Detergent test in progress

[DADoES]

Hopefully I won't get bored with it or neglect to follow through.

Have a pair of socks from last time I trimmed the yard. They've sat for bit more than a week, I think. 8 days. Took a "before" pic, washed one this evening in a large load (but not a BobLoad®) using 7 oz. of Foca (yes there was a suds cake) with 1.5 oz. oxy-booster. 140°F EcoActive, maximum soil level (wash time), 2 hr soak option. Will do the other next time a load of whites comes around, with Tide Coldwater, same cycle options, but cold water and no oxy-booster. Or should I use oxy-booster?

The one washed today didn't do bad, but has some small degree of staining left. The point isn't necessarily to get the socks pristine, but to see which detergent does better.

It'll be another 8 to 9 days until I get another full load of whites. Maybe the additional "set time" will skew the results?

 

[frigilux]

I'm interested to see how the Tide CW does on its own with whites; I always use liquid chlorine bleach on my white loads, so I'd like to see how it does 'flying solo'. From my experiment last winter, I think it will do better if you use temp-controlled cold rather than tap cold. Also, using liquid Tide CW will produce different results than using the powdered version. Which do you plan to use?

Let us know how it all goes, Glenn. I love experiments like this, mostly because we often get differing results due to differences in washers, chemical makeup of stains and water quality. How hard or soft is your water?

 

[launderess]

If using water temp below 100F, forget about any perborate bleach even with a bleach activator. Percarbonte bleach will work,but will need a VERY long time, so best of forgotten as well.

IIRC Tide CW does contain "special" cold water oxygen bleach/activators, but my guess is they really poured in the activator to get any sort of oxygen bleaching action in cool or cold water.

Keep us posted!

L.

 

[frigilux]

So you're up late, too, eh, Launderess? I'm actually up (very) early for a trip to Minneapolis. Going to have brunch with friends at Ike's downtown.

Back to detergents: I would guess most detergents with perborate bleach don't suggest washing in cold water, then?

 

[DADoES]

Tap-cold over here this time of year is 80°F more or less.

Coldwater powder.

'ccording to the Kinetico salesdroid, my water is 11 grains hardness.

 

[frigilux]

Here's a chart of water hardness from a Virginia home extension brochure:

 

[frigilux]

Out of curiosity, I just checked my tap cold water temp: 68-degrees on the nose.

In the dead of winter, mine gets down to the mid-to-upper 40's. It's like getting refrigerated water from the tap.

I also noticed that, during the winter, nearly half the wash fill was warm water when I selected temp-controlled cold.

 

[DADoES]

Before

Two dirty socks, eight days old. Both were covered with bits of grass (the LAWN kind), which is already picked off.

 

[DADoES]

One sock washed

As mentioned previously: 7 oz. Foca, 1.5 oz. oxy-booster. 140°F EcoActive wash, followed by the typical cold/cool deep wash. Maximum soil level/wash time (but not Stained, which would alternate several agitate/soak periods), added 2 hr soak option (~5 agitation strokes every minute). The soak period follows the main wash time, with a few more minutes of wash after soaking. Full load, but not a BobLoad®, medium-high water level.

 

[frigilux]

Looks pretty clean to me, Glenn! What exactly does the EcoActive cycle do?

My Ariel just arrived today, so I'm going to take it for a test run. It says I should be using Ariel Bajaspuma for use in frontload machines (I'm guessing that would be the HE/low sudsing version? I'll have to visit a translation site to find out what all the Spanish instructions say) but I've been using non-HE detergents in my Frigidaire without any mishaps, so far.

Boy, does it smell sweet---kinda like a huge package of SweetTarts or something. My whole laundry room reeks of Ariel.

 

[appnut]

I agree, looks pretty good to me too, but what can I see lol. Did you use the allergy cycle? That's the only cycle/lifestyle cycle I remember with the 140 degree ecoactive.

 

[gyrafoam]

But Glenn, without the oxy-booster, the Tide won't have a "level" playing field.

I am curious to see what happens.

 

[DADoES]

Eugene, EcoActive just refers to a part of the Fisher & Paykel wash cycle. Sort of a "catalyst" pretreat. The machine fills with enough water at the selected temperature to saturate the load and allow for recirculation, then it's showered over the load while the basket rotates at 23 RPM. The agitated deep wash (there's no drain first, otherwise the detergent would have to be recharged) fills with controlled-cold. Exposure to the 140°F temp was only for about 7 minutes. Wash time isn't set in minutes, but on a range of five soil levels, plus Stained. Higher soil level gives longer EcoActive time, and longer / more aggressive agitation. Stained alternates four periods of agitation and soaking, which is separate from the specific 2-hr Soak option.

Bob, no LifeCycle. Just "normal" with Hot wash manually selected, plus Soak.

Steve, that's true. But oxy-booster wouldn't have much effect in cold water, correct? Far as I understand, Tide Coldwater is optimized for 65°F to 75°F.

Look closely at the washed sock compared to its dirty self. There're still faint stains on the elastic band, and just below it. I took the pics with natural light, flash overexposed the details.

 

[gyrafoam]

O.K. I get it. I was thinking you might use the same water temperature for both.

It just never occurs to me that anyone in their right mind would regularly use cold water to wash in!

I'm partial to boiling water myself----steam would also be good.

 

[appnut]

Trust me, with that Oxy-booster and a total hot water ecoactive as well as wash and soak, that sock would have come out totally clean. It's the only way I get my whites white now--a cool pre-wash with Biz and then hot water (150 degrees) wash & at least 75 min. soak with enzyme-based detergent & Oxy-Clean

 

[frigilux]

Steve-- Believe me, I fully understand your aversion to washing whites in cold water. I never, EVER thought I'd do it. It seems counterintuitive. But powdered Tide CW changed my mind. I've been using it for six months and my whites are gleaming---plus all the usual stains actually come out better. Maybe it's because they're not 'set' from using hot water, or something. I do use liquid chlorine bleach on my white loads, always.

 

[DADoES]

Steve, there are some LifeCycles that use higher temperature combinations. The Allergy cycle that Bob mentioned for example -- hot EcoActive followed by hot/warm (controlled to 125°F if the household supply is at least that high) deep wash. The machine is very flexible. Under "normal" cycle circumstances the selected temperature applies only to the EcoActive fill. There is an option for a "traditional" wash that skips the EcoActive phase and does a full deep wash at the selected temperature.

Anyway, the remaining sock will be washed with the next full whites load, with Tide Coldwater powder and cycle conditions as closely the same as possible except for, of course, cold water.

 

[frigilux]

In CR's tests, they tried using hot water with Tide CW and the results were not as good as with cold water. Go figure! I wonder if hot water deactivates some miracle chemical in the detergent...

I just did my first load using Mexican Ariel. I used hot water (mine's about 145 degrees) and Clorox Ultimate Care liquid chlorine bleach. It was a BobLoad® of whites. It did a fantastic job. Everything looks great and stains were removed well.

Does Mexican Ariel have phosphates? I noticed the only thing printed in English on the bag was NOT FOR SALE IN AMERICA. Pretty green powder with little blue bits. Love the sickly sweet smell, too. Smells like someone shoved a couple of SweetTarts up my nose. I took a scoop from the Tide box (no scoop in the Ariel bag) and used a 'medium' load dosage. It didn't oversuds at all, but the suds were very tenacious. I actually used an extra rinse, which I almost never do.

Next time I'll wash the whites with Ariel in warm water and see how it does. Now that I'm used to washing in cold, I'd like to stick as close to that as possible. I've noticed fabrics last longer when washed in cold.

My box of German Persil should arrive in the next day or so. I'm excited to give that a try, too.

 

[westtexman]

Great Experiment Glenn . . .

I love detergent experimentation. You are a man after my own heart! I have been pondering washing with lower water temperatures myself. I have experimented on lights, but I have been to big of a "chicken" to try it on my whites. I can't wait to see how the Tide CW works out!

Eugene -

I am glad you enjoyed the Mexican Ariel. It DOES contain phosphates, which I believe really boosts the cleaning ability. I really hope you like your German Persil. I would have to say that Persil is my ALL TIME FAVORITE detergent (and believe me - I've tried many). It is the best smelling detergent I've smelled since 1980's Oxydol!

As far as using German Persil in cooler water, I think I remember Launderess saying that German Persil works better in hot water, perhaps due to the Perborate bleach it contains. I know that I get great results at temperatures between 140*F-200*F, though I've not tried it on whites at lower temperatures. I like to mix my Persil with a little STTP to give it even more of a boost! Have fun experimenting!

Bryan

 

[launderess]

The sweet spot for Persil is wash temps of 100F and above, though temps of 120F+ give better results. Yes, it tis the oxygen bleaching system. Best results of all are "profile" washes starting from 80F to 90F and working up to the hotter water temps. Oxygen bleaches will also work to set certian stains if the water temp is too hot starting out.

FWIW washed a load today in Tide with Bleach at 140F and all came out CLEAN, I tell you, clean. So bright had to put on my sunglasses. Didn't even add extra oxygen bleach per my usual routine.

Have also solved the mystery as to why Tide w Bleach was not causing so much suds. As I've stated previously here and elsewhere, it is due to soap.

Have been using up to 1/4 cup of Tide w Bleach for a 11lb load of whites (mixed bath items, T-shirts, undies, etc)and each time there has been little or no suds. However when tried washing some linens, using only 1 tablespoon, there was lots of froth. Taking a shower one day, it dawned on me, the residual soap on our wash cloths must help control suds. We use a French soap made of olive oil (Savon de Marseille), and there are always several wash cloths in my "whites" load. As a test added about 1/2 tablespoon of grated Fels to a load of linens being washed in Tide, and lord and behold, sudsing was decreased. Same effect when added some grated vintage Armour's Floating Soap.

Did some more research and it appears long chain soaps are very good at suds suppression. So there you have it.

Am very impressed with Tide w Bleach, and would put it up against Persil any day of the week. My box of Tide CW is still in my laundry product stash, hardly used and nearly full. Just find the scent a bit strong, more so because I line dry most of my laundry. Items put into the dryer tend to loose much of the scent.

Another great detergent is Ecolab's Soild Super Star. Mainly STPP, washing soda, and surfactant (NPE), this stuff cleans greasy/oily soils very well. Makes no suds and takes very little (we're talking 2-5 grams here), to get the job done.

L.

 

[gyrafoam]

I wonder if the "new generation" of cold water type detergents do a better job of getting rid of grease and body oil residue.

The mechanics out there will agree, you can always tell a "cold water" machine, because when you open it up the inside of the outer tub has a thick layer of the most disgusting black slime-----old body oil and grease and Lawd knows what other types of slippery thangs.
VERY NASTY!

I'll stick to Viva/Fab and as warm a water as the fabric can stand.
I'll also stick to good old chlorine bleach----still the only thing that really kills cooties.

 

[launderess]

Think the difference between today's cold water detergents, and those of years past are enzymes and surfactants that work well in cold water. Tide CW was highly rated by CR when washing in cold water, but results were less satisfactory when the same product was used in hot water. So it stands to reason whatever is in Tide CW has been designed or only works well in cold water.

Also older washing machines did not have automatic temp controls, by and large. This meant whatever temp cold tap water was, is what went into the washer. We all know detergents, especially powders will not work well at temps below 80F.

Still, for all but the most delicate items, or those really prone to colour running, I stick to 100F (warm water) washes to be on the safe side.

 

[toggleswitch]

I went back to warm water with this simple statement learned from the site.

Warm water is needed to melt and dissolve body oils.
Short, sweet and to the point!

I am guessing that you can always tell a machine that is used by a heavy fabric-softener user, as well! I certainly can see it a mile off!

 

[DADoES]

Wash of the 2nd sock in Tide Coldwater powder is happening now. Pic coming soon.

 

[westtexman]

Can't wait to see the final results . . .

I will be up all night doing taxes (alas, my extension has run out - LOL), so I will be checking back to see. That will determine if I want to use Foca or Tide Coldwater on my next load of whites!

Did you use Oxiclean on this load, or did you choose to use it without?

Bryan

 

[DADoES]

No oxy-booster. Same cycle selection as the first load ("Regular" @ Heavy Soil, with 2-hr Soak option), except of course Cold+ temperature, which is tap-cold anyway this time of year. About the same size load as last time, but more smaller items and fewer bath towels. IWL12 selected "Firm" wash this time, likely attributed to fewer towels. (The 1st test load was "Maximum" wash IIRC. Probably would have been "Strong" or "Active" at normal soil level.) 5 oz. Tide for EcoActive, then added 2 oz. more, which ends up being the recommended 7/8 cup for large/heavy soil loads. I had intended to add the additional 2 oz. right away during deep wash fill, but I made a phone call and missed it until deep wash was already going. Still, the load got the "full charge" of detergent for most of the wash period, plus the soak time and the post-soak agitation.

In both cases I placed the test sock on top so it got full exposure to the EcoActive spray.

Keep in mind also this 2nd sock had another two weeks of "stand-time."

I'm still at the night job so the results pic may not get posted tonight. Load will need tossing to the dryer when I get home ... unless I take a "wet" pic.

 

[westtexman]

When you say oxy-booster . . .

What brand are you using? I'm curious.

 

[DADoES]

Whatever was at Wal-Mart, LOL! I think it's Sun? I dump the cannister into a jar. Don't recall if it all fit, if so then I no longer have the cannister to check the brand. I may swing by WM tonight, will take a look if I do (unless I forget).

 

[Cybrvanr]

When doing those comparason tests like commercials do, in order to get accurate shots, make sure the before and after shots were done in EXACTLY the same lighting conditions, and using the same exact settings on the camera (can be a challenge with an automatic camera!) This is one of the devious tricks that degergent manufacturers use when posting pictures on TV or in print...they adjust the exposure or lighting to make the "after" on the favored brand appear that much brighter and cleaner.

Of course, you disposed of that issue by placing both a washed and unwashed sock in the same picture!

 

[DADoES]

Wal-Mart was out of the oxybooster when I checked last night. The shelf label simply says "Oxy Wash $1.88." Obviously it's the cheap stuff.

Pic is taken, hopefully posted (much) later tonight. Foca + oxybooster @ 140°Ftap-cold bested Tide Coldwater powder @ tap-cold by a margin.