Kenmore washer infinite water level question

[classiccaprice]

So I've been using my 1968 Kenmore 800 washer that I brought back from Ohio a few weeks back.  (Thanks again, carmine.)  I noticed when I first ran it that the infinite water level switch was off.  Thanks to Dave (Volvoguy87), I figured how how to adjust that so that when the washer was filled to maximum water level it filled to the top row of holes in the tub.  However, when I ran it again on the lowest water level it filled to the third row of holes from the top of the tub.  Is there really only supposed to be about an inch difference between the highest and lowest water levels?  What could be the problem?

 

[kenmore71]

In my experience there is less difference than you would expect in terms of High to Low on these machines.  However, that seems like less difference than should be normal!  The only way to know for CERTAIN what the water levels should be would be to fill the tub manually with a known quantity of water (say a 2 gallon pail) and note where it is when it gets to 13, 15 & 17 gallons.  Here is the chart of water levels that the 1968 800 series was supposed to use:

 

[classiccaprice]

Thanks Mark!

 

[yogitunes]

for machines I have come across that don't show much of a variation between Lo and Hi.....I have taken a dremel tool to the wheel/cloverleaf on the back to make my own adjustments of water levels to where I wanted them to be set at.....

once Hi was set, I would go from there for smaller levels.....usually 1/4, 1/2, 3/4 and Full...perspectively....just take your time and keep it smooth so it slides with ease...sometimes you can add small notches for increments...

 

[classiccaprice]

Interesting idea...

Thanks Martin!

 

[danemodsandy]

One Possible Explanation....

....Is that the machine is working as designed.

If you'll look at Mark's copy of the fill setting instructions, you'll see that the difference between HI and LO is only four gallons, which isn't exactly major.

I wish I could remember more about my grandmother's 800, but I confess that I didn't get much chance to see the machine in action; Mama Mac didn't much care for anyone underfoot when she was working her magic on clothes. She was the sort of kindly lady who could make "Now, shoo!" sound affectionate, but when she said it, you bloomin' well shooed.

 

[70series]

The height of the water level on Lo sounds about right, but on Hi it should reach higher than the top row of holes, as that is more of a medium height. It sounds like it is not filling high enough on the maximum water level. It does happen that when a Kenmore ages, the water height sometimes decreases at least on the maximum level. I cannot speak to the number of gallons that each level should have, but from a visual standpoint it should fill higher than the top row as even a standard capacity washer has solid tub space between the holes and the tub ring.

 

[mrb627]

Water Level and

The self cleaning filter. The water level is kept at that higher level for the side mounted filter operation I suspect. Add to that the splash factor with those glorious agitators would force an inevitable suds lock...

Malcolm

 

[frigilux]

There was a similar discussion about this a few months ago. I grew up with a 1960 Kenmore Model 80 (waterfall filter), and owned a 1959 Lady Kenmore (with self-cleaning filter). Both had quite a difference between LO and HI water level settings.

If I'm recalling the previous discussion correctly, the higher LO came into being around 1963, partly to reduce the wild splashing created by the Roto-Swirl agitator at the LO setting, and especially during suds return. Later models used a slow agitation speed during suds return.

Due to the unprotected location of the tub light on the '59 and '60 Kenmores, it was common for the splashing water (at LO level) to hit and burst the light bulb. A serviceman finally attached a foil sheet in front of the bulb on our Model 80, but that dulled the beautifully bright light going into the tub, so I tore out the foil sheet and simply kept a supply of 40-watt appliance bulbs in the house.

 

[yogitunes]

for a RotoSwirl, a LO setting was just at the top of the vanes, that about sounds right for most any Kenmore/Whirlpool setup....even my FilterFlos small setting was originally 2/3rds full......it always seemed too much for a small load that I wanted to wash...

but I think this more fell on the average consumer of using a LO setting, and still adding enough clothes for 1/2 load....then you run into compaints of clothing damage....so most manufactureres were covering their ass

and the variable settings wasn't variable enough......it wasn't until the mini-wash, or KenWhirls came out with the ExLO setting that it started to be really flexible in my book....

now take something like a 1-18....now there you had variables, the lowest of LO and highest if HI....

so when worst came to worst......I had to do it myself, first adjusting the HI to where I wanted it, and then started with the cloverleaf, and adjust each level down

 

[mickeyd]

Cloverleaf and dremel--maybe I'm ready :->

I mastered your other trick of turning the flume back on the FF's. Can this next trick be far behind?

Hello Gentlemen! When I got the Lady K, during the very first fill which was naturally a "LO," I stood there mystified and impatient at how far up the tub it was filling and how long it took for agitation to commence. You've got to be kidding! LO is just about HI. NO NO NO LO for me. This won't do at all.

Then it was only a while before I discovered the hidden, no-water-required, four minute wash in the dead space on the dial where Suds would have been on Suds-equipped models.
Thereafter, I filled to a "real" low level and used the four minute wash, redialing or not, or soaking depending on the load. Much dial play and lots of fun.

The Norge 20's also had genuine, very low water level selections equaled only by the 1-18's, but exceeded by my 90 year old friend Jasper's Whirlpool with a Hand Wash water level marking, and that's about as low as I've ever seen. Plan to thread his vintage washer and Amana dryer some day soon. Have not seen either model here or anywhere before.
Fun to come.

Happy Labor Day Weekend, Guys.

 

[yogitunes]

I want to know how you make out with the dremel Mickey, always having you starting new things...but have to admit, it changes your mind!....and I got you thinking outside the box...

I discovered Kenmores LO setting just to the top of the Rotoswirl's vanes a long time ago....decades in fact....I was doing odd jobs and cleaning for one guy.....who was a heavy equipment mechanic = greasy workclothes......and he wondered how I got them spot less compared to when he washed them way before I came along.....at a HI level, wash action was mediocre at best, but at the LO setting, given the right temps/cycles, and a heavy dose of detergent, grease didn't have a chance against that scrubbing action....

from there on, most any Kenmore I came along, I washed on LO setting half loads, and people could not understand how their clothes were now cleaner.....and they thought I was using a special detergent....

play with the cycles as you did, and you could create your own Kelvinator Magic Minute concentrate of detergent lather.....usually 8 or so minutes of that, then increase the water level for the last 6 minutes and a deep rinse.....its a great recipe for many stains...

Thats what I really liked about a Speed Queen solidtub with timed fill......add the water and detergent as needed, toss in some clothes and let them scrub away......add more water for the overflo.......best results always...

I can see the smoke comming out of Mickey's ears now!.....he's on to something

 

[kenmoreguy64]

Kenmore water levels

Typically in the 1960s and much of the 1970s, standard capacity Kenmores were filled with 18 gallons of water for the 'high' water level, about 14 for 'medium', and 11 for 'low', which as noted above produces quite a noticeable difference between the lowest and highest settings.

James is correct that on 'High', or "Hi" as KM usually calls it, the water level rises to about two inches above the top row of basket perfs.

I have been accumulating a collection of KM owner's manuals from many models, and have been surprised to find machines with alternate filling settings, as Mark has pointed out up at the early part of this thread. Some Vari-Flex and especially Roto-Flex equipped models usually have modified fill levels. Models seem to have the same 18 gallons for HI on the Roto-Flex but with a MUCH smaller gap between low and hi. I think this is to add enough distance above all those agitator vanes on the Roto-Flex. I have noticed similar differences with the Vari-Flex but also noticed lower maximum fill heights on that one. I have never seen a published variation from the 11 - 14 - 18 settings on any Roto-Swirl or Straight-Vane equipped models, not yet anyway.

I have also noticed many times as James mentioned above that many pressure switches in KMs (and thus Whirlpools too I would assume) over time can come out of calibration, which I've always found as filling too low. This is better than the alternative of them filling higher as they age I think.

In this machine's case, if it were mine I would be curious to know if the pressure switch in the machine is the correct one for the model. With so many parts which appear inter-changeable in KMs over the years, the cost of a new pressure switch, the age of the machine, and the scarce nature of available linear sliders like this one, I see a chance that the switch in this machine came from a Vari-Flex model and it has lost its calibration a bit?

If its the right switch (Getting the switch's part number from Sears' website would help) then it simply has become out of adjustment. Since the '65 800 was equipped with a Roto-Swirl, its maximum fill height should be approximately 2 inches above the top basket holes / perfs.

I hope this helps a bit.

Gordon

 

[classiccaprice]

Bucket fill test

10 gallons... This is close to where I expected low

 

[classiccaprice]

13 gallons... Actual low

 

[classiccaprice]

15 gallons

Medium

 

[classiccaprice]

17 gallons

High... I guess it wasn't that far off before, but golly that's a lot of water

 

[classiccaprice]

Side note. The light has gone batty. It's not the starter capsule, nor is it the bulb, as I've checked both. Where is the cheapest place to get a transformer for these... Anyone have the specs I should look for?