Another one exploads again, BOOOM!!

[aquarius1984]

Bored already

I just wonder why different threads have to be made about the same subject.

Can one not just use the same thread that was originally made to discuss (if they really must) their opinions on these sorts of machines and their problems.

May I also enquire as to why the creator of this thread belongs to what is essentially a WASHING MACHINE PRESERVATION site when all they seem to post about is machines breaking or machines with problems.

Persoanlly feel the record needs to be changed - how many public members view this site and base opinions on machines to buy, I think there would be more joining up to engage in conversation about these machines if it really was a way for us to help them decide.

As it stands I cannot see the point of these threads so why bother to argue/discuss/whatever. Seems like certain people are getting a thrill out of "exploding machines" NOT something I want to be associated with.

I also find it a shame that so many other members fuel the fire with their opinions, yet cannot find it within themselves to contribute to more worthy threads and only throw the odd token comments about machines on Facebook!

I think we all need to think about the reasons we are here on this site as members and decide what we want from it.

 

[aquarius1984]

Edit notes

Apologies to the Author of this thread,

I QUOTED

May I also enquire as to why the creator of this thread belongs to what is essentially a WASHING MACHINE PRESERVATION site when all they seem to post about is machines breaking or machines with problems.

------

I didnt mean the author - I meant one of the contributors to this thread who has created countless other threads of the same mature about other machines along with his own.

apologies again

 

[3beltwesty]

The drum on many modern Front Load washers is 201 stainless steel.

They drum is made from sheets of 201 stainless that is rolled into a cylinder and then welded. This seam is what fails on the machines that have "exploded".

This seam sees stress, once this bad/poor/crummy/slacker seam fails the drum expands and hits the plastic tub, ie often in the spin cycle at 1000 to 1600 rpm. Since there is a lot of energy; the drum passes thru the tub and breaches the washer frame; or bends it.

If this concept is hard to fathom, imagine a tin can of beans with a vertical seam that is revolved until the seam breaks.

One may note that a 1940 to 1992 Front load westinghouse washrer does not have this issue. One has design margin, good welds and a lower rpm.

In the quest to have higher extract rpms and lower build cost, it is easy to see how a crummy weld causes field failures.

NONE OF THIS IS NEW; that is why back 150 years ago one got boiler codes, to protect the public.

Washers that fly apart is really a rather new thing. Predicting how long a crummy weld will hold has too many variables. That is why us registered Mechancal Engineers have stuff like boilers, pressure tanks, fire extingishers hydro tested every so many years.

****Your "exploding washers" is a classic old consumer issue where a maker has poor quality control and thus has field failures to downplay. Things like this happening are as old as man. Designs are pushed, newbies design things with no sense of old fart experience of field disasters.

There is a decent amount of potential energy in a spinning laundry drum with 7Kg of clothes at 1000 to 1600 rpm. That alone should have the newbie design engineer concerned about the weld.

None of this is really rocket science, an engineer 2000 years ago knew that stuff broke with high loading levels. In that era the newbie engineer feared beheading in a bridge failed due to his slacker assuming. Today with a big company, there really is damage control. They weigh a massive recall versus the damage of the few massive failures.

This issue might as well be a tiny percentage of heart valves that fail, or jets that explode. One has moral issues, issues of cost, issues of there are often no magic way to find if the fields items are in danger.

I am not sure why so many threads are started at once on this same subject at the same time.

On a carbide tipped saw blade, the tips can fly off if poorly welded; or if abused too.

 

[solsburian]

aquarius1984

If you are talking about me, I don't remember starting countless threads.

 

[aquarius1984]

I didnt mention any names and I wont,

One thing that is for sure.

Contributors to this thread need to assess the reasons they joined this site and if those reasons they personally joined for fit in with the ethics and dynamics of what this site is ACTUALLY FOR.

 

[solsburian]

I don't have time for people who relish fun and games like that.

If you don't like the comments, don't read them. It's as simple as that.

 

[3beltwesty]

Fatigue failures often give little warnings, or due but befo

Combo; RE

"All washers have the potential for major failure, but this is being blown way out of proportion. No one has been seriously hurt by this type of failure and no one is likely to be. All owners of all washers should be advised to stop using any washer that gets extremely noisy in the spin cycle and have it inspected or replace it. I suspect that in most cases there was some warning as the welds started to fail but in any case it is a washing machine, not a car that could kill you."

My biased option is that a Candy washer that "explodes" like this will have zero warning to the "Average JOE / Jane"

With a cyclic failure like a fatigue failure, there may or may not any warning, whether a washer, automobile's clutch, or a thrown rod on an old lawn mower, or Boeing 737 roof.

With my own stuff, after the failure I often can say it acted a bit weird or sounded a tad different. BUT that was not enough to have me halt the device.

I am not sure if they chaps at Candy have a way to spot in the field the poorer welds. Maybe made a change and it is easy to spot, or maybe it is subtle and thus really impossible to spot?

 

[aquarius1984]

I ask again,

Why only discuss the negatives then? Why only contribute to threads about negativity? Only reason I can think of is because thats all these members want to talk about which could just as easily be done ELSEWHERE where JOE PUBLIC CAN SEE IT AND CAN USE THE INFO.

Does it achieve anything amongst a group of collectors who can make their own decisions based upon their knowledge.

Do those who need to be updated daily on broken machines not already read review sites to find out the latest gossip????

As I said before, other sites cater for the general public as response and participation in conversation from those is almost non existant.

Please feel free to join in the threads about preservations and restorations, we all would love your input, after all its what we are here for! Not all doom and gloom about the latest machines off the production line.

 

[foraloysius]

Noone was involved

As a matter of fact in Germany a woman was in the bathroom with her back towards the washing machine. She had injuries. Fortunately she wasn't facing the machine. Otherwise her injuries would have been much worse. Here's a link to her story in German including a picture of the bathroom just after the event.

http://www.test.de/themen/haus-gart...n-im-Badezimmer-4104279-4104281/?ft=bild&fd=5

 

[aegokocarat]

and what about that one in the uk that whent boom and badly bruised that womans back

 

[solsburian]

@aquarius1984

I don't really see what the problem is, at the end of the day, this is a forum for people who are interested in talking about washers, not just about preservation.

I have put my input into other discussions, and I'll be quite happy to continue doing so as well as this.

 

[3beltwesty]

Sweeping flaws under the rug is more of a spineless marketin

From an engineering standpoint, an older flawed machine with a bad weld is more dangerous than a brand new one. An older machine usually has more hours, more unknowns, more risks.

This it is really quite selfish and immoral to say that a flaw that causes a device to fail in an explosive way has nothing to do with collectors or users of old stuff. In means you care little whether another collector gets hurt.

Many of us value when another mentions the dangers on a product; or some odd repair sequence that might cut ones fingers off.

Thus the average car, plane, washer, boat owner if sane wants to know of design flaws that cause their brakes to fail, propellers to fall off, drums to fly apart, through hull fittings that corrode and cause the boat to sink.

Others like marketing types like to quash flaws; ie discussion should be halted to preserve some fairy tale dogma that your brand is perfect.

No brand is perfect, exposing making the flaws known helps protect the public better. ie many of us do not care if your sacred bubble is popped that you ACME brand is perfect. ie we value human lives over marketing chaps egos.

If exposing flaws on products that may harm others bothers you then this seems to be more of a moral issue.

many of us want to know of others failures on our *OLD* products, since we STILL ACTUALLY USE THEM. ie we do not have them glued to some floor in a gallery as trophys.

Products often degrade with time. Thus many of us want to know is some radio tends to have leaky transformers so the chassis is not. we want to know if the dryer catches on fire due to some hidden lint buildup. Others might down the road want to beware that front load washer model too "tends to explode: with its drum too.

 

[3beltwesty]

I might totally disagree with every stance from some opposite of me by some chap in Oz or the UK;

*BUT* still value dearly their concern that the OLD device I just bought tends to explode, catch fire, cause shocks.

 

[fl1012]

Avoiding the Bitching......

and getting slightly more on topic, the trouble i have with this is the lack of action. I don't have anything against Candy machines as such, they seem pretty interesting & innovative machines.

It's gotta be said they don't have a shining reputation for quality & i wouldn't pay the money they ask for them, but does that bother me? No, not particularly. I drive a Fiat so i know all about reputations & after owning 3 totally problem-free Fiats i would challenge people who slate them. Similarly if you own a problem free Candy machine it's understandable you might defend them too.

However, the big difference is that if a car is deemed to have a fault that could cause injury, however minor & unlikely it may seem, the manufacturer is required to recall the affected vehicles & ensure the risk is elliminated. This system should be applied in the Candy case & they should be made to inspect, repair or replace ANY machine at risk of failure. Simply saying 'there's a risk' is far from good enough & authorities in the UK & Germany should force a recall if Candy won't act voluntarily.

In the meantime i think Which? should put a footnote on all Candy tests saying that 'whilst its believed the fault is now cured at the factory, a problem exists on older machines & Candy has not taken action'. This would inform potential buyers what sort of customer care they might experience should they buy a Candy. That alone may make Candy think twice about their laid-back approach. They won't act if everyone is too scared to challenge them. Judging by the number of failed 18 month old Candy (or Hoover) machines i've seen, there can't be many pre 2009 machines left in the UK.

Liam

 

[MrX]

This really doesn't look good for Candy.

I am amazed that some standards agency / product safety agency or customer who has suffered property damage hasn't decided to push this further.

 

[jetcone]

I agree with 3belt

This is what is called "catastrophic failure" it occurs suddenly without warning. So you won't know its coming until it hits you. And as for the manufacturer, I have no experience with them, but their denial even at 2 machines is absurd in the least and will lead to their extinction if they don't get it under control and fix the perception in the minds of the their consumers.

 

Good for Which? They are doing their job.

 

[nrones]

Good for Which? They are doing their job.

No, they"re not. Indesit machines exploded aswell, made exactly same faliures, destroyed the kitchen, and I"ve never seen a post on Which? about that. So if their job is to inform people that they might have an affected machine - no, they aren"t doing it (There is possibility I"ve missed that one).

Now about negativity. Yes there is bunch of it. I mean if those people (some of them aren"t on this thread) were happy to complain that Candy has way too long programmes, that the R32 is at way too high 50, that they are putting too much in the drum (but without much mentioning the others), and after, when Candy made R 14-30-44 (40c variable), when Candy made **2** steps to reduce time (time manager and KG mode)- they didn"t say a SINGLE word - to me that prooves that they actually never cared about time or temperature, only thing they wanted is to find (or make out) something negative.

And about injuries... Injuries are horrible - should NEVER hapend with ANYTHING!! But there is difference between small injury, serious injury, and death. Here I could read that machine could kill someone - it didn"t killed anyone, can you tell me in detail what injury that woman from Germany got?

Ofourse there are plenty of institutions in Germany and UK that could MAKE candy do a recall. I think I even seen once somewhere that someone from the authtorities said that machines aren"t enough dangerous to be recalled.

And by the way, I am telling all this not to defend Candy, - telling this is just because I want less people to feel betrayed (as I did, and still doo) when they find out that what they read here was more/less a fairytale.

 

[foraloysius]

Well mr Dejan,

I think you are getting your panties quite in a bunch about this matter. Your favourite brand has problems with some models. Stop complaining about that other brands don't get treated the same. That they don't get criticism as much as Candy might be caused by all sorts of reasons, we can only speculate about that.

Fact is that Candy has serious problems with some models and the Candy company doesn't respond adequately. They are just trying to wipe the whole thing under the carpet. The attention this problem gets is justified as long as they don't take the appropriate measures.

Furthermore it is of no importance if people have light injuries or worse ones. Fact is that a consumer product fails the safety standards. One woman got slightly injured because she stood with the back towards the washing machine. She had scratches, bruises and a cut from the parts that flew around. You don't want to think about when a small child had been playing near that washer. It's not important what happened but what could have happened, that is the risk that Candy has to take into consideration and act accordingly to.

There are lots of Candy washing machines that don't have this problem, however there are some models that shouldn't have been put on the market. Your favourite brand is not perfect. Deal with it!

 

[MrX]

I really don't think that Candy should be defended in anyway for this. It's totally inexcusable and they should recall the faulty models and provide reassurance that this will not reoccur.

It seems to me that these failures are indeed happening without any warning. The drum's welds just give way and 'bang' the machine's blown to bits by expanding revolving metal.

This fault is potentially very dangerous if someone's standing in the wrong place at the wrong time or if a piece of the machine is shot across the room at the wrong angle.

There are serious forces in a high speed centrifuge hurling several kilos of wet laundry around. They care quite clearly not taking it seriously enough!

The damage done to those machines and particularly to the metal cabinets demonstrates just how much force is involved!!

A simple safety measure would be the installation of two solid metal rings around the outer drum to retain the inner drum in the event of a catastrophic failure like this.

 

[ariston4life]

Nrones

i can understand your love for Candy just as i love Ariston and i also get upset when many people on here constantly bash them for not being good enough, well excuse me my whole family for over 20 years has being using indesit, Hotpoint or Ariston machines and in most cases they lasted well over 10 years, our hotpoint is almost a year old and works perfect, however for 3 years we had a Candy Aquaviva AQ130, which i liked as i choose it for my mother, but it was not a good machine. 4 breakdowns in 3 years,thats not good, however my grandmother had a Candy Sprint Sp100 that worked for 9 years with no breakdowns, its the luck of the draw some of them are great and others not so great, just like Ariston, so are great and some although it kills me to say are not so great, dont let it get to you.

 

[aeg03]

At the end of the day, the consumer should push this further. We could argue all day long about this but the people who should do something are the ones who have had property damaged etc. My only concern is that a small child is not ever hurt. Children are priority over brand names.

I would not hesitate to claim further and go to the press if a product fails.

 

[pierreandreply4]

stop crtizing other brands

eather if there washers from the uk canada or the us everymajor brand may have problems and that gos for candy even do this brand is not avalable in canada or the us whirlpool or inglis or maytag each brands may have there problems to resovle at some point in time. thats was my 2 cent here

 

[nrones]

Your favourite brand is not perfect. Deal with it!

REPEATING THIS ONE LAST TIME!!!!!
I"VE NEVER NEVER NEVER SAID CANDY WAS PERFECT (because honestly I don"t think it is), YOU COULD NOWHERE READ THAT I SAY IT"S PEFECTLY NORMAL TO HAPPEND, AND THOSE EXPLOSIONS ARE HORRIBLE, CATASTROPHIC!

now, mr.foraloysius
all sorts of reasons? Tell me please, what is the reason to stay quiet about Indesit? maybe when Candy explodes, it kills, and when Indesit explodes it can"t hurt a person sitting on it while lt happend... anyway as you are way to reasonable, you will find an "adequate" answer for idiot me, in which basicly you won"t tell me anything, but it would still be the same. Just not to forget I am saying to you - CANDY IS NOT PERFECT.

ariston4life, compleatly understand you about that one - deffinatley with you-you have good experience I think I might have had bad luck, but still I"m not darring to buy one of Indesit"s soon.

Well, you guys still didn"t explained why aren"t UK/Germany consumer offices doing something. What I know, is that if you aren"t sattisfied with any kind of service, you report them in some institution.
Maybe you could doo that for all the people bought Candy?

Well, unfortunatley, I am again going to end up as one who claims Candy"s perfect, you are still going to write bad things about in important cases (like this), or unimportant (like that with programmes).. well with this envirnoment I"m defiinatley sure that this forum is good.. for sharing pictures.

Anyway, feel free to visit my YouTube channel (I know most of you watch my vids, because first time my candy distributed unbalanced for 5 seconds I got 100000comments about that), where you can feel free to leave positive comment and oppineon, among bunch of other commenters that (obviously) aren"t like you.

By the way... did we changed anything? Informed people? don"t sure Made you love Candy? No Made People who love it Hate it? No Influenced on Candy?ofcourse never

and don"t forget to reply about Indesit not presented on Which?, aswell as reaction of customer offices in countries - you mostly forgot those while you explained me how nuts I am.

http://www.youtube.com/nrones

 

[haxisfan]

More reflections

"At the end of the day, the consumer should push this further"

this sentence ‘Aeg03’ said just made me think back to when I had a potentially fatal car collision which wasn't my fault... my insurance and I did our best to bring a little justice for the moral and physical injuries suffered and we won in the end... all boiled down to compensation. Perhaps something similar happens on these situations, the afflicted party gets compensation so the consumers don't feel like taking this matter further.

Perhaps this is what has happened to the owners of these Candys as well as to some of the other brands having approached their consumers and taking action immediately before their unhappiness could spread with counterproductive effects.

What I don't get is the fact that Candy UK has already issued a safety warning for another product on their website (link below)... let alone the fact to recall these faulty machines, what would cost them to put up another warning on their site linked to a serial number checker as they did in Germany?

There is perhaps a reason behind it all. Don't cliché me with things like 'greedy company' at this stage as I was only considering a little safety warning on the site which wouldn't involve a massive expenditure... they could just translate the German one perhaps and use the same database

I understand that it might be more difficult to trace the affected models, as far as I've seen the 3 UK exploded machines were different from one another and different models again from the German ones... and there was even a Hoover there: the only thing they had in common was the drum seal with the defective weld.

I’m not defending anyone although I am tempted to ;-)
I’m just pouring some more observations into this thread.

http://www.candy-domestic.co.uk/trio_rework

 

[pierreandreply4]

what may cause danger in washer

to nurone,

let me tell you a little story about a similar problem that was in this thread and also note that i am not bad mouthng the candy brand of washers since its a brand thats not avalable in canada i was making myself some lunch and a neighbor 's fridgedair dryer 's heating element caught fire i was in the kitchen cooking my 11:00 am lunch when i saw at the neighbor a fire truck outside and on the patio the dryer in question on the neighbor 's patio that was around 1989 that this happens so know that what causes accidents are eather the washer that was overloaded witch cause unblance or a part thats inside the washer that was wrongly screwd or the screw came lose and also please note that not all brands are perfect that go for uk brands of washing machine as well as canadian and us brands of washer dryer and this is my final post in the matter.

 

[mrwash]

Oh my lord

Sorry guys but every machine that explodes is one too much. Seriously, it doesn't matter if it is Candy or Indesit or which machine... it just should not happen !

I also think that Candy should have responded to those incidents in another way. More open, more caring, more interested in what happend and what could help those people who have been affected. I can just take a guess but I think companies like Miele, BSH would have reacted in a complete other way as the German market is very very important to them. Well, as important as the German market is for BSH and Miele, as unimportant it is for Candy. I think thats why Candy tries to ride it out. It was quite inconvenient to them that German Consumer Reports wouldn't give up on that story....

 

[dave886]

The main reason i posted this thread is to people to disgust the matter to why is this problem still occurring within these machines. Nothing man made is perfect full stop but there is a limit to where a product is dangerous and one day can cause serious harm or even death(touch wood it will never happen), i think some of you all need to come back to the real world and see that this is not a one off incident this is something which may happen around Europe(don't ever think it will never happen in your own home if you own one(im not trying to scare you imstating facts) you'll will never know and i'm sure there are other untold cases of these machine bursting out of its cabinet, the last thing a person would expect is there washing machine disintegrating in there own home and some may have children around which would be nearly every parents nightmare for an appliance to explode. End of day the i posted this for a reason, and i knew this will cause provocativeness (i dunno if thats the correct term? lol)amongst some because too many people have too much to say for them self this why it is a forum, express how you feel but at the same time respect people opinions, I'm going to draw the line here.

candy has a hell of a lot to do to change peoples minds about their products, if they spent a little extra time into designing machines then maybe threads like this will never exist, i own a hotpoint aqualtis i had concerns when i read about the indesit machines disintegrating, as for i know indesit owns hotpoint, i was told my model is not effected thank goodness, but even me as a hotpoint owner can admit that indesit-hotpoint has a lot to improve on there products and in a way they have hand down, but for me to even thinking buying another hotpoint if this one gives up, even though i am kinda happy with my machine they need to sort out the design of the glass doors and balancing system. im just glad i have the basic essential of having a washiing machine to wash my clothes seriously.

 

[nrones]

Now you guys reminded me!

I mean, why did I wrote all those texts... to a group of 20 people that are unbelivable.. as we all concluded this doesn"t have influence to market or other people at all... if it is so like you say, Candy deffinatley wouldn"t sell around 3.5milion washing machines last year (7.2milion units of all other appliances), so if some ridiculously small group is hating it, and making stories out---there is like 100000times more people that like them. Maybe it"s because Candy isn"t so focused on UK, and specially German market.. Especially people saying Candy had ALWAYS been bad.. well, the "bad Candy" have survived 66years, and there is no sign of failing in it, unlike bunch of "good ones" that are gone. inclooding Hoover.

Well, this is all about the pattern, person needs to have: favorite miele one and only, maybe consider about Electrolux and BSH, not mention Indesit in any case, and write negative texts when bored.. and all that being an optimist (influence thing xD).. with no point.. I"m not going to waste my time on this.. not worth it deffinatley.

By the way, you know that there was a short time when those drums were produced? So, some machines may have been used less, so they exploded now.. Remember that those aren"t NEW machines just ones from the same series as the others. Also, there is no post September 2009 machine affected, so all of them currently on the market are 100% safe.

 

[MrX]

I really don't understand why certain people on this thread are blindly defending a major appliance maker that is clearly not doing a very good job!

Candy may be a relatively minor player in some markets, but it is living on the Hoover legacy in the UK and Ireland and has quite a big market share because of the good reputation of the old Hoover brand.

If they don't respond to something like this very seriously and very promptly they'll destroy themselves through lack of sales and law suits / personal injuries claims.

I think the problem is that their really enormous load machines are just pushing beyond the laws of physics. They are using relatively cheap materials and thin drums in huge capacity machines with 1600rpm spins.

They either need to reduce the capacity, the spin speed or improve the quality.

 

[3beltwesty]

The issue is not one of materials, it is the seam/weld fails

RE

"I think the problem is that their really enormous load machines are just pushing beyond the laws of physics. They are using relatively cheap materials and thin drums in huge capacity machines with 1600rpm spins.

They either need to reduce the capacity, the spin speed or improve the quality."

The issue is not one of materials, it is the seam/weld fails.

It really is NOT a high tech issue at all.

The issue is basic. ie it is like a many thousands of years old issue. ie somebody welds/bonds two pieces of metal together, and the darn joint fails.

Issues with the joint failing are thousands of years old.

When poor workmanship is done the joint can fail, whether a Roman piece of iron, a medieval suite of armour, an 1800's steam engines boiler, or a 2011 washing machine.

The problem is one of practical engineering, not physics which has zero legal standing with product liability.

What one has is some poor/bad/sloppy/slacker/crummy seams are in the joint of the 201 stainless steel drum, and a tiny few fail.

**** The base metal does not fail, the seam does.

This points to sloppy quality control, often a way corners are cut to get costs down. Or is is an oversight.

ISSUES like this often have no magical way to ferret out the few bad/poor actual devices in the field, without a total super costly recall.