Is it just me or does the Kirby Dual Sanitronic 50 and my new Royal have too much in common to be a coincidence? They both take the EXACT same bag..... (Kirby left, Royal right)
Seems a little too coincidental....
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The connection for the bags is the EXACT same.... (Kirby left, Royal right)
And they just happen to be the same height, the brush rolls are the same width and they're overall shape seems more alike than just style...
hoover1060
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its called BOJAK
your Kirby Has a bojak conversion bag on it... Royal type A bags are the same as Eureka F & G
your Kirby Has a bojak conversion bag on it... Royal type A bags are the same as Eureka F & G
Oh, you're reading too much into it; they aren't alike at all.
(much LOL here)
(much LOL here)
it sounds so...
Define BOJACK, please.
Define BOJACK, please.
yes, DO .....LOL
Another thread has me MIGHTY curious! LOL
Another thread has me MIGHTY curious! LOL
"Bojack" means a non-genuine replacement part.The bag on your Kirby isn't a genuine Kirby bag.Its a DVC type replacement-I have one as well-its on one of my Dual 80's They are a good way to convert older Kirbys to use disposable bags.-but at a sacrifice in performance-the airflow has to force the dirt thru the flexible bag tube and paper bag tube.I have noted a decline in performance when I use mine.How new is Your Royal?I don't beleive on current Royal models they use Type "A" or F&G bags.They have gone to "B" bags-these fit on a plastic feed tube in the cloth bag-much like the newer Kirby bags.The "B" bag doesn't have the paper feed tube like the "A" bag or "F&G" bags. The Royal "B" bags give better performance-no paper bag tube to clog or cause more resistence to the airflow.
cloth bags
Our Hamilton Beach upright vacuum from the late 40s/early 50s, had a bag that was sort of a blue-purple color and had a metal collar at the bottom to twist lock it onto two pegs, I guess. At the top there was a metal piece with a channel through it hanging from a spring and after the bag was removed, shaken, beaten and otherwise forced to give up the dirt, the top of the bag was folded over once or twice and slipped into the metal piece. I also remember that it was a very bad thing to squeeze or hit the bag at any time it was in the house. I'm sure it trapped very little by today's, or maybe even that day's standards.
Our Hamilton Beach upright vacuum from the late 40s/early 50s, had a bag that was sort of a blue-purple color and had a metal collar at the bottom to twist lock it onto two pegs, I guess. At the top there was a metal piece with a channel through it hanging from a spring and after the bag was removed, shaken, beaten and otherwise forced to give up the dirt, the top of the bag was folded over once or twice and slipped into the metal piece. I also remember that it was a very bad thing to squeeze or hit the bag at any time it was in the house. I'm sure it trapped very little by today's, or maybe even that day's standards.
hoover1060
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BOJAK
is any non-original part to the machine. Toli described it as parts not made by the cleaner manufacturer, and I have even heard some describe it as any parts not original to the machine...
Such as Roberts coin-op Unimatic with the deep action agitator.
The term was originally coined by The Hoover company. Since they had the first revolving brush cleaner, everyone who later had a revolving brush was a BOJAK.
Hope this helps
Jeff
is any non-original part to the machine. Toli described it as parts not made by the cleaner manufacturer, and I have even heard some describe it as any parts not original to the machine...
Such as Roberts coin-op Unimatic with the deep action agitator.
The term was originally coined by The Hoover company. Since they had the first revolving brush cleaner, everyone who later had a revolving brush was a BOJAK.
Hope this helps
Jeff
hooverwheelaway
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The Bojack...
I had previously posted this on another thread, but here it goes again...
This is the definition of "Bojack" as written in the book "Fabulous Dustpan, the Story of the Hoover" by Frank G. Hoover.
The "Bojack" is a tough, worthy, dedicated opponent. He is usually fair, but hard boiled. He makes a good product. He wants to make money. He is used to weighing the risks and is he is willing to pay the price. If you beat him, there will be no whimpering, but if he wins, he'll press his advantage.
He is an enemy, and yet he is the great benefactor of mankind. You see, "Bojack" is the nickname that grew up in the Hoover Company for all competitive vacuum cleaners.
Whatever business you're in, you've got to fight the "Bojack."
I, and other collectors I know, tend to use the word moreso as a definition for generic/aftermarket parts--bags, cords, switches, etc.
-Fred
I had previously posted this on another thread, but here it goes again...
This is the definition of "Bojack" as written in the book "Fabulous Dustpan, the Story of the Hoover" by Frank G. Hoover.
The "Bojack" is a tough, worthy, dedicated opponent. He is usually fair, but hard boiled. He makes a good product. He wants to make money. He is used to weighing the risks and is he is willing to pay the price. If you beat him, there will be no whimpering, but if he wins, he'll press his advantage.
He is an enemy, and yet he is the great benefactor of mankind. You see, "Bojack" is the nickname that grew up in the Hoover Company for all competitive vacuum cleaners.
Whatever business you're in, you've got to fight the "Bojack."
I, and other collectors I know, tend to use the word moreso as a definition for generic/aftermarket parts--bags, cords, switches, etc.
-Fred
brettsomers
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about the paper dirt ube
i have a royal 880. i noticed the airflow was not what i expected. the vinyl sewn piece that joins the bag ring to the fill tube was the problem. the bag setup on my 880 is just like Pulsators. the vinyl/cloth "throat" has sagged with age and narrowed the passageway considerably. this was choking the airflow. the construction looks the same on the bojak kirby cloth bag. the rigid tube is also smaller on these style bags than the Eureka made assemblies. ive used many eureka uprights that use f&g bags and have never found the paper fill tube portion of the bag to be inefficient. David
i have a royal 880. i noticed the airflow was not what i expected. the vinyl sewn piece that joins the bag ring to the fill tube was the problem. the bag setup on my 880 is just like Pulsators. the vinyl/cloth "throat" has sagged with age and narrowed the passageway considerably. this was choking the airflow. the construction looks the same on the bojak kirby cloth bag. the rigid tube is also smaller on these style bags than the Eureka made assemblies. ive used many eureka uprights that use f&g bags and have never found the paper fill tube portion of the bag to be inefficient. David
Brettsomers:Go to a Royal dealer and get a "B" outerbag and some "B" disposable bags-you will note a difference!1I have tried it.I have a few B type bags and try them on older Royal machines-If you want to save the old "A" org bag for show-and then use the "B" bag to use.I did find the "F&G" bags helpful to convert older Hoovers from their "C" bags to "F&G" bags-they do work better-a "Bojack" improvement in that case.Plus its easier to find the "F&G" bags.Hoover "C" is getting harder to find.
hoover1060
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Royal B bags
I have a Royal 2028 from 2002 that uses the B bags, excellent bag system, and the cleaner really keeps its suction!
I have a Royal 2028 from 2002 that uses the B bags, excellent bag system, and the cleaner really keeps its suction!
air-waycharlie
Well-known member
Convert the bag!
Yes! Follow toli's instructions and convert that bottom fill bag on the 880 to the much better top fill. I have a Royal 886 and plan to do it to it.
Also, about 1 to 2 years ago, Royal came out with a MUCH better brushroll. It has 4 brushstrips with "stiffeners" to keep the brushes from flaying out. It also seems the nylon is much more aggressive too. I think the motor needs to be 6 amp or higher to use the new brushroll.
Your Dual 50 will clean much better with the original sani-emptor and cloth bag. I use the bojack version on mine since I use it frequently and don't want to deal with getting cat hair out of the cloth bag. The Classic III with the cloth bag also moves more air than my Omega with a mini-emptor and Legend II outer cloth bag.
I guess Kirby did know what they were doing by using the original cloth bags pre bojack days!
Yes! Follow toli's instructions and convert that bottom fill bag on the 880 to the much better top fill. I have a Royal 886 and plan to do it to it.
Also, about 1 to 2 years ago, Royal came out with a MUCH better brushroll. It has 4 brushstrips with "stiffeners" to keep the brushes from flaying out. It also seems the nylon is much more aggressive too. I think the motor needs to be 6 amp or higher to use the new brushroll.
Your Dual 50 will clean much better with the original sani-emptor and cloth bag. I use the bojack version on mine since I use it frequently and don't want to deal with getting cat hair out of the cloth bag. The Classic III with the cloth bag also moves more air than my Omega with a mini-emptor and Legend II outer cloth bag.
I guess Kirby did know what they were doing by using the original cloth bags pre bojack days!
I beleive Royal came out with the "Brush Stiffner" rolls about 10 years ago-Its right you need to use those on a Royal with a 5A or greater motor.The lower amp motor will overheat,and wear belts faster.Its still amazing how well those older Royals do(pre "Stiffner" days) with their 2.5-4.5A motors compared to the clean air 10A-12A monsters today.The Royal will constantly outlcean those.royal,Kirbys,and most other "direct air" vacs work on high airflow rather than suction "pressure" to clean.I do like the Kirby vac bag system today-"G" sreies machines-the closed "Mini-Emptor" and the big bore bag fill tube-no clogging or resisting airflow there-Kirbys Engineers did that one well.And with their new "Filtrete" bags-hard to beat-I just so wish Royal or some "Bojack" outfit will make Filtrete bags for both A and B bag Royals.Make a great vac even better like the Kirby.also someone should come out with Filtrete bags for those Royal "tank-Torpedo" vacs to use in their cloth bags-SUPER!Royal-Plese oh-please bring back those metal tanks-discontinue the present 18Lb turkey machine.The disadvantge of the Kirby Sani-emptors" is the gaskets on those fail over the years-causing dust leakage-thats was why many Vac salesmen used the "photo flash" hand held light to show the dust leakage of those.If their gaskets are good-than they are OK.gives you both worlds-bagged and bagless vac.Just remember to empty the dump the bag after each use to prevent odors and prolong the life of the cloth bag.I prefer to detach mine and take it to the trash can for dumping-the Kirby method of the newspapers is too messy.You wouldn't dump your Dyson that way!
