Dishwasher Questions

[ibuzzard]

Thanks to xpanam's thread over in Shoppers Square, I am to soon be the owner of a (new?, new-ish?) older Lady Kenmore dishwasher. I could possibly have it early next week, if my co-worker, who resides down in La-La Land, can arrange to retrieve it this weekend when he returns home.

I do have questions, having never owned a top-loader. This DW is a compromise for me, as I really am seeking a TOL Kitchenaide portable to hold us over till we can do a kitchen/laundry remodel at some point in the future, at which time we'll install a built-in.

First, if you can check out thread # 64965 - what is it? Is it any good, or will it be a dissapointment?
Are top loaders much smaller capacity, difficult to load?Does this one heat its' own water, dry the dishes? Will I have trouble finding parts? Will appliance repair places balk at working on it, even if I locate parts?
Can anyone with direct experience with this model give me a frank assessment?

Finally, thanks in advance for any help. I am a tech-tard, not even owning a cell phone, but will try to post a few photos when I have it.

Steve

 

[panthera]

Hi Steve,

We've had various top-loading dishwashers and still use our TL Kitchenaid every so often when we have big parties.

Generally speaking, a TL will always wash the silverware and everything in the bottom rack better than any current dishwasher on the market. Hands down.

Top rack(s)?

For these to be washed well - and they can be - requires a tiny bit of care in loading. As long as the spray patterns on top (I don't care what anybody says about that top impeller being more or less useless on FLs, it's not on TL dishwashers, not by a long shot) and coming up from the bottom are not blocked, the stuff up top gets clean, too.

Rinse aid is a must. Really soft, hot water is a must. Adding TSP or STTP helps there, a lot.

 

Based on my experience, I'd say you'll love the cleaning in the bottom rack from the get-go. It will take you a little bit to reach the point at which the upper stuff comes out perfectly clean, but you'll be happy with her once you're there.

Suggestion: Put a cup right side UP in each of the furthest from center places of the top rack. Load the bottom rack with a typical pots/pans/dishes/bowls pattern then run the first cycle for one minute. Which cup is full? Which is partially full? Which is empty? This will tell you more about how to load than anything else.

 

Let us know, I'm curious how it goes.

Oh - and our Kitchenaid 15 is an absolute B-I-A-T-C-H to work on, so don't get too excited about them. Kitchenaid was very well built (today they're just Whirlpool trash) but having had several, they're not as good at cleaning and rinsing as a GE Tower-of-Power with multi--orbital arm. Nor more durable. Just better built.

 

[Chetlaham]

GE equal to Kitchen Aid?

Im confused. Kitchen-aid is far better at cleaning from my experience. It has direct water filtration and more water pressure. Dedicated wash arms, no dreaded pop up towers.

 

[panthera]

Chet,

Having had both (vintage), and being steadfastly opposed to pre-rinsing anything, ever, the GE multiorbital cleans better. Even CR (choking on having to admit it) was astonished that the Twenty Eight Hundred was the best. I like our Kitchenaid TL a lot, but I'm just not that impressed by the cleaning. It's kind of a religious thing around here, though, so I expect nobody to agree with me.

the three Superba we've repaired and given away were great - but they're just not for cleaning dirty pots, not really. 

Now - which is better built? Kitchenaid, hands down. The real ones, of course, not the Whirlpool trash. Which cleans baked on starch off better? Eggs? Avocados? The multi-orbital GE, no question.

[this post was last edited: 4/12/2016-21:46]

 

[toploader55]

Top Loading Portables.

KitchenAid TL Portables are great cleaners and very powerful machines BUT... They are single wash arm machines.

Loading is extremely restricted and can be complicated until you get used to them. You can place a mixing bowl or Large pot in the lower rack and expect items in the top rack directly over the bowl or pot NOT to get clean. Lower Racks on Single Arm KitchenAids (aka One Arm Wonders) are restricted to Plates saucers and mostly flat items with cereal or soup bowls arranged around the outer perimeter of the rack.The upper rack are free game to deep items, glasses, coffee mugs etc.
You may place a Large Pot or Mixing Bowl in the lower rack but anything placed directly above that item more than likely not be clean. Especially glasses or cups.

However caution must be used when lowering the lid as if the items (ie Wine Glasses or tall items) can get crushed and broken as the rack lowers into the chamber and the lid comes down on top of them.

This will be true with GE with lift top racks as well.

The GE Mobile Maid series with the "Dreaded Tower" are actually Very Good Cleaners. These have a top Spray (Power Shower) , a Lower Wash Arm and the Tower will clean the items in the upper rack pretty darn good. Most GE Mobile Maids will drain your town's reservoir water supply washing one load as they consume very large amounts of water. Especially the later designs with the "Clown's Shoe" Wash Arm.

If I had a choice as a Daily Driver The Mobile Maid has more versatile loading than the KitchenAid.

Now... The machine you have purchased has the Split Roto Rack. I am not really a Vintage Kenmore guy but I will assume (which is the wrong thing to do but I'll do it anyway...) so you have some versatility in loading. There is a upper feed tube to clean the underside of the upper rack which also supplies the force to spin the upper rack. with the force of the spray.

So, all and all you have a nice machine there.

I may very well be wrong with the configuration of the upper rack on your model, but the consensus is that it a Whirlpool built machine which is a better build and design than a D+M.

Good Luck and may all your Washes be Yibble Free.

And the Experts shall arrive shortly on the exact specifications of your machine.

 

[chachp]

Older Roto Rack machine..

<span style="font-family: verdana, geneva;">Honestly, I think you will get as many opinions as there are models to comment on.  You really won't know what you've got until you get your machine and test it out.  I believe these machines did heat the water and I believe the general consensus is the Roto-Racks did a decent job cleaning.</span>

 

<span style="font-family: verdana, geneva;">The top loaders are a little more of a challenge because you will be constantly lifting out or lifting up and over one side of the upper rack to get to the bottom but it still beats washing by hand.  If you get a good one I suspect you'll be happy with it.</span>

 

<span style="font-family: verdana, geneva;">As far as repairing them, you WILL get the help you need on this site but you WILL also likely need to do the repair yourself or enlist the help of a friend who has a mechanical aptitude.  I have repaired a number of machines myself (to many folks surprise because I'm not particularly fond of ruining a good manicure) and you will be surprised at how easy many of these machines are to work on.  Once you get past the first one and realize it's not so bad you may likely enjoy the task.</span>

 

<span style="font-family: verdana, geneva;">So if the question is SHOULD I get this machine, and you don't think you can deal with a top loader, then maybe you should wait for something else to come along.</span>

 

<span style="font-family: verdana, geneva;">If you have already committed to it I would just wait and see what you get.  You may get a very pleasant surprise.</span>

 

[appnut]

The only water heating this does, particularly thermostatically timer held until the temp is reached is the final rinse when Sani Rinse cycle is selected. 

 

As far as the comment about CR being astonished the GE GSD2800 was the best at cleaning with its MultiOrbit wash arm, well, that told me right there that the GSD1200 with the same wash system would perform just as well and hence I wouldn't consider any other dishwasher--KitchenAid or WP PowerClean!!!!!

 

[ibuzzard]

Thanks, . . .!

. . . In more ways than one.

I appreciate the ' schooling ' on this machine. At any rate, whether or not She Who Must Be Obeyed appreciates it, it is cheap, and can be resold, I imagine. It does satisfy my philosphy of restoring our old cabin a bit at a time, using nice vintage materials. I never had a desire for a top-loader, wanting to buy a Kitchenaid KDS 58, or similar, but they've proved illusive.

Now, I also enjoy it when I , as an added bonus, inadvertently stir the pot, as I get to watch some entertainment, as the devotees of their specific brands hash it out on a public forum. Worth the price of admission!

Just as people drive different vehicles, and for varying reasons, the same seems to apply with appliances. I am not all that loyal to a specific brand, After all, I am not a collector, I am a 'user' searching for good daily drivers in appliances.I only want something that is really in great shape, has the vintage quality and design, and keeps my wife (sort of) happy.

Thanks, Steve

 

[panthera]

Steve,

The knowledge base here is enormous. I've always been helped, you will be, too.

There are very strong opinions here on brand, color and water/detergent use.

 

That's just part of the fun. 

 

Kitchenaid (as always, we're talking about the real products, not the trash from Whirlpool), paid attention to every single little detail. I had no problem restringing the heating element on our TL when it blew out on her 40th birthday. I did, however, need 10 minutes to get to the dratted thing, however. Typical Kitchenaid.

GE, pre-Jack Welch, may he rot in hell, frequently combined cutting edge technology like PermaTuf tubs or the multiorbital arms with 'good enough for govn'mnt work' assembly methods such as using those old wire-tie bread wrapper ties to hold wires together when even D&M was using nylon cable ties.

This is offensive, no way around it - and I like GE. A lot.

 

As to color - whoboy, let's just say some of us have very strong feelings about pretty colors such as PANK!, turquoise, Sunny Yellow versus rejects from the Exorcist films colors such as avocado green and harvest gold.

 

 

[panthera]

GSD 1200

We have one and it works exactly as well as the GSD2800, but without the constant sensor problems. If I could only have one and it had to be a daily driver, it would be the choice. Best cleaning dishwasher design ever.

 

 

[turquoisedude]

I'm pretty biased about top-loader dishwashers... I grew up with an impeller-wash Westinghouse-made one, so I got used to the quirks of loading and washability that a top-loader can present. 

 

As others have stated, a lot depends on the washing system.  I use a '56 GE impeller-wash dishwasher regularly at the house in Ogden and as long as it's loaded "correctly" it does a great job.  But I also alternate with a 1970 GE MobileMaid that has the wash arm and tower system and it's nice to know that if I put a pot or bowl face-down it won't result in unwashed glasses in the top rack.  I've also been using a 65 Kenmore 600 Roto-Rack from time to time (and this despite warnings about having three dishwashers in the kitchen...); this one has an impeller but it also has a short spray arm to ensure the upper rack rotates through a constant spray.  

 

If I had to pick, though, I have to admit the 70 GE is the best for ease of loading and washing ability.   I say that not having ever had a chance to use my '65 Canadian GE MobileMaid with the arm and tower plus the Power Shower plus the much-maligned Silver Shower...  So I may just change my recommendation at some point  LOL