Circuit Breakers or Fuse panel?

[dustin92]

I am posting this topic because we are in the process of moving; moving from a house that was built in 1999 that is wired adequately, has circuit breakers and functions properly, into a house which was built in the 1940's and is not wired properly by any stretch of the imagination. The wiring has been "updated" but not replaced, and at least half of the outlets in the upstairs (main level) run through one fuse. That fuse has blown several times in the last couple weeks because we are used to plugging something in and it working. Not the case here. The laundry room (washer and gas dryer), living room, and one bedroom (with window a/c unit) are all on the fuse. The entire kitchen, (dishwasher included), and bathroom are on another fuse which is also somehow run through a circuit breaker. Not sure about the rest yet. Somehow we blew one of the "main" fuses tonight about 8:00 and drove all over trying to find a replacement as the whole house went dead (except for one ceiling fan which was still running!?) Eventually found one and everything is going again. I tracked the problem down to running the dishwasher, washing machine, central air, and window a/c unit, plus 2 portable fans and 4 ceiling fans at once. Obviously the house is getting rewired asap (or as soon as finances allow) Does anybody else have bad wiring and HOW do you deal with it? This is getting annoying in a hurry!

 

[launderess]

It Tisn't Much As Your Home Isn't Wired Properly

But that it's not wired for modern usage that calls for increased deamand for electrical supply.

Sounds like the previous owners tried to work around the problem but didn't solve. Merely adding more outlets to an already over worked circut solves nothing. The fuse box should come out and a circut breaker box put in with as many new circuts as required for the load sizes. Depending upon how much power is coming into the home, you may need to have a new line run from the pole to your home in order to supply increased supply.

In the meanwhile the best you can do is determine the max for each circut and stay below. Oh, and stock up on fuses. Try older hardware stores and even on fleaPay. Here in NYC fuse boxes are still common enough many stores including hardware still sell the things in all sizes and shapes. However code requires whenever major electrical work is done on an apartment or house the FB must be replaced with a circut breaker panel.

 

[vintagekitchen]

How I deal with it..

Mostly you just get used to it. I cannot run the iron or vacuum cleaner and the window unit air conditioner in the living room at the same time, nor can I run the dishwasher and window unit air conditioner in the kitchen at the same time. I know this from hard experience, so switching off the air conditioner in those rooms before plugging in these other appliances has become instinct.

My 1300 watt microwave with inverter defrost couldnt be used, because if the refrigerator happened to kick on while it was running, the breaker would throw, so I traded it to someone for their 1980's 600 watt microwave, which the wiring can handle.

I dont use a dryer, because the dryer and the water heater share a circuit and outlet, and I dont fancy crawling between the two of them plugging and unplugging those huge cords every time I want to dry a load of clothes. (also it saves me a bit of money)

I have a wood heating stove in the living room, since the choice was wood or gas, and I prefer wood. Additional wiring would have to be installed for electric heat in the house other than the small space heater in the bathroom. Speaking of that heater in the bathroom, I cannot use that heater at the same time as the hairdryer or straightnening iron for my hair, or the breaker throws. Again, I know to unplug one or the other instinctively now.

Though this house is underwired, I do have a breaker box, and I think I would go mad if I had to go back to a fusebox. I have made many of those emergency trips to town for a fuse while living in other houses.

 

[arbilab]

How to manage until you can get the wiring revised? You already know. Use only one high-load appliance at a time. A lot of the stuff you were running when the main blew didn't exist when the house was built. Central air should not have been installed without revising the wiring but I guess code let them get away with it at the time.

I had a friend with a 40s house. It even had breakers, probably retrofit. He couldn't run the hairdryer and ANYTHING else at the same time.

Blowing fuses is a nuisance but nothing like having the house catch fire.

 

[vintagekitchen]

Something to help

The last place I lived in that had a fusebox, I purchased several of these mini-breakers. You simply unscrew the fuse, screw in the mini breaker, and you are done. It works just like a regular circuit breaker, if it throws, you push in the white button in the center, which resets the breaker. They cost a bit more than fuses, but are worth it. You can probably get them cheaper at a local hardware store, but here is a link just in case.

http://www.amazon.com/Connecticut-Electric-Vpkmb20-Mini-Breaker/dp/B000M1YUO4

 

[fido]

I know the feeling of frustration! My whole house here in Hungary is running off one 15 amp circuit breaker and the meter itself is only rated up to 20 amps. I will probably need to rewire the whole house before I dare ask the electricity company for an upgrade. Meanwhile I have to always be thinking about what appliances are on. Even boiling the kettle when the washing machine is going could cause an overload. I have found burnt bits of wiring in some of the many junction boxes high up on the walls. The joints are just twisted together and taped.

 

[lordkenmore]

Past the limits of how much power you can use, there is another problem with old wiring: grounded outlets. Wiring installed years and years back would not have included grounded outlets. The house I grew up in was built ca. 1950, and most outlets as I recall were NOT grounded. This is a hassle for today's world when many things have a grounded plug.

Even if you see a grounded outlet, you should not assume it actually is properly grounded. The house I grew up in, for example, had grounded outlets here and there. When I got my first computer, I got a surge protector that had a light that indicated proper ground. I discovered that most of the "grounded" outlets actually weren't properly grounded. Ever since that time, I have NOT trusted grounded outlets in older construction unless I have tested them. Actually, I also have tested strange modern outlets that SHOULD have been installed correctly just to be certain.

 

[hydralique]

Green Acres . . .

Poor Oliver and Lisa had the same problem! Each appliance was assigned a numerical value, and if they all added up to more than 7 (IIRC) then the fuse would blow as Lisa would explain to Oliver whenever he tried to do something stupid like make coffee and toast at the same time.

 

[alr2903]

Mine where all breakers when i moved here but a total rewire was not done on the main house 1955.  I think you can safely live in the house.  Sometimes i think this was gradual a ceiling fan here a window unit there  if senior aged people lived in the house prior to you, and they may have for years. You can bet all of the equipment you listed was never on at the same time.  I  try to be conseravative and this spring when our old LG  a/c unit gave up the ghost  ( it gives an extra boost to the central a/c in our bedroom).  we replaced it with one with the same specs to avoid a possible problem.  In older homes it makes a lot of sense to use gas cooking, gas dryer, as you mentioned, gas furnaces and water heaters. Consider low energy bulb in every fixture you can.  run dishwasher at night when the temp is cooler. Buy a few new smoke detectors for the bedrooms and other key areas and i think you will be allright. LOL with older homes and not being millionaires you can have it all, but it does not all need to be "on" at the same time.  alr

 

 

 

[whirlcool]

When I first read the first posting in this thread I immediately thought of Mrs. Douglas in the kitchen in front of her "fusebox". Lisa explaining how it all works was one of the best scenes of "Green Acres"!

Fast forward to about 6 min for the scene.

 

[cadman]

As was mentioned above, even with proper wiring and new breakers, your main feed is probably woefully undersized. 200A is the standard today and if you hire an electrician to do the work, they'll need to choreograph things with the PoCo to ensure new conductors are installed and available as the panel goes in.

Codes now dictate the power meter be installed outside the home, and cost of the meter housing and installation falls on the homeowner (PoCo says which housing(s) are allowed on their system)..so if it's in the basement today, expect that to change. If service is overhead, you might be looking at a new weatherhead and conduit through the roof. If underground, the PoCo will need to trench service in on their schedule (that typically gets contracted out, too). Figure on new ground rods and copper if the meter moves. Food for thought....

 

[MrX]

You'd probably need to consider having the house re wired.
Old houses weren't wired with modern loads in mind.

Adding new circuits to an antiquated system isn't a great idea to be honest. Depending on how old the wiring is, it may have old rubber or early plastic insulation. Many of these older materials deteriorate badly over the decades and can pose a significant fire hazard.

Fixtures and fittings in old installations are also usually well worn out. Socket outlets begin to make poor contact, switches wear out etc etc

Old systems, in this part of the world (pre 1978) also did not require RCD/GFCI protection. So, any upgrade will generally provide you with much bette protection against electric shock.

Old American installations also tended not to have grounded outlets in some areas. That's really not considered safe anymore.

I'd definitely get a new system installed.

If you're getting re wired make sure you get 220V installed to your laundry area too, even if you're using gas dryers. You'd never know when you might want a self heating washer or an electric dryer in the future.

 

[wayupnorth]

Also when rewiring and adding a new breaker box, dont underestimate what you could use in the future for added circuits. I wished that I had put in a larger 200 amp panel instead of a 100 amp. Now I only have room for 2 more future circuits in the box. But when I rewired the entire place to code, I put almost everything on its own seperate breaker and have not had one trip in 17 years.

 

[dustin92]

Well we are doing ok today, I haven't blown anything yet, I baked a cake for my mom's birthday (the range is electric), and vacuumed, I just made sure to not overload things. We do have one of those resettable fuses, and the heat and hot water are gas. It is a nice old house except for the electrical issues and one small plumbing issue. Hopefully I won't blow anything up when I put the pork loin in the roaster for dinner lol...

 

[mattl]

A 200 amp panel makes sense today, but remember, even under heavy load the typical home only uses a fraction of that.  There is no reason with a 100 amp panel that you could not add a sub panel for more circuits.  In the case of the OP with the main fuse blowing, it may have been old, near the end of it's life, or it may have been truly overloaded.  From what was posted I'd bet on the former but either is possible.

 

If one side of the panel continued to work, evidenced by the ceiling that was still working, it would appear that all the heavy power use equipment was on one half of the power feed, never a good idea.  If you look at a bare, new panel you will see a serpentine connection to the main buss just to avoid this mess.  Each adjacent circuit is on the alternate feed.  I'd bet some judicious rearranging of the circuits could be a temporary fix, even a new 60 amp panels could suffice.  a good honest electrician might be able to do it for you, but I'm sure he will tell you to upgrade.

 

[maytagbear]

As soon as

you possibly can, just get the place rewired. It will be easier to live in, it will be more resellable (if it could be resold with such below code wiring!) and we here will feel better. Others may disagree, but I think it would be well worth borrowing, even around 19%APR for this upgrade.

I've been imploring my landlord to put in new service, and a breaker panel. It's a fuse box, from at the latest, the 60s, and I have had about 8 fuses blow out since I've been here. It was not easy to find a cartridge fuse for the former electric stove at 7 pm on a Sunday.

Every place I've lived before here had breakers and adequate service.

Lawrence/Maytagbear

 

[dustin92]

We had the same trouble last night (at 8pm no less). It was a cartrige fuse that blew and I'm sure it was overloaded, because it was hot even a few minutes after it blew. It might have been old as well. I'm sure the wiring wouldn't pass code, but we are buying it from family, and we don't plan on reselling it, so it will be rewired to meet our needs. I think most of the wire has been repplaced at some point or another, because there is only a couple of wires coming into the fuse box that look scary, most of it looks good.

 

[twintubdexter]

sort of an interesting problem...

My house has 260A service, partly because of the 2 air conditioners and partly because there's a 220 plug and a gas connection for the ovens, cooktop and dryer so you have a choice. When I took the compactor and second dishwasher out of the kitchen island I replaced them with a wine fridge, a clear ice maker that's never turned on and a microwave drawer. There are 2 seperate 15 amp circuits for these appliances. The microwave drawer (has no heating element) has one all to itself so I assumed everything would be fine, then I discovered the microwave started tripping the 15 amp breaker every so often. I thought the breaker was bad so I replaced it but that didn't correct the problem so I started reading how breakers work, they sense heat. My main breaker panel is on the West side of my house and the cover bakes in the direct sun during the hottest part of the afternoon...exactly when the microwave pops the breaker. The padlock I have on the panel gets so hot you need a potholder to remove it so I'm putting the blame on the sun. I guess I'm going to have to figure out some sort of shade cover or not use the microwave on hot afternoons like last Tuesday when the temperature topped at 119...gives you an idea of hot smokin hot it gets here.

 

[cuffs054]

When I had my money pit rewired from K & T 60 amp service to solid copper service with 200 amp I had the electrician run a dedicated redundant 30 amp circuit to each room for any further expansion. It has been handy.