New Old Stock - Kitchenaid KD-12P - first steps?

[frecklpwr]

Hi knowledgeable folk,

I really lucked out and picked up a never-been-used Kitchenaid KD-12P dishwasher. I’ve brought her home and am starting to evaluate what needs fixing. I want to plug the drain and let it sit with hot water to figure out where the seal leaks are. Since nothing has ever been plugged in or plumbed, any tips on how to test the motor and cycles once it is water-tight? Which seals do you recommend focusing on and replacing?

Not that we are anywhere near ready to install it, but I’ve also run into the issue that the flooring in my kitchen was updated to hardwood and the space under the counter is 3/4” shy of what I need to slide the dishwasher into place. Our modern POS washer has the bottom feet and wheels removed to fit it in. That is not an option on this unit. We may fabricate a shorter base to weld on while we wait out the llong-term goal of remodeling the kitchen around our vintage appliances.

I appreciate the historical posts about this machine and hope to add my experience and what I learn to the archives. Thank you for any advice you have to share.

 

[appnut]

Christina, WOW!! Thank you for posing the questions and providing the pictures. I think we'd all love to hear the story behind this wonderful, beautiful find.

 

[rollermatic]

beautiful machine

would love to see pics of inside.

if it's never been used it should be a good shape i would think. what we usually do is put some hot water in tub, enough to cover bottom of sump so the motor seal can soak a few minutes before starting it up. i do this on all my machines after not using them for a few months or years.

i have 2 of these and also a 14 model, i can tell you that pump seals are no longer available. i bought the last ones here in ohio about 10 years ago and they told me at hobart that there were only several more left around the country at that time. i also read on this site a few years ago that now there are none available.

but again if the machine has never been used then hopefully the seal will be like new and last a long time, years! that is the main seal to worry about. it keeps water out of the motor and from leaking out around the motor shaft.

its either a gravity drain or a pump model, i have one of each. gravity drain means a valve opens and the water just flows out of the drain line. pumped models will use a seperate pump to pump the water out of machine, seperate in that it is not the same pump that circulates the water thru the spray arm. again since it is new i would hope that the drain valve and/or drain pump would also be in great shape.

i just use all my old machines occasionally, rotating them but then i have about 40 old dishwashers, both built ins and portables. i have a late model maytag i use as my main daily machine so as not to put too much usage on my old ones as again parts can be hard to find or impossible. i will say these old kitchenaids really throw some water around! i always have a lot of fun with mine when i bring one out of storage and install it under the counter for another season of use.

have fun with yours and hopefully again it will run like new and last a long time for you!

 

[frecklpwr]

History

Thanks for the warm welcome! Yeah, I realize what a unicorn I found and am super excited to get it functioning. The seller was a general contractor who pulled this from a 1950’s kitchen he was hired to remodel. His wife thought the dishwasher was too unique to trash and saved it. I can only imagine what other awesome finds were in that kitchen that didn’t catch his wife’s eye. The original owner was an elderly German woman who never liked the idea of dishwashing machines and preferred to wash by hand. Amazingly, the dishwasher was installed in her home new and she never even took out the contents. The interior is cosmetically pristine. The exterior has the light wear of just living in a kitchen for 60+ years. We were the first to unseal and remove the boxed impeller and owners manual today — crazy! I can’t even keep myself from opening random Amazon boxes my husband orders. I can’t imagine not even peeking at the innards of a machine for decades. The contractor held into the machine in storage for five more years until posting it for sale last week.

With the pressure of it starting out in such good condition, I’m worried about starting it up cold and harming something by not priming it all properly. Im so thankful for any help

 

[rollermatic]

sometimes i even

flip my machines over and hand turn the motor just to make sure the motor turns freely and the pump seal isn't frozen as i call it. i have had that happen a few times where after sitting it binds up and it takes a bit more force for me to break the motor loose. that's why a lot of us soak the seal in hot water for a good 10 minutes or so before starting the machine. i do this everytime i hook up a dishwasher that i haven't used for say 6 mos. or so.

but i just looked at an extra motor i have for those 12 models and the bottom of the motor is sealed so you can't get to it to hand turn it.

you could remove the bottom rack and the big blue cast iron spray arm and take the screws out of the top of the pump and remove top pump cover. then you would be looking down on the wash impeller itself and that could be hand turned to make sure motor turns freely. obviously don't attempt to remove anything else like the wash pump impeller itself. you would only be wanting to turn the impeller to make sure it moves freely.

i also sometimes use wd40 on rubber parts like pump seals and bellows as i have always read that wd40 is good for rubber parts. BUT i am not an expert on that, lets see if any of the other folks comment on that idea.

i do have an old 18 inch wide montgomery ward machine with a motor that gets louder every year due to bearing wear but the pump does not leak! no seals are available anymore and every year i spray a good bit of wd40 in the bottom of the tub around the base of the pump, enought to hit the pump seal. i have had that machine for 10 years and used it last week, not a leak in site.

again lets see what others say here. i would think you would be safe to put hot water in it and soak that seal for 10 minutes and then turn it on. but knowing me and how curious i am about motors and pumps i personally would remove the top of the pump and hand turn that wash impeller a bit just to be sure all is well before wiring it up and turning it on. i would also check the drain valve and solonoid if your model has one and hand operate that also just to make sure it opens and closes freely. but that's just me.

hopefully others will comment too and if i have been wrong about any of this i'm sure i'll hear about it!

 

[frecklpwr]

40 machines?!

Wow! 40 machines that you rotate in and out? That is amazing and it makes me feel less crazy for dragging my husband all over the state to fetch my finds. I’ll be installing this unit as our main machine. We have a ‘52 Philco Fridge and ‘52 O’Keefe and Merrit stove because I got so tired of replacing modern, disposable machines. When our 7 year old dishwasher continued having issues despite replacing defective parts, I began searching for a vintage replacement.

Thanks for the inside information on the Hobart seals. I read somewhere in one of these threads that I may be able to make a replacement seal, if needed, from cork or rubber sheeting - is that truly a possibility? I’m goi g to start polling around while I clean up the undercarriage and prep for testing. Since it needs to be hardwired in, can I add a pigtail to just test it in my garage? How can I test the water features without attaching it to its ultimate water line? If you know of any good videos about testing before installing, I’d love a link. There are more pictures of the interior in my original post. If you would like to see anything in particular, I’ll gladly post more

Thanks,

Christina

 

[chachp]

WOW, a beautiful machine!

 

<span style="font-family: helvetica;">Still amazed at what people are finding out there.  I think you have a model with the pump to pump out water which will make the installation a little easier I would think.  Can't wait to hear how this works for you.  Congrats!!</span>

 

[lotsosudz]

HI, FRECKLPOWR

Hi freckle Power,
Where in California do you reside? I myself live in Elk Grove, Just south of Sacramento.
Hugs,
David

 

[combo52]

Installing A KA KD-12 On A Built-Up Floor

Hi Great find, You can remove all four frame extensions as seen in your photo #6 and use heavy pieces of wood on each side about 3" high and slide the DW on to the rails. I have seen this done.

 

Since you have the misfortune to have hard wood floors in the kitchen I would have a shallow metal pan fabricated to go under the DW to catch any slight leaks now or in the future, you could even put a batter operated leak detector in the pan to alert you to any leaks.

 

These older KA DWs did often leak a little and even a new one this old is likely to leak at some time.

 

If you remove the frame extensions be careful not to rest the weight the DW on the plastic drain pump on the bottom of the motor, it can be broken easily.

 

Keep us posted, it should be really fun to use this New DW, it will be like driving a never driven 1964 Chrysler Newport with a three on the column with the standard 383 engine.  

 

Basic, well built with great performance.

 

John L.

 

[chachp]

Two questions....

 

<ol>
<li><span style="font-family: helvetica;">Did you send in the warranty card?  LOL</span></li>
<li><span style="font-family: helvetica;">Are those boxes of detergent hard as a rock?</span></li>
</ol>
<span style="font-family: helvetica;">Can't wait to see how this works out....</span>

 

[dnastrau]

Re-oil the motor(s)?

Just a quick thought:

What a great find! Should the motor(s) on this dishwasher be taken apart and oiled before use? I am just wondering if the original oil in the bearings and felt wicks would still be OK after all of this time.

Andrew S.

 

[combo52]

Reoiling Motors On a Never Used 50+ YO KA DW

The main motor has sealed ball bearings, so they are hard to oil, The fan motor for drying is an open type motor that could probably benefit from a drop or two of oil on each bearing.

 

John L.

 

[rollermatic]

i don't see

how a pump seal could possibly be fabricated out of cork or rubber. that seal is a ceramic rotary seal that spins with the motor shaft. again, as your machine is basically new it should not be worn.

for the future if this machine ever starts leaking and can't be fixed and you still want a vintage dishwasher i would suggest a later model kitchanaid like an 18-20 series. any needed parts are still out there, i find them on ebay all the time. and the machines themselves are listed on craigslist, ebay, and facebook marketplace.

but for now just enjoy that beautiful machine you have and how about an update on whats going on with it!

enjoy

 

[firedome]

Wow what a find!

it's amazing to see a brand new "Cast-Iron-Wonder"! Some really amazing old NOS is still out there! About 7 yrs ago we found NOS 1955 Chambers "In-A-Wall" wall oven in Copper, stored and never used in a deceased couple's garage at their lakeside vacation house, with all it's packing material and manuals still inside, as was true here. It was finally installed last year for the first time in our son's new house kitchen, and it's the center of attention there for sure, with the correct matching gas cooktop that was finally found used.

The advice to soak in hot water is good, I'd make it really hot and let it set for an hour or more, watch out for leaks just due to gravity first. Not sure if any additive like a v mild dish detergent or something else would be a good thing?

 

[rolls_rapide]

I like the way Kitchenaid has no allegiance to just one 'recommended' detergent - they've effectively 'thrown in the kitchen sink' with three decent sized samples - and included vouchers for a fourth brand!

You never see that these days - in fact you're damned lucky to get a couple of sample pods with a modern machine.

Well done!