HP, Apple, and many others.
Correct me if I'm wrong, Thomas, but in Brazil people kill each other over refrigerator boxes to live in. Kinda like Haiti but in a "first-world" country.
The breeders have produced so many bodies desperate to survive, labor is worth nothing but what it's propped up to be, unsustainably. Running out of food and the water to grow it, price of both expands while pay declines. Really hate to say it because I know a handful of young folks who will have to live through this, but I'm glad I'm old and won't have to watch it get a whole lot worse.
aquarius1984
Well-known member
Electrolux might be bleating about China but it WAS them who outsourced a CHEAP range of machines a few years ago to CHINA and sold them at EXPENSE.
That says more about the greed they have than ever cutting back workers wages.
China/Singapore (one assumes they are whinging about LG/Samsung) had THE product at the time with large capacity, feature laden machines what WERE and mostly still are serviceable and came with fantastic warranties. Little wonder anyone with a good budget to spend on a machine bought one of these. I've grown rather fond of them, and for the money they really are good machines.
Italy has dragged behind for years and not invested in design or innovation cashing in on its past and is now wondering why its losing out. Listened to consumers? I think not.
That says more about the greed they have than ever cutting back workers wages.
China/Singapore (one assumes they are whinging about LG/Samsung) had THE product at the time with large capacity, feature laden machines what WERE and mostly still are serviceable and came with fantastic warranties. Little wonder anyone with a good budget to spend on a machine bought one of these. I've grown rather fond of them, and for the money they really are good machines.
Italy has dragged behind for years and not invested in design or innovation cashing in on its past and is now wondering why its losing out. Listened to consumers? I think not.
kenmoreguy89
Well-known member
I agree that it is partially fault of them, but there're the same way italian manufacturers that went into foreign hands, like sangiorgio with brandt, fagor etc...and the same way they became crap while in the past they were pretty good,
But making crappy or lesser quality appliances is not an italian thing only nowadays, we can all see they all prefer make more pieces but of lesser quality. So I think it is too easy to blame Italian made stuff for a thing many others does, even more when italians have been forced to do that,, and so having possibility to become the crappiest around....
I can fully believe that once italian brands acquired british brands they became crappy but even true it is a common fashion nowadays..isn't it?
Also, have seen Beko machines...and cannot really believe one could consider them any better in matter of quality...But sure you can get more for less money like more features and stuff like that, that if in an electrolux would duplicate the price but being substantially the same...
But I agree that the common error it was the one of pointing on quantity rather than quality, but they all did that all around europe, the fact they started making lesser quality stuff is imputable to the situation that created in italy right after euro, (what once costed 1000 lire then costed 1 euro, but the exact change for 1euro should have been 1936,27 lire, it was not so, immediately after euro all increased, and now it adds to it the taxation and all the rest) now the matter in Italy is trying to keep up with the costs and trying to produce machines that cost no more than others, of course quality is compromised, but whatever they do they would not be competitive at this point...
I think it is stupid to compare zanussi or anothet appliance factory to italian situation, there are so many factors involved that who is not in italy will not know...and that has fully to do with euro and europe....
Don't ask me what I think about euro and european union, as it would rise matters belonging to dirty laundry forum...
I just say that in a country with countless problems, taxation to unthinksble levels, producing costs (electricity etc) probably the highest of europe is a very difficult task to keep up with other countries that are priviliged and are living at expenses of italy, kinda purposedly taking advantage, you see how they reduced Greece, well next will be Italy, then Spain and France..on the other hand now we all know euro currency only had this purpose, and should not surprise you that in these countries folks are discussing and willing to abandon euro as they realized this is only a trojan horse a rip-off, but corrupted govs will do everything to avoid it, this to keep making interests of their principals in those countries/country that thanks to euro made a lot of money and lifted up and secured their economy that was starting being unstable...not the case to make names, right? England was smart and immediately seen in this a rip- off and stayed away from it and kept defending their identity, freedom, indipendence from EU, over here indeed europe regulate and tells us what our farmers should produce, tells us to buy milk from outside even though tons of italian milk are throwed away every week, they tells us to buy foreign milk, wheat etc and fir this agricultural sector is going to hell as well.....about euro I remind a name, M. Tatcher, she wise woman already knew that, and at the time she warned us all about what was going to happen.... Few listened her words though...
Anyways... Electrolux could have easily did what countless italian companies did, ie moving factories and company in countries like romania bulgaria etc...countries where costs of labour, taxation, costs of production is half if not three times less than italy, indeed they decided to stay in the country and give job to italians, and by doing this having to compromise qualit to compensate the situation that it was starting to create right after the euro, then degenerated as it was supposed to, but doing so and keeping factories here they have no future, like the country itself....it's just part of the destroying process italy is into, you see it in everything.
. So here do have sense comparing the future of electralux to the country, but this is obvious....
The solution? When italians will wake up, and personally I think this is not going to happen, and they will give a kick in the ass to this rotten political situation accomplice of the european mafia and reliant of thrm (it is not even much a secret now, just think that the new president, that BTW has not even been elected yet another time, has an appointment with merkel to ask the permission to do a job reform in the country he is president of!!! Italian governmnent is unconstitutional , illegitimate and they also openly admit it, is not it what others would call dictatorship??? And who you think they work for???? For the country sake or EU principals sake??? ) and so italians will say fuck off to EU, euro etc...and will make a revolution, then things with the time can return normal....until then it can only get worse...
And personally I think this will never happen...italians are too stupid... and those who can better run away before the total collapse...
[this post was last edited: 3/9/2014-14:45]
But making crappy or lesser quality appliances is not an italian thing only nowadays, we can all see they all prefer make more pieces but of lesser quality. So I think it is too easy to blame Italian made stuff for a thing many others does, even more when italians have been forced to do that,, and so having possibility to become the crappiest around....
I can fully believe that once italian brands acquired british brands they became crappy but even true it is a common fashion nowadays..isn't it?
Also, have seen Beko machines...and cannot really believe one could consider them any better in matter of quality...But sure you can get more for less money like more features and stuff like that, that if in an electrolux would duplicate the price but being substantially the same...
But I agree that the common error it was the one of pointing on quantity rather than quality, but they all did that all around europe, the fact they started making lesser quality stuff is imputable to the situation that created in italy right after euro, (what once costed 1000 lire then costed 1 euro, but the exact change for 1euro should have been 1936,27 lire, it was not so, immediately after euro all increased, and now it adds to it the taxation and all the rest) now the matter in Italy is trying to keep up with the costs and trying to produce machines that cost no more than others, of course quality is compromised, but whatever they do they would not be competitive at this point...
I think it is stupid to compare zanussi or anothet appliance factory to italian situation, there are so many factors involved that who is not in italy will not know...and that has fully to do with euro and europe....
Don't ask me what I think about euro and european union, as it would rise matters belonging to dirty laundry forum...
I just say that in a country with countless problems, taxation to unthinksble levels, producing costs (electricity etc) probably the highest of europe is a very difficult task to keep up with other countries that are priviliged and are living at expenses of italy, kinda purposedly taking advantage, you see how they reduced Greece, well next will be Italy, then Spain and France..on the other hand now we all know euro currency only had this purpose, and should not surprise you that in these countries folks are discussing and willing to abandon euro as they realized this is only a trojan horse a rip-off, but corrupted govs will do everything to avoid it, this to keep making interests of their principals in those countries/country that thanks to euro made a lot of money and lifted up and secured their economy that was starting being unstable...not the case to make names, right? England was smart and immediately seen in this a rip- off and stayed away from it and kept defending their identity, freedom, indipendence from EU, over here indeed europe regulate and tells us what our farmers should produce, tells us to buy milk from outside even though tons of italian milk are throwed away every week, they tells us to buy foreign milk, wheat etc and fir this agricultural sector is going to hell as well.....about euro I remind a name, M. Tatcher, she wise woman already knew that, and at the time she warned us all about what was going to happen.... Few listened her words though...
Anyways... Electrolux could have easily did what countless italian companies did, ie moving factories and company in countries like romania bulgaria etc...countries where costs of labour, taxation, costs of production is half if not three times less than italy, indeed they decided to stay in the country and give job to italians, and by doing this having to compromise qualit to compensate the situation that it was starting to create right after the euro, then degenerated as it was supposed to, but doing so and keeping factories here they have no future, like the country itself....it's just part of the destroying process italy is into, you see it in everything.
. So here do have sense comparing the future of electralux to the country, but this is obvious....
The solution? When italians will wake up, and personally I think this is not going to happen, and they will give a kick in the ass to this rotten political situation accomplice of the european mafia and reliant of thrm (it is not even much a secret now, just think that the new president, that BTW has not even been elected yet another time, has an appointment with merkel to ask the permission to do a job reform in the country he is president of!!! Italian governmnent is unconstitutional , illegitimate and they also openly admit it, is not it what others would call dictatorship??? And who you think they work for???? For the country sake or EU principals sake??? ) and so italians will say fuck off to EU, euro etc...and will make a revolution, then things with the time can return normal....until then it can only get worse...
And personally I think this will never happen...italians are too stupid... and those who can better run away before the total collapse...
[this post was last edited: 3/9/2014-14:45]
beekeyknee
Well-known member
I agree, Rick. I wouldn't want to be any younger either. This world seems to be going down the toilet. To bad there won't be enough water around to flush it.
@kenmoreguy89 (and sorry for the off-topic)
"the new president, that BTW has not even been elected"
I assume you mean the President of the Council of Ministers. If this is the case, please note that the Constitution of the Italian Republic does not state that the president has to be elected.
According to the Constitution, the President of the Council of Ministers is freely chosen by the President of the Republic, without any constraint (the chosen candidate does not even need to be a member of the parliament).
The chosen candidate is then subject to the vote of trust of the Parliament.
Just for clarity, and to clear up a quite common misconception.
"the new president, that BTW has not even been elected"
I assume you mean the President of the Council of Ministers. If this is the case, please note that the Constitution of the Italian Republic does not state that the president has to be elected.
According to the Constitution, the President of the Council of Ministers is freely chosen by the President of the Republic, without any constraint (the chosen candidate does not even need to be a member of the parliament).
The chosen candidate is then subject to the vote of trust of the Parliament.
Just for clarity, and to clear up a quite common misconception.
kenmoreguy89
Well-known member
Yes, of course I mean the president of the council, let's call it premier, to semplify things...
And of course premier is not elected by the folk, otherwise Italy would be a normal country so a presidential republic.... On the base of this when I say elected from nobody I mean he got the power only thanks to a blackmail inside the party to gain their simphaty, and anyway the party in power in the parliament has not been elected from the folk ( italy resulted ungovernable after last elections) as you know when a premier fail the party suggest a new premier to be and the president of republic elects it, I think I have not to mention that the president of republic does not count much inside the system and parties can do whatever they wants and are all secretly allied among them, even when they openly are rivals, then secretely are all friends.....all these premier of the PD that continue to be changed are a show set up only to give the idea that they actually care of things when actually it is all pre-prepared, a show.... Just to give false hopes and continue to do the bullshits they always do, gaining time...
They know that if Italy would re-make elections at this time they all would be over and would rise 5 stars movement that is against them all and european mafia...even though having very childish plans and laughable ideas...at least they're honest, and folks knows that...
Moreover....
You know how Renzi said " i will never go to goverment without elections" indeed there he is... So a lying pig, as if it wasn't obvious enough...they all are...
Also....in a normal country even if it was a parlamentary republic as italy is, when it results not governable like in last elections they would re-make elections...it was not the case in Italy... So actually the party now in power in parliament has not been elected by nobody nor can be the premier in power...whoever he is...So elected by nobody as it's party...yet another time...
[this post was last edited: 3/9/2014-17:03]
And of course premier is not elected by the folk, otherwise Italy would be a normal country so a presidential republic.... On the base of this when I say elected from nobody I mean he got the power only thanks to a blackmail inside the party to gain their simphaty, and anyway the party in power in the parliament has not been elected from the folk ( italy resulted ungovernable after last elections) as you know when a premier fail the party suggest a new premier to be and the president of republic elects it, I think I have not to mention that the president of republic does not count much inside the system and parties can do whatever they wants and are all secretly allied among them, even when they openly are rivals, then secretely are all friends.....all these premier of the PD that continue to be changed are a show set up only to give the idea that they actually care of things when actually it is all pre-prepared, a show.... Just to give false hopes and continue to do the bullshits they always do, gaining time...
They know that if Italy would re-make elections at this time they all would be over and would rise 5 stars movement that is against them all and european mafia...even though having very childish plans and laughable ideas...at least they're honest, and folks knows that...
Moreover....
You know how Renzi said " i will never go to goverment without elections" indeed there he is... So a lying pig, as if it wasn't obvious enough...they all are...
Also....in a normal country even if it was a parlamentary republic as italy is, when it results not governable like in last elections they would re-make elections...it was not the case in Italy... So actually the party now in power in parliament has not been elected by nobody nor can be the premier in power...whoever he is...So elected by nobody as it's party...yet another time...
[this post was last edited: 3/9/2014-17:03]
warmsecondrinse
Well-known member
Eastern European competition
I'd like to know what these so-called rival products from eastern Europe are and how we can get them in the U.S.
I'd like to know what these so-called rival products from eastern Europe are and how we can get them in the U.S.
kenmoreguy89
Well-known member
Not sure what they mean also...as far as I know there are not significant brands belonging to eastern europe apart maybe Slovenian Gorenje? Even though it is not as famous in all the europe as german, french, spanish and italian brands are....but sure among the ones known..
Not others that I am aware of belongs to eastern europe...
So not sure what they talk about.....
All I know i that many italian companies moved plants or portions of plants in eastern europe for the reasons i hsve explained before, and actually just the finishing of products is done within the country, still eligible to put Made in italy even though actually Made in Romania, bulgaria, albania, serbia or whatever eastern and with productive costs that are sustainable..this is not only about white goods, of course, many italian factories and companies did that to survive, from the stockings factory like Omsa to food companies etc....
Electrilux even being now swedish decided to keep the washing machine plant in Porcia Italy...and give job to italians, and you see the results.....other italian makers indeed now have plants all over the places eastern europe and also western european countries where producing costs are indeed within normality...italian companies are forced to move plants elsewhere to save their asses.... It is no longer possible produce inside italy, this create even more disoccupation all goes down the toilet in that whirlpool that now italy is into...and as I said I think that there will be not solutions for this.....not a surprise that many social economic studies, including the last british one confirm that within ten years of italy will remain nothing...so you csn easily see it is not a matter of electrolux, nor greed of italian white goods makers or washing machine makers, the proof of this is also explained by the fact that others with plants outside are still going pretty good.....every company with plants inside italy is in the same situation and many already bankrupted and closed...kaput!
Not sure what they meant with eastern europe rivals, or perhaps they meant italians rivals having plants in eastern europe....then it makes sense...
Anyway what we tend to forget is that we're speaking of plants,, electrolux has a very particular company configuration and for some reasons still being involved with zanussi and italy decided to keep plants in the country even though now being swedish owned, after all they acquired all in bulk,including plants, if they knew how it was going to be over here they would have neve r did that....
let's make an hypothetical case, if Bosch or AEG had a plant over here that plant would be in the exact situation now porcia electrolux one is into....or let's make anothet case, imagine uk in the situation italy is right now, if ariston when they purchased uk hotpoint brand, instead of making ariston style made stuff badged hotpoint they started making in uk classical british hotpoint but badged ariston....it would still be ariston but hotpoint british soul and body......but if in uk things were going like in italy then they would have became crap the same way, and you'd have a plant in crisis the same way, so if this is the reasoning italians would blame british for doing crap... But nobody really wanted to do crap, they simply were forced to...and or they moved plant elsewhere or they'd be forced to close.
Same is for hoovers with candy company...
Am not discussing italian machines being better or worse than british ones, even because in all honesty I have always considered italian machines kind of filmsey cans compared to british standards of machines and this also in the past.... But just trying to be fair, italian ones perhaps were not as good but anyway they were not all this crappy as someone depicts them though, and if I have to be even more honest during the time i could see british being happy with much less than average italian used to offer them.
Then if we really want to talk about why italians, once they acquired hotpoint or hoover or british brands, they started making italian style stuff rather than original british ones, i do not really know we can call it homogenizing purpose and anyway even if so that regarded only UK, not certainly europe all, personally I'd have preferred having british hotpoint aristons over here than italian aristons, but i assume that it had to do with capacity of production, while in italy they had plants that were able to produce machines for the request of all the continental europe, uk factories generally only had capacity to produce machines for the england isle only.... Uk always had a kind of self-sustained market.... Italy always exported alot, uk not so much...[this post was last edited: 3/10/2014-20:09]
Not others that I am aware of belongs to eastern europe...
So not sure what they talk about.....
All I know i that many italian companies moved plants or portions of plants in eastern europe for the reasons i hsve explained before, and actually just the finishing of products is done within the country, still eligible to put Made in italy even though actually Made in Romania, bulgaria, albania, serbia or whatever eastern and with productive costs that are sustainable..this is not only about white goods, of course, many italian factories and companies did that to survive, from the stockings factory like Omsa to food companies etc....
Electrilux even being now swedish decided to keep the washing machine plant in Porcia Italy...and give job to italians, and you see the results.....other italian makers indeed now have plants all over the places eastern europe and also western european countries where producing costs are indeed within normality...italian companies are forced to move plants elsewhere to save their asses.... It is no longer possible produce inside italy, this create even more disoccupation all goes down the toilet in that whirlpool that now italy is into...and as I said I think that there will be not solutions for this.....not a surprise that many social economic studies, including the last british one confirm that within ten years of italy will remain nothing...so you csn easily see it is not a matter of electrolux, nor greed of italian white goods makers or washing machine makers, the proof of this is also explained by the fact that others with plants outside are still going pretty good.....every company with plants inside italy is in the same situation and many already bankrupted and closed...kaput!
Not sure what they meant with eastern europe rivals, or perhaps they meant italians rivals having plants in eastern europe....then it makes sense...
Anyway what we tend to forget is that we're speaking of plants,, electrolux has a very particular company configuration and for some reasons still being involved with zanussi and italy decided to keep plants in the country even though now being swedish owned, after all they acquired all in bulk,including plants, if they knew how it was going to be over here they would have neve r did that....
let's make an hypothetical case, if Bosch or AEG had a plant over here that plant would be in the exact situation now porcia electrolux one is into....or let's make anothet case, imagine uk in the situation italy is right now, if ariston when they purchased uk hotpoint brand, instead of making ariston style made stuff badged hotpoint they started making in uk classical british hotpoint but badged ariston....it would still be ariston but hotpoint british soul and body......but if in uk things were going like in italy then they would have became crap the same way, and you'd have a plant in crisis the same way, so if this is the reasoning italians would blame british for doing crap... But nobody really wanted to do crap, they simply were forced to...and or they moved plant elsewhere or they'd be forced to close.
Same is for hoovers with candy company...
Am not discussing italian machines being better or worse than british ones, even because in all honesty I have always considered italian machines kind of filmsey cans compared to british standards of machines and this also in the past.... But just trying to be fair, italian ones perhaps were not as good but anyway they were not all this crappy as someone depicts them though, and if I have to be even more honest during the time i could see british being happy with much less than average italian used to offer them.
Then if we really want to talk about why italians, once they acquired hotpoint or hoover or british brands, they started making italian style stuff rather than original british ones, i do not really know we can call it homogenizing purpose and anyway even if so that regarded only UK, not certainly europe all, personally I'd have preferred having british hotpoint aristons over here than italian aristons, but i assume that it had to do with capacity of production, while in italy they had plants that were able to produce machines for the request of all the continental europe, uk factories generally only had capacity to produce machines for the england isle only.... Uk always had a kind of self-sustained market.... Italy always exported alot, uk not so much...[this post was last edited: 3/10/2014-20:09]
Eastern European competition
One of these companies is certainly Arçelik from Turkey. They made very affordable appliances that rate quite high in various consumer magazines.
en.wikipedia.org
One of these companies is certainly Arçelik from Turkey. They made very affordable appliances that rate quite high in various consumer magazines.
Arçelik - Wikipedia
kenmoreguy89
Well-known member
Isn't arcelik the beko brand???? Turkey it's southern european rather than eastern..... at least southeastern europe....
Not classificable as Eastern Europe anyway....I think....
And, .actually transcontinental accordingly to these maps
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Europe_subregion_map_UN_geoschme.svg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Europe
[this post was last edited: 3/11/2014-13:22]
Not classificable as Eastern Europe anyway....I think....
And, .actually transcontinental accordingly to these maps
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Europe_subregion_map_UN_geoschme.svg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Europe
[this post was last edited: 3/11/2014-13:22]
Yeah, might just be my German mindset to automatically include Turkey whenever I hear Eastern Europe.
kenmoreguy89
Well-known member
I don't really know, anyway the correction wasn't for you, I also thought of Turkey with the Beko but realized that if they spoke about eastern europe it could not have been Beko they referred of....and anyway it's a marginal brand if we aplply it to make a speech about general rivality.... Beko may be the rival of electrolux/zanussi in certain places ( over here Beko is the cheapest you can get along with chinese made store branded stuff like Kennex from coop stores or whatever china junks with wacky names) , but speaking on a larger and general scale, is one against many others italian or european
ones still considered better than bekos, that again, are seen like cheap china stuff over here, this differently than elsewhere where we can see they're having good consideration....
Not to mention that here of course the same way, electrolux rex are loosing so much of market share..., for the reasons above, but bekos and china howell, haier watever are really the last wheel of the cart...
Anyway...returning to talk about eastern europe matter...
You know, I expect articles and newspapers to speak diplomatically and not according to mindsets, even because if I had to speak according to mindsets over here, Turkey would be Arabia and whatever east of Trieste slavonian countries and or russian communists...
No offence meant...[this post was last edited: 3/13/2014-18:07]
ones still considered better than bekos, that again, are seen like cheap china stuff over here, this differently than elsewhere where we can see they're having good consideration....
Not to mention that here of course the same way, electrolux rex are loosing so much of market share..., for the reasons above, but bekos and china howell, haier watever are really the last wheel of the cart...
Anyway...returning to talk about eastern europe matter...
You know, I expect articles and newspapers to speak diplomatically and not according to mindsets, even because if I had to speak according to mindsets over here, Turkey would be Arabia and whatever east of Trieste slavonian countries and or russian communists...
No offence meant...[this post was last edited: 3/13/2014-18:07]
kenmoreguy89
Well-known member
Blomberg, Haier, Luxor, Wega white, Beko etc.... Are all cheap brands that over here are considered china junks....but that though are what always more people * only * can afford to get.
