AO Smith Electric Water Heater (leaked)

[ea56]

Codes

When we had our WH replaced in 2010 it was mandatory that we had a drain and drain pan installed under the WH, and also even though its electric and a low boy, less likely to tip over in a quake, we also had to have it strapped to the wall, according to code in our local. This increased the installation charge considerably, but was good insurance against future damage from any leakage.

Eddie

 

[mark_wpduet]

One thing I forgot to mention

when we bought this at Lowes, we had to pay a $70 fee to the city and fill out a form because we were installing it ourselves. Supposedly, whether it's installed professionally or on your own, someone is supposed to come out and check to make sure it was installed correctly.....but they NEVER or RARELY do. They just want the money.

 

[DADoES]

 
Shower this evening.  Flow-rate that I typically run (less than full-open), setpoint 103°F, tankless reported:  input temp 80°F, 1.4 GPM, 16% capacity.

 

[mark_wpduet]

the more I learn

the more I'm not sure electric tankless would be a good idea for areas too far north where the water gets COLD in the wintertime. Like, say you've had weeks where it's been super cold and the water temp is like 38 to 40 F or something like that.... I wonder how an electric tankless would handle that? I'm sure it can get cold in Texas as well.

 

[combo52]

Tankless Water Heaters Etc.

The chief advantage of tankless WHs is space saving and the ability of unlimited supply of hot water, There are also many disadvantages as well.

 

TWHs can not supply a steady supply of water over 120F when several faucets are being used at the same time in a house when incoming water temperature is very cold [ under 45F ]

 

ETWHs are especially bad at this, in addition ETWHs put very high demands on electrical supply systems are are prone to all kinds of wiring and circuit breaker failures, there are no other appliances in modern homes that use anywhere near the amount of power these WHs consume, even electric furnaces are not that bad and there are darn few electric furnaces in use now that heat pumps are so popular even up North.

 

TWHs often actually raise energy usage when people find out their time in the shower has no limit, this is again true in homes where there are a number of people living there and with a tank type WH you had to look out for one another.

 

Heat loss from electric and Heat-Pump WHs is very small because of very good insulation and the lack of a flue running up the center of the tank that is always loosing heat up the flue.

 

John L.

 

 

[turbokinetic]

Response to John L reply #43...

 

I had often wondered how much power tankless water heaters use. I have no need for one, as my home doesn't have space constraints and the current water heater is in its own room, and is double-insulated.

 

My curiosity was piqued when installing an all electric pressure washer.  This has a 27.5KW heating system on it. With the 7.5HP motor running and the heat on, the demand is just about 33KW and almost 130 amps at 240V. This is a large percentage of the building's 200A service capacity.  I don't see how a tankless electric water heater could be practical for a home with a smaller electrical service capacity; unless you only expected "warm" not "piping hot" water and only one hot water tap was on at a time.

 

The power company, building engineering, etc. would all be happiest with water heaters that use the minimum power, and run constantly. In other words, a huge tank with small elements. That would be best on the power system. These very high power loads which switch on and off are stressful on the system; where the same energy consumption spread over a 24 hour period is much better.

 

 

 

[ea56]

After reading more about the power requirements for an ETWH it's clear to me that this isn’t a viable alternative for our home.

We’ll stick with the tried and true conventional EWH. Due to space limitations we have to go with the Low Boy models, and thats OK too. Having lived in an all electric home for 25 years we are very good at using our electricity in a conservative manner, and are able to keep our power costs from getting too high.

Eddie

 

[Chetlaham]

A tank-less water heater typically requires that the home have a 150-200amp service (at least) and its a REALLY good idea you contact the power company about it as they typically size their equipment to the actual anticipated load (not conservative NEC load calcs) which do not take an extra 25kw-40kw of load into account. Meaning you could actually burn up their service drop or pole transformer in the middle of winter.

 

[mark_wpduet]

I've learned so much

the past couple of weeks about water heaters that I really NEVER KNEW. The sacrificial anode rod that's in most water heaters and needs to be changed over time! Even watching youtube videos of people changing them.....It looks tricky depending on the water heater and sometimes it looks EASY. Also, the type of metal in the anode rod can be totally different from area to area, depending on water. No wonder there's sediment in water heaters because that rod disintegrates. So not only do you need to flush the water heater, the anode rod needs to be changed too. Every place I've ever lived has been all electric, and I've never known anyone to do any of this with their hot water heaters.

 

[mattl]

Gas is the best option for me.  I have a 40 gallon higher efficiency tank, set as hot as it will go, and my summer gas bill is ~$20 - including a gas cooktop and dryer.  I think it would be hard to beat with any other type.

 

[circlew]

From 1974 until about 10 years ago, my house had a Weil-McLain electric boiler for the baseboard hot water heat. It drew about 120 amps if all four elements were energized, which happened in very cold weather. It was connected to its own 150 A main breaker, which had its own line (2/0 AL) coming from the meter. At the time of the boilers installation, the overhead service drop was replaced with heavy duty wiring with an ampacity of 400. In the 30+ years it was in service, never once did we have any issues with the breaker tripping. However, the first winter we had it, on a very cold day, we woke up in a cold house with no electric. The two houses across the street were also out. The power company replaced a fuse on the transformer, but it blew out again that evening. The next day they came back, and installed a new transformer just for our house. After that, no trouble associated with the electrical service. The boiler elements came on in stages, according to how much heat was required, so no huge load all at once. The voltage on the other circuits (in another panel) stayed stable, with very little drop even when boiler operating on all elements.

A premium quality panelboard, such as Eaton CH series or Square D QO series, have plated copper bus bars instead of aluminum as found on cheaper models. These panels and their breakers should not have any problems withstanding heavier load such as these tankless heaters, as long as panel is of the proper amp rating, and the associated wiring is properly installed.

 

[askolover]

Well I had planned to go tankless a few years ago until I found this page.

http://www.waterheaterrescue.com/Longevity/tankless-water-heaters.html

I'll stick with a tank.

 

[mark_wpduet]

Same

I think the best option would be heat pump water heaters. But they are EXPENSIVE, but supposedly pay for themselves and then some over time. I was reading some reviews on them. One person said, heats water, low energy, self-cleaning, what more do you want? I thought, self-cleaning? How?

My cheap heater I just bought is doing really well. I hardly ever hear it heating water UNLESS one of us has showered. I take long showers and I haven't ran out at all. Something I just noticed in the description of mine is that it has "copper" heating elements vs stainless steel (LOL). I'm not surprised.

I may get brave and drain mine after six months like the manual says to do, or at least connect the hose and just let water run through it.

 

[DADoES]

 
I've not had any issues getting sufficient heated water out of it or any electrical supply failures for the duration of 15+ years with the tankless.

There is no natural gas service in the little neighborhood outside town where my house is located.  Propane would be the alternative.  Both bathrooms have whirlpool tubs (not Jacuzzi brand) and a standard 40 or 50 gal tank heater couldn't handle filling them so perhaps the builder went with tankless on that point instead of two tank water heaters or one super-sized ... my understanding is that he also had the tankless unit already on-hand, having placed them in one or two other builds.

Tankless, either gas or electric, surely is not for every situation, and retrofitting either type to an existing tank installation often involves "problems."

 

[mark_wpduet]

Just watched a video

If I spent $1500 dollars on a heat pump hybrid electric water heater (not counting potential discounts from Lowes or Home Depot and the possible rebate from the power company), by year 5, total spent on hybrid water heater would be around $2200 (that's including energy to use it over those 5 years, but possibly less than that with rebates or discounts)

This $389 water heater that I have. By year 5, this heater will have cost $2650.

But you still have to drain/flush, change anode in ALL OF THEM (from what I understand). Plus, you never know if there may be other costs such as hiring a plumber, etc., will add to those costs.

I do wonder though....It sounds like a great thing in the summer, but when it's operating in the winter it will be "cooling" the air around it, not heating it. Not sure how that factors in if it's really cold outside.

I'm definitely going to start saving for one.

Also interesting that the Hybrid electric heater plugs into a regular outlet (LOL)

 

[askolover]

I remember back in the 80's the TVA (who produces our electricity) had a HP water heater on display at one of the energy shows at Regency Square Mall in Florence, AL.  My dad picked up some brochures on them but ultimately we just switched over to gas since the city was giving away AO Smith gas water heaters for FREE to switch.  That water heater lasted almost 30 years!