How much effort to maintain new dishwashers vs old?

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The lg has had no repair, but it's been in my house about one month. The kitchen aid I got a clogged drain hose once, and I replaced a wobbly (still worked fine) handle. Ultimately I got rid of it bc of the incoming matching black stainless appliances and the fact the ka racks were rusting pretty bad.

I bought the ka on Craigslist for $75, and used it in my home for at least 6 years.
 
Lorainfurniture

Nope, wrong on all counts. I paid close to $1000 for that POS Kitchenaid dishwasher which included installation. I did so with the belief that it was the absolute BEST dishwasher known to mankind, since I had always heard from everyone they were the cadillac of dishwashers. The year was 1980, possibly 1981. It was right after they started putting the separate spray arm under the top rack, but did NOT have even the little spinner on the very top. Obviously this was a serious mistake since it left little particles all on top of the glasses which was what upset me the most. There was no way to correct it since they had left no place on the top of the machine to later add the water spinner either. It had all of it's insulation wrapped around it and was built much like a tank compared to the GE that it replaced. The Maytag that replaced it a year later was not nearly as heavily built as it was, but did an excellent job of cleaning and drying the dishes and was quicker. I now have a Whirlpool made dishwasher that is very much like a Kitchenaid of today. It does a good job of cleaning, not so good on drying since they quit forced air drying. I am quite satisfied with it, but will NEVER forget the unfortunate choice of a new dishwasher I chose back in 1980. I noticed that a year or two later they again added the top water spinner to the new machines which I am sure made their performance much better. Perhaps it was an off year, I don't know. Just that I felt cheated and that I had wasted a great deal of money and have never felt the same about Kitchenaid dishwashers since. Perhaps the same thing that happened to cadillac happened to them too. After all, Lexus is a FAR better car than cadillac ever thought about being.
 
I've had good luck with our Bosch dishwashers. My mom's one was purchased in 2006 and mine was made in 2010 - neither ever needed a repair (both are German-made). Because they heater is 230V, the cold fill gets up to temp quickly. A 158°F Pots & Pans double-wash, triple-rinse and dry cycle takes 90 minutes.

Am currently using a countertop Bosch model that has been in and out of storage since I got it in 1993. No repairs on that one either.
 
I have a Whirlpool Gold dishwasher. It's about three years old. So far it hasn't had any problems and it washes well. It just takes too long--over three hours--to complete the cycle. That's not an issue because it is usually run after my wife and I has had dinner. The old 2004 Frigidaire that was original to the house when it was built washed the dishes in no more than an hour and fifteen minutes.

The pump on this thing freaked me out when I first bought it. I literally had an "oh hell no" moment and contemplated taking it back when I took the dishwasher out of the box. It's a small, plastic pump. No big and heavy "washer motor" attached to a pump mechanism. I call it a fishtank pump. Surprisingly, it does a good job, but I'm not so sure about its long term reliability. Askoll (the company that made the pump) had stamped "For intermittent use only" on the plastic body of the motor, so the days of the heavy duty 1/4 horsepower motors of steel that we are accustomed to are over; it also explains the reasoning behind the pauses in the cycles, the motor cannot handle running continuously without pausing to cool off. Unfortunately, it seems as if all dishwashers are using low power fishtank type pumps.

Fortunately, it washes well and it's a Whirlpool, which means parts are cheap and easy to find should something happen. Just keep the filter cup clean. It is a pain to access, you have to clear the spray arm to pull it out.
 
I am in support of new dishwashers with filtration systems instead of chopper assemblies.

I'll get it out of the way, I will always recommend a Miele dishwasher over anything that is made. There are no ifs about it. I have yet to be disappointed by them. https://goo.gl/photos/McdPVWrhPmCv5U7d7

That being said... Depending on what your must haves are, a new dishwasher will be around that 1k-1500 price point. I would not own a 3 or 5 series Bosch. We have had over 70 repair calls on them just in 2017. If look at a German appliance and it does NOT say Made in Germany on it, DO NOT BUY IT.

I also don't know that I would own a new Maytag with that crooked/tapered rack. We get a lot of complaints about loading things in the bottom rack. We've had to take two out because the owner's plates simply would not fit in the unit. That being said Maytag has put a powerdry option on one of their models, the 8979 that adds fan-assisted drying.

I do like the Whirlpool WDTA50 dishwasher, it blends nicely with any package that I sell, regardless of the manufacture. The Kitchenaids with the Clean Water wash system are going to have a hybrid wash system between the point voyager and whatever they call the new filter system. I say that because it has the larger wash pump but a self cleaning mesh filter system that back flushes like a swimming pool filter. KitchenAid is also adding back fan-assisted drying. The only thing is I don't like how flimsy the tubs are on the new KitchenAids. For a $1k plus dishwasher, it shouldn't feel cheap.

After rebuilding a Frigidaire dishwasher for my mom, and servicing a 7 year old Electrolux, I am really liking their designs. I will say that I probably wouldn't look at the units that have a plastic filter that has the wash arm support in part of the filter assembly. The way those units are designed, all of the debris is swept by the arms to the center of the tub and pushed directly into the wash pump intake. The new units that have the filters away from the wash arms clean much better. They also have inline heaters built into the motors or separate units in the lines. They also have a fan-assisted dry cycle. The new units with the better filters don't have exposed heat elements, so no real heated dry system, just a higher rinse temp. The Electrolux dishwashers have what seem to be some of the sturdiest racks I've ever seen in a dishwasher. IF I didn't have my Miele dishwashers, I would probably purchase an Electrolux dishwasher. I really like the way they are designed. They are heavy and feel solid. They are pretty impressive.

I am not a fan of GE dishwashers. We either have a lot of control panels go out or everyone seems to snap the latch sensor arms off their dishwashers.

LG dishwashers were a dud because we had a lot of failures early on and didn't have great support from the distributor. The distributor changed, but so did warranty processes and we ABSOLUTELY hate working with LG to get warranty claims through.

Samsung... The water wall dishwashers are growing on me.... I don't like their dishwashers that aren't water wall and its mainly because they aren't built by Samsung.

We sell a lot of Asko dishwashers in our other store, but thats because the lady that pushes them there has one and she thinks the same thing about them as I do Miele.

As far as budget goes, if it was absolutely necessary to stay under the $500 limit, I would probably say go with a whirlpool/amana. You aren't going to find something better for less.

To the longevity thing... That is all in a matter of how you take care of your appliances. If you check the filters regularly, use the hottest cycle often enough and don't OVER SOAP the machines, they should last a long time. They say cleaning power and cleanability is a trifecta, so is machine maintenance. Don't do something that will over tax the system on a regular basis, don't do something that will cause buildup of debris or detergent, and keep things hygienic (let things air out and clean parts and surfaces).
 
Would you buy a Bosch dishwasher or other appliance that was built in their New Bern,NC factory-they used to build Bosch power tools there-their tools were top quality.Are the machines ASSEMBLED at the former power tool site using German parts?Its like the idea of Miele vacuum cleaners "assembled" in China from German parts-S3 series vacuums.
 
So its insane to use old appliances???

Well, I'm cooking on a 58 year old Westinghouse, washing clothes and drying them on 35 plus year old Hotpoints, my dishwasher is mid 80s....If I can get a hold of a 60s Kitchen Aid I will use that instead and I'm looking for a 50s or early 60s Westinghouse fridge to replace the 8 year old POS Hotpoint....I guess I'm ready for the asylum!!LOL....Oh yeah, I made a cake last week and mixed it in a 1957 Westinghouse stand mixer!
 
I have NO USE for any new

Appliances, all my experiences with them have been bad!My NEW stereo is a 1965 GE,I play only vinyl, none of that new stuff for me, If I had a repair man close by there would be a round tube color tv in my living room....I could go on and on!
 
Bosch

I have a Bosch Logixx from 2003/2004, stainless steel tub. Generally, it cleans okay - but the alternating spray arm spraying pattern I think, is somewhat lacklustre. Tannin stains from tea and coffee seem to be rather difficult for this machine to remove. I had noted grease collected around the underside plastic lip of the central cylindrical filter. The corrugated transfer tube from water matrix to the tub, can be a problem area on this era of machine as grease and gunk can accumulate in it.

I've replaced the spray arms twice - first time was because the upper spray arm had a slightly different hole pattern which wasn't cleaning debris from the plates. Second time was because the arms were simply worn out (wobbling, clattering against the basket).

I replaced the complete dispenser assembly a couple of years ago, as the rinse-aid was pouring out. The rinse-aid dispenser plunger seal itself was not serviceable.

And the salt reservoir lid needed renewing too, it had simply cracked through time.

My mum has the 2013 bottom range Bosch - with plastic tub base and steel tub walls. It is noisier than mine but cleans very, very well indeed with a much more sensible alternating arm spray pattern. Grease build-up around the filter is not a problem. I do like this machine - yes, it's slightly flimsier than mine - but the performance exceeds that of mine.

Having had a look at other Bosch UK customers' online reviews, it appears a few have previously had a top end model which they weren't particularly happy with. Then they went 'bottom of line' Bosch and found more noise, less features, but good cleaning.
 
this topic seems to be a loaded question of sorts.....

and a lot of factors to consider....

between one machine being better than another....

a normally great machine could be troublesome, while a lesser rated machine could really perform well...

it also depends when picking an older or vintage machine, what condition is it in to start with....

granted a number of us have found some low use machines.....as well as ones still in the box, unused for decades...

and whats your mechanical knowledge or background to maintain it yourself...
 
You need to chill out...

New appliances are "NEW" and old one's are "OLD". Why would ANYONE want an appliance that is over 10 years old as a daily driver is INSANE!

I wouldn't have seen that post had so many members not marked it as offensive, thank you all for doing that.

As for you Bruce, thanks for insulting a large portion of the membership here. If it wasn't for many of us using 10 to 70 year old major appliances as daily drivers, this website you're spouting out on wouldn't even exist.

Personally almost all my daily drivers are 50+ years old along, does that make me insane too? I do have a few token 21st century models, but that's mainly for the novelty and rarely use them. None of them are so much better in performance than the best of the vintage machines.

You have the nerve to tell someone "Nope, wrong on all counts", when it's clear to most of us here that your "all counts" is nothing more than your opinion, not fact. You really lose us when you talk about vintage KitchenAid dishwashers being anything less than stellar in the performance department, those of us that use them daily know better. You may have had one bad experience, that was totally valid but that doesn't make it so for the rest of us.

I've seen you post things that are clearly wrong, questionable or blown way out of proportion to make your point on machines I and many others are currently using. There is no proof in long ago memories, there is concrete proof in using the machine the evening before.
 
The Maytag Quiet Series 300 here just had its first part fail today, just about 12 years to the date from when it was first commissioned (just before Thanksgiving 2005). The handle broke, and when I googled "Maytag quiet series 300" just now, a replacement handle was the very first hit.
 
Tolivac,

We didn't really have a lot of issues with Bosch dishwashers until we started installing units made here.

As far as I know, the 800 series and Benchmark Series are still made in Germany. That is generally what we sell because we haven't had a lot of issues over the years with them.
 
I happen to have the same Whirlpool dishwasher that the OP asked about. I wanted a basic dishwasher, I have no need for specialized cycles. I love this dishwasher! It is almost the same as the BOL 91’ Whirlpool dishwasher that was in our kitchen when we first moved here. I only use the 1 hour cycle with heated dry and it takes exactly 60 mins for the wash cycle the end and another 18-20 mins for the dry cycle the end, so each load is done in about 80 mins. I only rinse the cereal/salad bowls and pot/pans, but everything else goes in like it left the table/stove. I run it everyother day, so the food gets a chance to dry on things. Everything always comes out clean and dry. Only items with indentations that hold water will need a slight pass of a dishtowel to dry.

I wish the racks were nylon, and not vinyl, but otherwise this is a great buy for the money.
Eddie
 
Still on F&P dishdrawers here, dating back to 2003. Little maintenance required mainly because of simple and practical filter design. I also mostly use longest, hottest cycle which keeps everything clean. Every couple of months I take out the filter plates to check underneath and I have a good look at the wash arms. In all the years nothing has ever lodged itself inside the wash arms.

I think most people experience problems when they primarily use eco-cycles that use less water and lower temps. I've never once had to buy a dishwasher cleaner or deodorizer, ever.

From 1988 until '99 I had a GSD 2800 with soft food waste disposal. A small soft rubber plug sat inside the wash assembly below the bottom wash arm. It disintegrated over time and that did affect wash performance until it got fixed. However, the filter system never required any interventions. When I finally had to replace that machine I took the filter assembly apart and it was as clean as a whistle. [this post was last edited: 11/6/2017-21:18]
 
oops

While extolling the longevity of my 2001 Bosch 300 series DW earlier in this thread, I mentioned "no service issues ever". This is true, but I had to do one "repair": had some tines and crossbars on lower basket that began to rust through, so I replaced the lower basket via repairclinic.com. They no longer make the OEM 300 basket, so I bought a current 500 series basket which fit perfectly. It was also a bit of an upgrade, in that I now have a more flexible flatware basket, plus a handle in front of the basket to pull it forward (less stooping).

I had fixed the ends of some of the tines with a repair cap kit, but threw in the towel once the crossbars began to rust. Rust is no friend of DW pumps.

That said, I have now invested $175 in "repairs". Were it to need a major repair, I'd consider getting a new one.
 
I see, I was not the only person who got ticked off .

Nobody will ever tell me that vintage Kitchen aid dishwashers suck and if they do will they can go to hell.

I have had 5 or more and they all have been by far the best performing machines I have used.

I have a 8 year old Smeg dishwasher and it has been good no problems at all and its Made in Italy.

I also have a G.E. 1200 Pot-scrubber dishwasher that is probably around 24 years old.

They both have these Orbital wash arms. The Smeg is set up like the Frigidare Orbit wash

and the G.E. has two small arms attached to the end of the main arm with the tower and it washes like hell.

That G.E. is rare I cant find parts for it at all hardly but when it works it is a hell of a machine..

 
 
Vintage Dishwashers, especially Potscrubber and KA

We have had several KA, both the real Hobart and the, well, Whirlpool version.

Our 15 (portable) does clean extraordinarily well and is all original. It, like all vintage KA dishwashers, demands considerable attention to detail in loading. I've figured out through the years how to load both racks such that everything comes out spotless - but I will not pretend for one second that it's fun or remotely like loading a RR Maytag or any Potscrubber or vintage Miele.

In the remotest.

As to the other KAs (the real ones, not the Whirlpools), yeah, well, OK, it's like this. Yes, they use very good components and great enamel. With the occasional exception of upside down dispensers (I'll never grasp that one if I live to be 400 years old) they were very well thought out.

But - they still required enormous effort to load right in order to get things clean. Yes, if you did it right, they worked perfectly. But, please, guys and gals - don't pretend you have the freedom in just throwing things into one such as a Twenty-Eight Hundred offers. Even Consumer Reports, who automatically crowned KA Queen of everything, admitted that. Through clinched teeth.

Nothing I've ever used matches an RR Maytag for flexibility, followed closely by a Potscrubber with multi-orbital arm (when a whirligig works, that, too).

OK, so the whole durability thing. Here's where we get into discussions. I think it's perfectly fair for me, a dude who replaces appliances used in (now) over 100 rentals regularly to compare and contrast. The BOL AMANA which Whirlpool has had on the market for some time now just plain hold up as well as do the extra specially expensive BOSCH and the TOL Whirlpool stuff. The mechanical Hotpoint/GEs last forever, but their cleaning performance was castrated by the decision to shrink the water level below their designed capabilities (which were not adjusted.) Throw an extra 2 liters of hot water into the wash cycle of a new Potscrubber (yes, I know they don't call them that anymore, but they are) at the beginning of the cycle and, wow! It'll clean enormously better.

 

I loved my Mieles in Germany. They were outstanding. I love my Potscrubbers here because of two reasons:

1) I refuse, absolutely refuse to prerinse or prescrub.

2) You can just throw stuff in and it comes out clean without spending half an hour checking the photos (yes, I did) you made up showing the 'keep-out' zones and placements you need to get equally clean dishes out of a real KA.

 

As to Whirlpool - there's no questions about it, their design really and truly has reached the point where they work and work well. I'll never be a fan of them, but a dishwasher which can stand up in a rental for five to seven years is a good machine. 
 
New-vs-old

I'd purchased a Kenmore elite dishwasher 5 yrs ago, to replace my 94 kenmore ultra wash dishwasher, I hated the new one.... took over an hr in pots and pans, dishes would not get clean, nothing was dry, I won't leave any appliance running when either not home or going to bed, I got a KDI-18 a few years ago, it's the BEST dishwasher I've ever had !!!! 20 minutes in the normal cycle everything is washed and CLEAN, another 30-40 everything is dry.... an added plus is I like the sound it makes when washing..... like that of sitting in the back section of a plane... great dishwasher !!!
 

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