Are electric meters ever wrong? Or why am I using so much electricity.

[mattl]

Has anyone ever came across an electric meter that ran fast? Do your power companies routinely replace you meters? We've had the same meter since the house was built in '65, but we've had 4 gas meters over the same time. I had tried to devise a way to check the accuracy of the meter, but so far have not come up with one.

Last June we used 1560 kwhrs of power, with the air running most of the time, and several lights on timers. This year, no air and when I moved to windows 7 my X10 Fuse timer won't function, so I generally leave those lights off,but they rally don't amount to much, 30 watts for 4 or 5 hours. Plus, I've shut down a couple of my computers that normally run 24/7, and my usage is 1900 kwhrs!

I'm tempted to have the meter replaced and the old one sealed to see if it was running fast all theses years. I'd love to get a credit for 45 years of overcharge, but I think that's just a pipe dream. I've always felt the bill was high, though it is a large house with lots of stuff, 1900 kwhr seems way off the mark.

Could any wiring issues cause a high meter reading? The system is properly grounded, bonded to the water line, meter jumped. I guess I should get one of those watt meters and go around the house.

 

[dj-gabriele]

My meter was replaced in 2006 under the change to electronic meters with automatic reading that went on nationwide. Before that since 1993 our meter was replaced twice. The first time because for a defect it lacked termal protection and burned after a few months and after that because of standard maintenance. Something from 1965 to my eyes would at least be unreliable if not dangerous, after all more than 40 years have passed!

 

[tristarcxl]

Electric Meters

The electric meters in this country rarely go wrong. Usually when they do, they either UNDERCHARGE you or they stop altogether!

Something in your house is drawing that much power. Have you checked your refrigerator? If it's got dirty coils, you'd be SHOCKED how much power that thing will suck up. A computer running all month will suck up 300+KWh depending on the hardware configurations. A modern dual-core computer with a decent graphics card will suck up a tremendous amount of power.

How much A/C have you used? Amount of clothes washed? Dishwasher running? Coffee pot running?

It all adds up. The electric meters we have here are induction driven. That little plate rotates as a function of the current flowing through the wires going into your house. The more current you draw, the stronger the magnetic field, and the faster the disc rotates.

The old meters and the modern meters are virtually identical mechanically. You might have your electricity company give you an "energy audit". We did that at my last apartment in Lubbock. We thought the same thing about the billing being too high. They brought out a replacement meter to find out. No change! We found out in our case that it was the refrigerator. 1972 GE that had the valves completely worn out of the compressor so it ran 24/7! That and the stuck defrost timer..... OY!

 

[earthling177]

You may have something that is not shorted out to ground, but that has bad insulation and is leaking electricity to ground. Not enough to trip the breaker, but enough to be charged.

Anyway, you need to troubleshoot and find out what/why.

Turn off all breakers, including main breaker. See if the meter is still running after a minute or so, in which case the problem may be before your main panel.

If the meter stopped, turn on the main breaker, keep all the other breakers off. If the meter runs with everything else off, you need to find out what is going wrong in the panel.

If the meter was stopped with the main breaker on, you need to turn off and unplug everything in your house, and now turn on each breaker in turn and make sure the meter is still off. If the meter starts running with nothing apparently on, you may have stray currents in that circuit, often a problem with the wiring insulation. If the wiring seems OK, start plugging things back in and/or turning on lights and find out what seems to be using a lot of current and shouldn't. Sometimes it's worn out insulation in places like water heaters or a/c's or furnaces.

Good luck!

 

[DADoES]

Slow Meter, Fast Meter

Yup, a friend who works for the local power company has said that people who request their meter be changed due to suspect of overcharging often find their bill goes UP. The mechanism wears and drags with age and old meters tend to run slow, not fast.

 

[toggleswitch2]

Is your house all-electric? How do your bills compare to sim

New eletronic meters do tend to have issues with overcharging when they get into trouble. Power-surges and blackouts wreak (sp?) havoc with these things.
Do you have an electric hot-water heater? IIRC the largest household use I am aware of is about 35 to 40 KWH per day for an all-electric house with a heat-pump for climate-control.
In my state I believe meters must be replaced every 10 to 14 years.
I believe you can request a meter change, if you believe there is a discrpancy.
Oddly, a friend of mine had a meter that ran VERY slowly. The power company rpelaced it when it stopped altogether. The universe must have a sense of humor, because the next one did the same thing within a year. Either that or there are mystery factors that slow-down and speed-up time, in general, and electrical meters!

http://www.diychatroom.com/f18/electric-meter-46781/

 

[supersurgilator]

Yes, as others have said a worn out meter will run slow. This happened to my grandparents in Florida. Their bill was usually around $100 or so a month, and they knew something was up when they got 2 or 3 bills for like $30-40. They called the power company and sure enough the meter had failure. The bad part was that they prorated what they would have used during those months based on their historical usage and then they got a bill for almost $300 to make up for it!!

That being said the only time our meter was replaced was when we upgraded to a circuit breaker panel from fuses in 1996. The other meter was original to the house.

Our gas meter was replaced a couple of years ago to one with flip over numbers as opposed to the dials. The guy that replaced it said the other one had been there since 1980, so it was about 26 years old.

 

[iheartmaytag]

Yes Meters do go bad

Here we can request an energy audit. As Tristarclx said, they usually find that they were running slow due to age, dirt and/or moisture in the meter, but I have heard tell of meters running too fast.

We had a very hot end of June and first of July here and I used 1725Kw vs 1575 last year. This is with hanging clothes on the line, and setting the thermostat at 80.

 

[everythingold]

Hmmmmmm

I suppose I am being silly, but perhaps these big corporations are liars and thieves? I know it's a stretch...

 

[iheartmaytag]

perhaps these big corporations are liars and thieves?

Oh NO!! never. Our Westar Energy is perfectly honest and they would never ask for six rate increases in six months.

OK--Liars and theifs may be a better description.

 

[kenwashesmonday]

I have seen the old mechanical meters "coast". For example, when the refrigerator starts, it draws a lot of amps for just a second, but then it takes a while for the meter wheel to slow down.

If you shut the main breaker off, the wheel should stop immediately.

Ken D.

 

[andrewinorlando]

Electric meters and water meters both typically tend to slow down as they age. If your meter is 45 years old, and you complain and have evidence to back up your complaints, the electric company may be willing to consider a replacement. Those meters cost well over $1,000 in most cases, so it's not something they will do as a favor to a customer unless there is a good reason.

But if you leave your PC running all the time, be aware it probably has a 350 Watt power supply, and will draw about 100+ watts at idle, not to mention other peripherals you have running. The fridge is the next culprit to check.

It is also quite possible that the reader read your meter incorrectly, and this will be adjusted after your next reading. Check your current meter reading asap, and compare it to your last two bills and see if it makes sense based on usage patterns. The meter is simple to read.

 

[toggleswitch2]

Hi I'm Big Peter, your meter reader!

My meter reader got mine wrong with the first reading in a new apartment and my bill was a whopping $400-- which is crazy for 30 days -- in three rooms where the LL suplies heat and hot water, cooking is gas, and the A/C was not yet running.

I was told I had used XYZ KWH per hour. Turns out that GadgetGary's ALL-ELECTRIC house used LESS per day. I DON'T THINK SO!

I told them it was physically impossible to use that much power when I have 110v 30a service (old,limited) but that went right over the clerk's head.

They fought me tooth-and-nail. The meter was finally re-read and lo-and-behold an adjustment was issued.

You can't fight City Hall? Honey you HAVE to, sometimes.

 

[mattl]

The thing that bugs me is in the past on our bill it showed last years consumption by month. They redesigned the bills and this was left off. As to usage, I actually turned off a few things that I though was using power needlessly. Both refrigerators are fairly new, that hasn't changes since last year, dehumidifier is new from last year and hasn't changed. My usage pattern is relatively unchanged.

I think I'll wait a week or so to see the next bill before doing anything, it might have been a miss read. If meters slow with age I certainly don't want to replace it with a faster one. I wish my utility had time of day use since the bulk of my use is in the evening and night.

 

[mattl]

BTW, Ive heard that water meters slow too. I had a leak a couple of years ago and they sent a guy out to see why the use was so high. One of the washers in the meter coupling gave out and it was leaking strongly for a month or so. The meter is tucked in the back of a closet in the basement, and I never go in there. The repair guy said I was lucky it was just a washer, as I have one of the old tri tap (I think that's what he called it...) meters that tend to run quite slow. He said don't let them replace it unless they have an overwhelming reason to.

 

[sudsmaster]

About a year after I moved in, the electric meter on this house was making noise so I called the company and they quickly came out and replaced it. I didn't notice any change in the bill.

The biggest change came later when I replaced both 80's era fridges with modern energy star models, which used about 1/3 of the electricity of the older model. Big diff there. But then I added a pond pump and a chest freezer, and more and more electronics. If I leave the PC system running 24/7, the bill goes up up up. So after a relatively high bill last month I've been shutting it all off when I go to work or to bed. It should help make a difference.

The last bill included about $35 in charges for kWH at $.26/kWH, because I'd gone "over" 200% of my baseline alottment of about 330 kWH. It would be nice to get out of that tier but I do like my gadgets ;-).

 

[butch-innj]

It happens.......

In my area of south new jersey our meters are read by those hand held things that guys just point at your meter. The same is true for reading our water meters too.
One of my cousins got a bill last month for over $400.00 for one month. She called the electric company and they sent out a guy to re-read her meter. She got a new bill for just under $200.00
According to the person she spoke with at the electric company, those hand held things can get messed up too.
It might not be just the meter.

 

[dogboy44]

Get a New Refrigerator!

We had the coolest (no pun) GE probably 1962, bottom freezer drawer, counter depth, neat snowflake design on the light lenz. We loved it, then it died. We got a new Amana bottom freezer and the electric bill when down so much we were stunned.

 

[andrewinorlando]

The old frost free refrigerator/freezer models used electric elements around the doors to keep the units from sweating in humid weather, as well as to defrost the unit during the defrost cycle. New units use the recirculating freon to do the job, no electricity required to defrost. My Kenmore gets so hot around the doors the if you rub your arm against it, it's actually unpleasantly hot. But it costs $5 a month to run, so I'm not complaining!!

 

[sudsmaster]

The local utility here has replaced both the gas and the electric meters with new electronic units that can send the usage information remotely to the utility without needed a meter reader to visit the property at all. Or so I gather. I could also go online and view my energy usage day by day, even hour by hour, or so I gather. Haven't tried to do that just yet.

The new electric meter would allow for time-of-use metering/charging, but I'm not sure if the rate system is set up for that as yet. I figure most of my consumption is 7x24, due to the pond pump, two fridges, and one chest freezer. So it might help to have a split rate; hard to say.

 

[qsd-dan]

My water, gas, and electric meters are all original from 1970 and seem to be accurate. No noticeable increase/decrease in usage, so if there are any inaccuracies, they must be pretty damn subtle. The electric meter will soon be replaced with a digital outfit. I wonder if the PG&E will let me keep the old original one?

 

[twintubdexter]

sudsmaster...

Even though I lived in the Bay Area for all but the last 7 years of my life, I don't recall anything about what PG&E's summer baseline was for electricity. You did say that last month's bill (June) had a 330 kWh base, but I would think it would be greater than that. Does the baseline differ between areas like San Francisco and San Jose. My hometown San Jose gets pretty warm and 330 kWh per month wouldn't get you very far, although many homes there don't have air conditioning.

Of course here in the desert air conditioning is as important as oxygen. Summer baseline from Edison is 47.6 kWh per day and I pay $.08 per kWh. Tier 2 is $.11 and tiers 3, 4 and 5 are all $.19 per kWh. There is no time-of-use billing. Of course there are several other charges added each month like nuclear waste disposal and a dozen other things that nobody can understand.

The two months I need to really watch are May and October which can be warm here but are winter rate months. The daily baseline during winter is a stingy 9.8 kWh per day. In order to help me get a constant idea of how much power my home is using I purchased one of those Black & Decker Energy Monitors for around $99. It appears to be fairly accurate, is wireless and gives me a good idea of my total energy usage. It keeps track of the tiers too. It helps to lessen the surprise element when opening the electric bill.

 

[sudsmaster]

Offhand I don't know what the baseline is for San Jose. Maybe Ralph can tell us, since he's down there.

There is a higher baseline for all-electric households, but as I recall it's not all that much greater than the regular baseline.

PG&E has a website where you can check the baseline amounts - but I think it's by a code on the bills, the locations may not be listed. But it's been a while since I looked at the tables, so maybe one could find out what the baseline is for different areas.

I figure PG&E believes that A/C is not necessary in the Bay Area. I know I can get by without it most of the summer. So far this year I haven't broken out the window units (they are stored in the garage) and hopefully I won't have to any time soon. Right now the weather is quite pleasant with the windows open during the days - even chilly in the morning. A/C is probably essential once you go over the east of the East Bay Hills. It's often 10 to 20 degrees warmer there. In San Francisco, it's definitely not needed in most of the city. Maybe in a large office or apartment building where internal heat can accumulate, but as I recall during the summers I lived there we'd leave the windows open most of the summer. If anything, it's cooler there than I'd like most of the summer.

 

[sudsmaster]

I spent the better part of this evening chasing down compressed air leaks in the workshop/garage. I've been noticing the compressor has been cycling on more often than it should. Found several culprits, and eventually had to shut the compressor down. Good thing, since I hadn't drained it for a while and with all the running it accumulated about a quart or two of water. No rust in it, though, which is good.

Armed with a spray bottle full of concentrated car wash and water, I eventually fixed all but the slightest of air leaks. The last one will require a bit more time but it's very slow. One brass fitting actually split up the side... cheap Chinese brass... Some older American stuff just needs to be renewed but in the meantime I simply replaced it with more cheap Chinese stuff (1/4" female quick connect stuff).

I figure the air compressor running unnecessarily was wasting electrical energy. How much, I don't know exactly, but the compressor motor is 3/4 HP, 5 amps 220v 1ph. Probably about 1200 watts for five or ten minutes several times a day. It all adds up!

 

[kenmoreforever]

Every once in a while my meter stops completly, i enjoy those days but its not long lived. Dont know if it needs oiling or what? haha for me.

 

[sudsmaster]

The other day I noticed that our new electric meters have a display that cycles between showing volts, total KWh, and current wattage being consumed. The last bit is very helpful, as I can shut major things off and on and determine how much juice they are consuming. Yes, I have a portable watt meter but stuff like the pond pump, and shop compressor are 220 and hard-wired into the circuit, so I can't use the watt meter on them. And the pond pump, while 110, is also hard-wired into the the circuit, so it's not convenient to use a plug-in watt meter on it, either.

Anyway, I was able to determine that the pond pump, at its usual flow setting and speed, uses about 130 watts 7x24. The well pump, about 950 watts when it's running. The air compressor has the same size motor so I'm guessing it uses about the same wattage.

Meanwhile I plugged everything in the home office desk into the watt meter. When the computer, DSL modem, router, printer, and router are all running, it uses about 200 watts. With the computer turned off but everything else on, about 55 watts (printer in sleep mode). For a while I was leaving the computer etc on 7x24, but have started switching power off to everything when I'm asleep, not home, or not intending to use it for an extended period when I am home.

I also cut back on the amount of time the well pump runs - no need to saturate the ground every day, esp. when the heat wave isn't on.

At $.25 per KWh, every bit helps.

 

[everythingold]

By various improvements I have dropped my 1893 Building's gas bill from a $750 peak to $325. The Gas company calls me and they want to install a new meter. OK. My meter is in my basement. I could steal all the gas I want. I don't. But a meter in the basement is basically a license to steal. They ask if there i any day I am available from 9-5. I say

"No."

"I am an appliance repair man."

"But your crew could call me anytime they might be near and I could work it out with them"

Gas company tele-clerk:

"That is not our policy."

"There is no day you are ever available?"

Me:

"No."

Gas company tele-clerk:

"OK. Ummm, I guess have a nice day."

Me:

"You too."

LOL