kenmoreguy89
Well-known member
Well...I am not totally sure that the gas tankless of old had such a limitation themselves because of their "old" nature, after all run them for 5 mins to fill a tub or 15 to take a long shower doesnt change anything in the functioning, but you're right on this point, since many were not vented outside, oh by the way, it's not a case that here water heaters are called "scaldabagno" (word still used today to refer to a water heater whenever tankless or not gas or electric) which translated is "bath heaters" not water heaters, this is because initially for many folks they were what made their bath hot (they were not used in kitchens as it was already much to have one in the bathroom)... anyway the gas were the most common and these units as said were often used for short time like filling a tub, then air the room etc...to go for a long shower without limitations you needed to have a venting outside or chimney and because of their nature of condo/apts it was not always possible, some who had the space opted for electric tanks, but many didn't have the space and used the gas tankless carefully and for short time and whenever gas line didn't reach the room there were always the dear cylinders, lack of a venting reuqired attention and it was not to die of carbon monoxide poisoning...which was so common back then when these units including gas stoves (not cooking stoves but to heat the air) were used...
Sidearm:
The way modern apartments like mine got and still get their hot water is not really that different, in this condo (a series of 5 identical 9 floors buildings) we have a common insta boiler with a supprt heated tank, the main heater ran with oil till recently, now modified to gas.. the tank has a pump to ensure water recirculation inside the "sending" piping to avoid that water in low demand hours and cold months (overnight) to get cool inside the long pipeline that there's from the boiler/furnace located in building 3, I am in the 4 and so it will recirculate again and again back again in the heated support tank... as said now the whole thing was changed to run with gas, as is the furnace who runs radiators (same unit with burner modified) gas is sure cheaper than oil and so are doing almost everybody, our system things has the same sidearm setting, 1 for each side of every building, 2 for building...so 10 pipes giving water to 5 units all coming back to the same tank under pressure.
Our condo like many in Italy was made in around mid 70s which was the era of the condos boom and when most of apartments complexes (born as complexes) were made...
During the time they started realizing that maybe common water heater was not the way to go, too many problems, leaks etc, people on high floors not receiving it hot enough, different requirements of hotness by different people with different habits, and not for last, too much heat dispersion in pipes, so about late 70s more like 80s actually you started having new condos furnished with individual tankless for hot water.... (one for every apt)
The same was starting to happen also in some "historical-older-downtown" buildings.. space was and is precious and tankless was the way to go vs a tank, but will tell more later...
You find many condos of the 70s like mine using common heaters and with this sidearm system and to change to our own heater has really a crazy cost...
Anyway...retruning talking about the old heater thing:
The thing of an heater for every room applied for older buildings as said, like ones made in 10s 20s 30s 40s and 50s.........or even much before...
Some of these (when the inhabitants had the money) went through a renovation/retrefitting and have had hot piping made around the 70s, but before, they still and mostly had the tankless in every room to go with...
Many single homes the same, we have had a large amount of Liberty homes "villette" in this town (even more back then) and if you visit one empty since the 60s you can still spot heaters in every bathroom, just ones who went through a deep renovation in the 70s do have hot water lines..
Also, the heater in every room/ point of need applied to the many buildings who weren't born as apartments, like schools institutions like convents, libraries etc....and so where it was not really possible to make an hot piping out of the blue...not for cheap for sure...
It must be said that often missed the money to went through a deep renovation/retrofitting and install this piping was unlikely because of the target of people these older buildings were destinated" to initially ...now, well now of course it's not like before and many of these older buildings, let alone single homes, went through renovations and got hot water lines installed, but in the 60s and 70s many, perhaps the majority still had to "upgrade" in this sense...
Most of people who lived in the typical "centro storico" -"old downtowns" were modest families....many of these people were former farmers etc that became "working class" employed in factories during the economical boom, these people by working managed to put away enough savings in about decade to manage to leave these older apts and move in the newborn/modern "MOL"-"BOL" complexes of the 70s that were starting popping out like mushrooms, though complexes of this kind (simple complexes) became associated with "working class" (For example the complex i live in is named "arte orafa"- "goldsmith art" since they were meant to become home for all of the employees of jewels factories/laboratories, which is the economic field this towm is centered in, you should have heard about jewels of Valenza) and it's in the 70s infact that the older buildings in the "centri storici" became food for realtors who invested money to restore them and transform these old/ancient and beautiful buildings in luxurious apartments for wealthy folks, the restoration included putting hot pipes and tankless heaters for every apt...
Infact in many cities and towns what were mid class or poor neighborhoods in the past, so the downtown areas, became soon areas for rich folks, the ancient buildings you see now in many centri storici of many towns, maybe also with nice shops here and ther, were transformed to become luxurious buildings and places for wealthy folks, thinking in many cases they were just the opposite in the 50s and 60s sounds almost impossible....
In apartments made from mid 80s and 90s, you won't find any common heater anymore, but tankless placed in balconies and especially in the ones made in the 90s you'll just find tankless all in one furnace+heater...all placed on the balconies....
A typical balcony tankless setting:
[this post was last edited: 12/23/2014-20:21]
Sidearm:
The way modern apartments like mine got and still get their hot water is not really that different, in this condo (a series of 5 identical 9 floors buildings) we have a common insta boiler with a supprt heated tank, the main heater ran with oil till recently, now modified to gas.. the tank has a pump to ensure water recirculation inside the "sending" piping to avoid that water in low demand hours and cold months (overnight) to get cool inside the long pipeline that there's from the boiler/furnace located in building 3, I am in the 4 and so it will recirculate again and again back again in the heated support tank... as said now the whole thing was changed to run with gas, as is the furnace who runs radiators (same unit with burner modified) gas is sure cheaper than oil and so are doing almost everybody, our system things has the same sidearm setting, 1 for each side of every building, 2 for building...so 10 pipes giving water to 5 units all coming back to the same tank under pressure.
Our condo like many in Italy was made in around mid 70s which was the era of the condos boom and when most of apartments complexes (born as complexes) were made...
During the time they started realizing that maybe common water heater was not the way to go, too many problems, leaks etc, people on high floors not receiving it hot enough, different requirements of hotness by different people with different habits, and not for last, too much heat dispersion in pipes, so about late 70s more like 80s actually you started having new condos furnished with individual tankless for hot water.... (one for every apt)
The same was starting to happen also in some "historical-older-downtown" buildings.. space was and is precious and tankless was the way to go vs a tank, but will tell more later...
You find many condos of the 70s like mine using common heaters and with this sidearm system and to change to our own heater has really a crazy cost...
Anyway...retruning talking about the old heater thing:
The thing of an heater for every room applied for older buildings as said, like ones made in 10s 20s 30s 40s and 50s.........or even much before...
Some of these (when the inhabitants had the money) went through a renovation/retrefitting and have had hot piping made around the 70s, but before, they still and mostly had the tankless in every room to go with...
Many single homes the same, we have had a large amount of Liberty homes "villette" in this town (even more back then) and if you visit one empty since the 60s you can still spot heaters in every bathroom, just ones who went through a deep renovation in the 70s do have hot water lines..
Also, the heater in every room/ point of need applied to the many buildings who weren't born as apartments, like schools institutions like convents, libraries etc....and so where it was not really possible to make an hot piping out of the blue...not for cheap for sure...
It must be said that often missed the money to went through a deep renovation/retrofitting and install this piping was unlikely because of the target of people these older buildings were destinated" to initially ...now, well now of course it's not like before and many of these older buildings, let alone single homes, went through renovations and got hot water lines installed, but in the 60s and 70s many, perhaps the majority still had to "upgrade" in this sense...
Most of people who lived in the typical "centro storico" -"old downtowns" were modest families....many of these people were former farmers etc that became "working class" employed in factories during the economical boom, these people by working managed to put away enough savings in about decade to manage to leave these older apts and move in the newborn/modern "MOL"-"BOL" complexes of the 70s that were starting popping out like mushrooms, though complexes of this kind (simple complexes) became associated with "working class" (For example the complex i live in is named "arte orafa"- "goldsmith art" since they were meant to become home for all of the employees of jewels factories/laboratories, which is the economic field this towm is centered in, you should have heard about jewels of Valenza) and it's in the 70s infact that the older buildings in the "centri storici" became food for realtors who invested money to restore them and transform these old/ancient and beautiful buildings in luxurious apartments for wealthy folks, the restoration included putting hot pipes and tankless heaters for every apt...
Infact in many cities and towns what were mid class or poor neighborhoods in the past, so the downtown areas, became soon areas for rich folks, the ancient buildings you see now in many centri storici of many towns, maybe also with nice shops here and ther, were transformed to become luxurious buildings and places for wealthy folks, thinking in many cases they were just the opposite in the 50s and 60s sounds almost impossible....
In apartments made from mid 80s and 90s, you won't find any common heater anymore, but tankless placed in balconies and especially in the ones made in the 90s you'll just find tankless all in one furnace+heater...all placed on the balconies....
A typical balcony tankless setting:
[this post was last edited: 12/23/2014-20:21]
