an oven question for Europe / UK members

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gizmo

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My sister is looking for a new wall oven. Single oven, 600mm wide, it must have a side-opening door which cuts the options down to a very tiny number.

we are looking at a couple, one is Ilve ILO69SX. Ilve is promoted here as a premium product but user reviews are terrible. Any comments?

 

The other is an Everdure, a low cost Australian brand that sources its products from other manufacturers, this one is model OBES6781 which is made in Turkey. I'm guessing it might be made by Arcelik / Beko, are there other suppliers of generic ovens in Turkey than Arcelik / Beko?

This is the model: https://www.everdure.com/products/obes6781

Does it look familiar to anyone? I'd like to know who the real manufacturer is, and if their products are any good? (Not expecting miracles at the price, but trying to avoid complete junk.)

There are very few side opening wall ovens available in Australia, so we don't have many options.

 
 
No experience with either but I’m
Assuming that there’s an issue with access if side opening is required. Neff Slide and hide is a drop down door that then slides away under the oven to allow full access.

I’d buy one of these without question. Very good, reliable and great ovens to cook with.
No brainier that would save hours of research and brain ache for you both.
 
Hi Chris

I would reccomend the Westinghouse, but with one caveat. We had one pre-kitchen renovation and the oven cavity seals incredibly well, unlike an old oven, there is no chimney to let moisture escape and unlike an expensive oven, there is no active venting of the oven cavity.

This lead to years of never getting anything Crisp out of the oven. Roast pork would never crackle and making biscuits and trying to cook multiple trays, lead to them being pale and cooking from old age due to the moisture build up in the oven.

If your sister isn’t a serious cook, they seem to be a well made unit, but if she is, she’ll be constantly frustrated. The follow up oven has active venting and It is definitely better
 
I have a 1 yr old Westinghouse gas stove. Never again. It is rubbish.

 

Initially the Neff looked good but there are some very unhappy reviews, especially relating to the slide-under door coming off its track and being expensive to fix. They are stupidly expensive here, too.

 

Re the side opening door - in her previous home my sister had a Falcon range with two side opening ovens, she loved that feature and wants to go back to side opening. No disability, just a preference.
 
Hey Chris,

Whatever she gets, seriously consider active venting. Because of the energy standards by default, ovens are now very well sealed and things don’t cook like they used to.

We replaced the Westinghouse with a Miele oven that has an active vent. I can cook 5 trays of biscuits in one go, without rotating the trays and they will all brown evenly and cook in the usual 10-15 minutes. I’ve never had an oven before that’ll cook that many trays so evenly. In the old Aussie made ones, three at a time was the most I could go. The other thing is to check the usable space. Some 60cm ovens still only have a 60l capacity, whereas the better ones are 80-100l. Make sure there is a good amount of useable space.

You don’t need to spend as much as Miele, but ensure it has some sort of venting solution.

Cheers

Nathan.
 
I've never heard of Boretti. I can't find any Australian reference to it, either.

 

I looked at a few ovens in town today.

The Everdure, which the importer had told me over the phone was made in Turkey, is clearly marked Made in China. Having said that, it looked very robust and had a clever way to reverse the door, where the hinge mounts on one side are the latch points on the other side, so when you reverse the door you don't have to move a latch. But it was very basic, no particular features except the sideways door. A bit "meh."

 

All other ovens I saw were standard drop down door. Some Electrolux ones seemed to have very good features for the price, and seemed well designed. They are "assembled in Australia" using mostly European parts according to the sales woman. Beko was impressive, with particularly robust, soft-close hinges, easy to dismantle the door to clean inner glass, and seemed overall to be a quality product for the price. They get glowing reviews on Australian websites, too, and 5 year warranty. Bosch seemed pretty good but I have seem some very unhappy reviews of Bosch ovens here. The one that surprised me was Neff  - it really looks like a lovely oven, it would want to for over $2000 for the base model but the roll-under door was superb. I am visiting a friend tomorrow who has a Neff and has had a bad run with it, they completely replaced the first one under warranty after multiple failures, she told me the new one has been OK but "it is just an oven, nothing to justify what it cost, next time I'd buy a cheap one and consider it disposable." I'll hear more detail tomorrow.

 
 
Boretti

Boretti may be well known, but surely not in Italy.

And it is not Italian at all, given that the headquarter is in The Netherlands.

If you allow me, Louis, you are Dutch and know them as being Italian; I am Italian and never heard of them...

To me, it is just another of the many, many cases of "Italian sounding" which have nothing to do with Italy: their website is stuffed with the word "Italian" everywhere, but it never states that they actually produce or even design in Italy.

I have downloaded one of their user's manual: first language is Dutch, second is French and there is no third
 
That's what they say somewhere in their website...

...but in all honesty I am not sure those "small, family-own Italian appliance manufacturers" actually exist, or exist anymore. Not to mention whether a small appliance manufacturer could ever be profitable and survive.

"Made in Italy by small companies" is another part of the "Italian sounding"
 
Small companies that manufacture products for other brands too.

To be honest, I tend to believe them because they state it on their website. If their appliances weren't made in Italy, they just didn't have to mention it. If you have evidence that they are made somewhere else, I may change my opinion, but I try to stick to facts, although that's not always easy.
 
Facts

My problem is that I find it difficult to take advertising for a fact, especially when the advertising is only in the "History" section of the website and consists of the single sentence "The Boretti collection is designed in Italy and produced by Italian family companies." quite weak to be a fact.

This seems to me like the "Italian salami made in Germany" that I see here at the supermarket
 
I did a check on the head office in the Netherlands on the side of the Dutch trade commerce office. There are 79 companies registered on that address. So it's a letter box company, unfortunately we have a lot of those. Pfizer and Starbuck have their head office too overhere, just because the NL is a tax haven like Panama and Bermuda. So it says nothing about the company that it's head office here. No manufacturing of their appliances here.
 
I read the same history page. My take on it was that the name Boretti is probably a Dutch creation for marketing, they mention that Boretti products are manufactured by "Italian family companies" which is similar to the description on the Australian Ilve website, which talks about the Ilve company being formed by Mr Berno and Mr Illotti in 1952. (Berno + Illotti might = Boretti?).

 

Of course the plot thickets, Ilve in Australia is distributed by Eurolinx, who also offer the brand name Artusi. The Ilve side opening oven I mentioned appears almost identical to the Artusi, to the point I expect they come from the same factory. In Italy. Oddly, though I strongly suspect they are the same oven with only cosmetic differences, the Artusi gets excellent reviews online, I can't find any reviews of that equivalent model Ilve, but other similar Ilve ovens with normal drop down doors get dismal reviews. What does all that mean? I have no idea.



The Boretti is very similar, but different.

Funny thing is, when I look at Ilve's Italian website, there is nothing like the Ilve oven for sale in Australia...

 

It is so common now for products to be branded with one name but made by any old mystery company. We have a large number of ovens and similar that trade on European sounding names but actually come out of China. I have in the last week seen ovens branded Blanco, Omega and Technika which all had tiny stickers saying made in China or PRC.

 
Ilve is (was) a real italian manufactiurer of ovens and stoves and it is based in Campodarsego . I saw many Ilve stoves around here but i never heard of Boretti appliances. On their on line catalog they only show accessories for barbecues and cooking outdoor. Stoves are not so popular here nowadays as new kitchens tend to have the hob separated from the oven. The only oven with side opening I ever saw was made by Gaggenau, a brand now owned by BSH (Bosch/Siemens Hausgeräte) just like Neff.
 

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