Classic car question

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spiralactivator

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Well, today my '95 Ford Taurus stalled on a busy highway, but since I never cared for the blasted thing anyway, I'm gonna start looking for a new car. My goal is a small economy box-on-wheels (I like to crank my windows; it's exercise) that's dependable and easy on gas. I have found a used car available from a private seller that fits the bill:

A 1976 Ford Pinto!!! (No explosion jokes, please.)

I've contacted the seller for some information (condition, mileage, driveability), but have not heard back yet. If it runs and does not need major repairs, I think I'm going for it.

Does anyone here have any experience driving a Pinto? I've heard a lot of positives and negatives.

(Again, no explosion jokes, please. Any car goes kaboom if hit hard enough...and it's a likely prospect if the stupid thing stalls in rush hour traffic!)
 
Well it may be collectible but back in the early 70's I drove a Pinto station wagon occasionally making deliveries for a pharmacy and it wasn't pleasant. It was noisy, cheap, and you had to almost floor the thing to move forward. I'm surprised there's still one on the road because I haven't seen one in who knows how long. Most of them rusted away probably.
 
Both of My mom's sisters had Pintos and they weren't bad cars. Yes they were gutless and noisy, but they got great mileage, and their service record wasn't terrible. Hell, My '95 Ford Power Stroke Diesel Van, which are supposed to be so great has certainly had it's share of problems.
 
Just my gut feeling, but a 30 year old car almost certainly is going to need major repairs. You might get lucky... if the owner can show records of regular maintenance/tuneups/repairs, then it might be ok. But most collectors of classic cars pretty much assume that a new aquisition will need a complete mechanical teardown and restore.

Also, if your state required smog inspections, that could be a deal killer. In California, if a car that is newer than 1975 doesn't pass smog, it can't be registered or legally driven on the roads.

I don't know your budget, but I would probably lean towards getting a later vintage car, with electronic ignition/fuel injection. Mazda's 323 was a nice little econobox, and you couldn't really go wrong with Toyota's offerings. I would avoid Mitsubshi stuff. Exciting when new, but I just don't think they have the reliability record of other mfg's.
 
We had two Pintos, a 1971 and a 1975. Nice looking little cars, and relatively cheap to operate, it you know how to work on cars.
We had one with the 2000cc motor and as pointed out by others, it was slower than molasses. The 75' had the 2600cc motor and the accelration was, er.. acceptable.
You still see one on the road around here now and then. A woman at the airport here has a 77 that is still in showroom shape. But I would be very concerned about the fire hazards. When hit from behind not only do they catch on fire, but the doors jam trapping you in the burning car. What happens is that the spare tire bracket impacts the gas tank in a rear ender.
The Mazda 323 IS a very nice auto and we have a freind who as one of the early models. It currently has 250,000 on the clock and is still running strong! They always used synthetic motor oil in it.
 
My $.02

The Pinto explosion problem was corrected in later years cars, and the earlier ones were brought back to the dealers for a fix. The 4 cylinder engine is still used to this day, in Ranger pick ups, it is a good one, has been turbo charged in the turbo coupe T-birds from 83-88, and it was in the fox body Mustangs until 1993 in naturally aspirated form. That being said, the seats were terrible, tires skinny and handling was so so even for those days. Any vintage car is going to be hard to use for a daily driver IMHO, as things just wear out, parts are not easy to come by for a lot of them. Now, if you could find an older Mustang, Camaro, Cutlass, etc., you can build the whole car out of parts that are readily available. Reliability from the early 70's thru the 80's was not great on american cars. I agree with others, it is fun to have a car like that, but not as a daily driver. Look for a used Accord V6 if you want total dependability, but even then, it has to be one that was maintained properly.

Scott
 
My next classic car will be...

You guessed it.

A convertible VW Bug from between 68-72. You could build a whole Bug from parts (besides the chassis).
 
I owned a '76 Pinto...

from 1976 to 1981. As others have mentioned, by that time Ford had worked out the initial design flaws. The engine displacement as I recall was 2300cc. (4 cylinder) and it was fine for zipping around St. Louis traffic. (where I lived then) Stupid things happened to it. Once I moved to Arizona, I drove over a dirt road mountain pass with it and stove in the oil pan. I was really poor then, so I had someone to fix it by hammering it out and epoxying up the hole. It dripped oil on my driveway ever after. It was a manual shift car, and the clutch was operated by a cable in a rigid housing, like bicycle brake cables. One day I stepped on the clutch, and the cable housing pulled through the hole in the firewall. This left the clutch pedal on the floor, the clutch fully engaged, and the driver mighty surprised. The only other problems I had with it were broken rubber timing belts. Fortunately the design of the valves is such that the pistons do not contact them if they are open when the belt breaks, so you avoid very costly repair. After three years in Arizona with no air conditioning, I got rid of it in favor of a vehicle that had it. The Pinto had around 80000 miles on it then. I saw it running around Tucson a couple of times in later years, so it was reasonably durable.
 
I drove a newer one...

years back that had air and it was an automatic. It was not powerful, it was owned by an auto parts store that I worded at and was used to deliver parts. It's air worked great and everyone wanted to drive it instead of the beat up three on the tree Chevy Van that we had.

We are talking carburator, basic ignition, etc, so these are a cakewalk to work on. If the motor does not have a ton of miles, and it's not smoking, I would replace the battery (unless it's new), brakes, core the radiator, belts, hoses, plugs, plug wires, and maybe even replace the fuel pump with an electric one. Someone mentioned its skinny tires, you can get beefier ones for cheap when you replace your tires.

Drive the heck out of it then for very little dollars. Should it have a bunch of problems later on, retire it for weekend fun and you are not out that much at all.

I had a friend who did something similar with a Bobcat wagon, the Mercury version of it, and had little problem.

For parts and other info try:

http://www.fordpinto.com/
 
Seeing Kevin's post reminded me...

I drove that Pinto to Los Angeles once. One day I was southbound on the Hollywood Fwy at a point where the five-lane width was going to split three to the left and two to the right. I was in the middle lane, and wanted to take the left fork. Some elderly guy right behind me wanted to take the right fork, and while he was looking for an opening to change lanes, he smacked right into me as the traffic in my lane had come to a stop. I was not hurt, but I was totally paranoid about stopping in the middle of L.A. so I kept going. When I got back to Anaheim where I was staying, I apprehensively got out to check the rear of the car. There was NO damage. The "impact absorbing" bumpers had done their job. And, of course, there was no explosion. RE. tires: the skinny tires were A-series, but my Pinto was a station wagon and it had B-series tires all along.
 
Ford pintos

I just sold a 1979 Pinto cruising sport station wagon with the roof rack and porthole windows it was a great car believe it or not the 4cyl eng. was more durable than the 6 cyl. it was excellent on gas ,being 6 2" it was still a comfortable car for me to drive i still see a lot of them on the road here in southern cal. unlike the chevy vega!!! just make sure you have a good timing belt thats about it great little car john
 
My high-school shop tweaked out a Pinto cruising wagon for a multi-class project. The body shop redid the body, repairing all the rust, dings, and repainted it a "fade" paint job that started metallic red by the roof, and blended to a dark silver at the bottom.

The Auto mechanics class installed a Mustang 5.0 engine in it with a Tremec 5-speed transmission, and an all new axle and rearend in it.

The electronics class, which I was in, did all sorts of electrical and electronics work on the car. We installed a nice CD changer sound system with over 14 speakers within. We also installed a security system with remote keyless entry, and installed power windows, and a digital instrument cluster. We also helped the HVAC class with the the wiring for the air conditioning system.

The textiles class and the auto body shop did the interior up, and they fitted with with Recaro seats and stuff.

The car was outstanding when it was finished, and it was displayed at several show n shines. They ran it at a local drag strip, and it was doing low 14's in the quarter mile. They also tested it on a slalom course to see how much better the handling was over the stock pinto. Although not a lot of suspension work was done, the addition of good sized tires made a BIG difference! The amazing thing was that it was getting around 26 MPG's throughout the testing and road use.

After the car finished all it's touring and testing, it went to auction at one of the local shopping malls. It ended up getting sold for around $10,000, which even for 1992 was quite a lot of money. On rare occasions, I still see the car around town at shows and other custom car events, but rarely ever see it driving on the highway. I'm sort of glad such a cool custom car that a lot of kids put work into is being well cared for, but it's also sort of a shame that such it isn't really being used to it's fullest extent. We built the car to be not only a cool custom ride, but also to be a great daily driver!
 
Pinto engine is 1/2 of a Mustang 289 engine!

The venerable 2.3 liter engine that Ford has used for so long is basically their familiar small-block 289 engine chopped in half. That's why it's so good, and also why the 302 fits right into the engine bay!
 
So they might be worth restoring then? I would like to show you all a restoration I had done in a near future post.
 
I checked the NADA values, and they didn't look too good, But I think they have been known to miss the mark more than once. I looked at the classics section of WWW.NADA.COM and I quote, "Into classics and collectibles are you? Have you seen the feautures and functionalities of the NEW models?" So I don't think they get it.
 
mazda 323

I drive a Mazda 323 from 1993. It has 156000 miles on it, and it gets 38 miles per gallon!~
I just love the thing, 'cause it's a hatch back - which means I can haul washing machines and hi-fi's in it!~ My Zenith Console came home in my Mazda 323 - hanging out the back, of course. I also brought home my Creda washing machine in that car. It runs like new and doesn't even use a quart of oil between changes.
 
Hey SA:

Would you mind letting us know what you decide to do? I think I still have some old Ford books around here somewhere, one of which covers Pintos.
 
Thanks, everybody, for the info. I'd love to get this car, but it's apparently being sold by people who never answer their phone. It's not restored, but it looks to be in really good shape. The apparent defects are:

A cracked grille (chromed plastic--glue)

A 2-inch rust spot on the hood (can be retouched)

Chrome trim around back window has loose seam (reglue)

One flat tire

Mechanically, all I know is that nothing is pouring out of it and that it must run, because it's been moved to different positions around the lot where it's being sold. If I do manage to get in touch with the seller, my brother (who is more mechanically inclined than I) will come with me to look under the hood.

My favorite car is actually the AMC Pacer, and I used to see them all the time when I was in college (2001-2005). It seemed like everyone who wasn't driving Daddy's SUV was driving a Pacer or a Caprice Classic.
 
Have you got your Taurus checked out? A 1995 is still a fairly new car. Unless you cracked a rod in the engine or something like that I'm sure it's getting worth fixed. I would recommend getting the Pinto for a second car and not getting rid of your old one.

You need to check all the fluid levels before you start it up, this will tell you how it has been maintained and how much leakage there is (oil, antifreeze, transmission fluid).


I would count on replacing the tires, brakes, master cylinder, radiator/heater hoses,rubber fuel lines and fuel pump, alternator/voltage regulator/battery, spark plugs and wires.
I did all this to a 1978 Mercury Grand Marquis with more than 250,000 miles on it and it drives well, 50 miles a day, 7 days a week.
Especially I would replace all the charging system stuff first thing. This is the only thing that ever gave me trouble consistenly on Fords was problems with the alternator and voltage regulator. Most times the "ALT"ernator warning light does not work right so you don't know there's trouble till it's too late.
 
You know I'm going to second Chad's motion (the final decision is of course, up to you) and say it might be worth your while to fix. How many miles does it have? Is it the one with the 3.8 liter or the newer 3.0 liter engine. I forget if it was 95 or 96 when the Taurus/Sable got it's makeover. I have a 1997 Mercury Sable station wagon and I like it a lot, it has really served me well.
 
I love Pacers too. I was in USA as an exchange student in 1981 and saw Pacers for the first time. I read that they were designed for a Wankel rotary engine but AMC didn't have it developed in time so in went the ancient 6 cylinder motor. My favourite was the later one with the more station wagon shaped back, the earlier one with the sloping hatchback didn't look as good to me. There is only one Pacer in this country, it was imported for the Melbourne Motor Show but AMC pulled out of Australia shortly after (1975? 1976?) so the model was never released. On Pacers the right side door is longer than the left side to encourage rear seat passengers to exit on the kerb side, but in right hand drive Australia this "feature" is the wrong way round!
The Australian importer of AMC cars (They were all badged as Rambler here) quit AMC in the late 1970s as the Rambler Hornet and Rambler Matador were very slow sellers, they also dropped Triumph from UK and became Toyota Australia, I guess that was a good move...

Chris.
 
Havent' seen a Pacer or a Gremlin (even longer) in a loooong long time. To me they were hideous looking akin to "clown cars" The Pacer was touted for it's width wasn't it, with the ad showing a guy putting in a 6ft sub sandwich. Gremlins came in those horrible colors. ugh
 
My Taurus has about 150,000 miles on it and has just gotten a new air cleaner (shouldn't stall now, but we'll see) and $400 worth of brake work that I'm still paying off. I inherited it from my father, who bought it in early 1996. It's definitely driveable, but I never liked it, even when I was a kid. For the past couple of days I've been driving my mother's car, a gas-sucking Dodge Intrepid that occasionally kicks its computerized heater on to blow super-hot air in my face (which cannot be turned off until the car decides to).

I used to have a Plymouth Acclaim that I loved dearly--until the radiator blew up on the interstate. My automobile track record is not good.
 
I knew a woman who owned an automatic Pacer back in the 70's. She was all jazzed about it, until she discovered what horrible gas mileage it got, as well as getting very hot in the sun due to all the upper glass. She was also on the hefty side, and always trying to lose weight. I kept my mouth shut about the "wide ride" aspect of the Pacer, lol. She eventually dumped the Pacer and perhaps not coincidentally also lost a lot of weight.

I think the Pacer was featured in the movie "Wayne's World". It does have a kind of retro chic to it nowadays, but I'd much prefer a 21 window VW minivan.

I'm a bit surprised to hear the Intrepid guzzles gas. Perhaps it was the first generation model, with the older 3.3 liter motor? I have a 300M that gets reasonable mileage - up to 28 on the freeway, and usually around 18 or better for mixed city/highway lead foot driving. For a 250 hp car, that's not bad. Any non-hybrid car will get poor mileage in stop and go city driving. My automatic Neon drops from an average 25 mpg in mixed city/highway to 16 mpg when I only drive it five miles each day in town. But then, it refuses to shift into 3rd gear until the transmission is completely warmed up.
 

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