Hello everybody. I have a GE post filter-flo washer from 2000. I have always wondered what the agitation arc of these GE machines was. I have to say it runs flawlessly. It is 15 years old. This washer brings back memories, considering the HE era. This washer with the steel drive transmission is very powerful. I would like to know the arc of this agitation both on gentle/slow and normal/fast. Thank you. P.S. I believe that the GE post filter-flo washers were showcased in Florida if I am not mistaken. I wondered if GE has always used steel in their transmissions or just used plastic. I would also like to know about their motors, compared to their older washers.
GE post filter-flo agitation, comparison and history
- Thread starter gelaundry4ever
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Well, I can tell you about my 2004 GE post filter flo machine as opposed to my parents 1964 era filter flo.
I believe that my GE Profile used plastic gears in the transmission, it had a very short agitator stroke, about 30 degrees if I remember right.. They make a very distinctive "chug chug chug" noise.
My parent's Filter-flo had a very aggressive action and had a 90 degree stroke, if my memory serves me right.
Personally, I thought the cleaning power of the early to mid 2000 era GE's was OK, just so long as the clothese were loosely loaded in the tub.
I believe that my GE Profile used plastic gears in the transmission, it had a very short agitator stroke, about 30 degrees if I remember right.. They make a very distinctive "chug chug chug" noise.
My parent's Filter-flo had a very aggressive action and had a 90 degree stroke, if my memory serves me right.
Personally, I thought the cleaning power of the early to mid 2000 era GE's was OK, just so long as the clothese were loosely loaded in the tub.
gears and cleaning power
I thought GE had never used plastic in transmissions. My 2000 post filter-flo was very powerful, as was my 1993 filter-flo.
I thought GE had never used plastic in transmissions. My 2000 post filter-flo was very powerful, as was my 1993 filter-flo.
GE washer project
What was the project of the GE post filter-flo washer? I thought GE washers have always used steel gears in their gearboxes. What was the motor like in comparison to the filter-flo washers? What about the suspension? How was it different? Did the drive motors sound different? What did the two designs of GE's sound like? I'd like to know how much engineering went into the new style GE post filter-flo washers. Mine has the ramped agitator. Mind you, it's the gentle power agitator. I could've sworn that their arc was wider, about 154 degrees.
What was the project of the GE post filter-flo washer? I thought GE washers have always used steel gears in their gearboxes. What was the motor like in comparison to the filter-flo washers? What about the suspension? How was it different? Did the drive motors sound different? What did the two designs of GE's sound like? I'd like to know how much engineering went into the new style GE post filter-flo washers. Mine has the ramped agitator. Mind you, it's the gentle power agitator. I could've sworn that their arc was wider, about 154 degrees.
(To all of the GE lovers on this forum, I know I'm going to probably get a few details wrong here, so please correct me.)
I recall seeing a picture of the inside of a GE transmission and recall that I saw a lot of nylon gears as opposed to steel gears. Unfortunately, I can't recall where I found it, but basically, the reason for the short stroke on the early 2000's GE was due to a "Sawblade" style of gear connected to a round gear. It's hard to explain.
I don't know much about the motors inside Pre and Post Filter-Flo machines, but I can certainly tell you that Filter-Flo motors were designed to last. My father has a buffer he uses to polish things and the motor came out of that old '64 Filter-Flo. It still works even today. That really said something about GE quality back then.
The suspension is radically different between a Filter-Flo and a post Filter-flo machine. The old FF machines used steel aircraft style cable connected to springs, holding the tub in place with a kind of a "U" shape with pully's holding everything in place.
The new washers use a completely different kind of suspension, they kind of remind me of a shock absorber with a long stalk on the end. It's a better suspension because the washer won't walk if it is incredibly unbalanced. (I should know, on some very unbalanced loads my old 2004 GE would sound like it was tearing itself apart. While it sounded bad, it never dented the cabinet or did any damage.)
The drive motors sound very different. Again, hard to describe but if you look up youtube videos of Post and Pre FF machines, you'll hear it. Hydrowave washers sound horrible, kind of like car alarms.. I love the sound of a 60's era FF.
I think in the Hydrowave machines, they use some incredibly massive arc, I think it is 360 degrees, but don't quote me on that. They can get away with that because there isn't any transmission. I don't think it lends itself to better washing action, but that's all in my own personal opinion.
I wish I could tell you about the engineering, but here's what I know..
The Filter-Flo was introduced in 1957 and went through a few engineering changes until they settled on their final design in 1963. Noticeable changes were the construction of the agitator, the switch from a copper to a plastic filter flo pan, the switch from a solid basket to a perforated one, the eventual Mini-Basket (Great idea!) and the move of the recirculator spout from the 12 o'clock position to the 3 o'clock position.
From 1963 to about 1994, the basic design of the machine really didn't change. There were a few minor changes, like the design of the rail at the top of the tub went from metal to plastic (I think this happened sometime in the 1970's?) and there were gimmicks which GE used to sell more washers, like Vari-Speed, the Dispenseall and "Energy Saving" cycles. Realistically though, a Filter-Flo from 1994 wasn't too different from a 1964 model.
The 1995 models were more like the Hotpoint models instead and were phased out that year. Kind of a shame, the 1994/1995 machines were the ugliest of the bunch, at least IMO.
Obviously, GE had a lot of time to think about their re-design of their machine. The first thing the salesperson sold me on was the "Phone book" test, which says a lot about how badly a redesign of the suspension was needed. (Put in a phone book on the spin cycle and the washer won't walk around like the old ones did...)
I recall seeing a picture of the inside of a GE transmission and recall that I saw a lot of nylon gears as opposed to steel gears. Unfortunately, I can't recall where I found it, but basically, the reason for the short stroke on the early 2000's GE was due to a "Sawblade" style of gear connected to a round gear. It's hard to explain.
I don't know much about the motors inside Pre and Post Filter-Flo machines, but I can certainly tell you that Filter-Flo motors were designed to last. My father has a buffer he uses to polish things and the motor came out of that old '64 Filter-Flo. It still works even today. That really said something about GE quality back then.
The suspension is radically different between a Filter-Flo and a post Filter-flo machine. The old FF machines used steel aircraft style cable connected to springs, holding the tub in place with a kind of a "U" shape with pully's holding everything in place.
The new washers use a completely different kind of suspension, they kind of remind me of a shock absorber with a long stalk on the end. It's a better suspension because the washer won't walk if it is incredibly unbalanced. (I should know, on some very unbalanced loads my old 2004 GE would sound like it was tearing itself apart. While it sounded bad, it never dented the cabinet or did any damage.)
The drive motors sound very different. Again, hard to describe but if you look up youtube videos of Post and Pre FF machines, you'll hear it. Hydrowave washers sound horrible, kind of like car alarms.. I love the sound of a 60's era FF.
I think in the Hydrowave machines, they use some incredibly massive arc, I think it is 360 degrees, but don't quote me on that. They can get away with that because there isn't any transmission. I don't think it lends itself to better washing action, but that's all in my own personal opinion.
I wish I could tell you about the engineering, but here's what I know..
The Filter-Flo was introduced in 1957 and went through a few engineering changes until they settled on their final design in 1963. Noticeable changes were the construction of the agitator, the switch from a copper to a plastic filter flo pan, the switch from a solid basket to a perforated one, the eventual Mini-Basket (Great idea!) and the move of the recirculator spout from the 12 o'clock position to the 3 o'clock position.
From 1963 to about 1994, the basic design of the machine really didn't change. There were a few minor changes, like the design of the rail at the top of the tub went from metal to plastic (I think this happened sometime in the 1970's?) and there were gimmicks which GE used to sell more washers, like Vari-Speed, the Dispenseall and "Energy Saving" cycles. Realistically though, a Filter-Flo from 1994 wasn't too different from a 1964 model.
The 1995 models were more like the Hotpoint models instead and were phased out that year. Kind of a shame, the 1994/1995 machines were the ugliest of the bunch, at least IMO.
Obviously, GE had a lot of time to think about their re-design of their machine. The first thing the salesperson sold me on was the "Phone book" test, which says a lot about how badly a redesign of the suspension was needed. (Put in a phone book on the spin cycle and the washer won't walk around like the old ones did...)
To split this massive post up, here's more of my own thoughts...
In the last 20 years since GE first abandoned the FF design, I still see that 2004 era design used on their Hydrowave machines. They're still using the same tub and the same agitator, probably the same suspension.. but with a different motor, the switch from a transmission to a mode selector and electronics.
We're also seeing new "Asian" style designs coming out of GE which kind of shocked me. While they are still using the same tubs, the agipeller design is completely different and new. Heck, they're slowly moving away from their classic control panel look which they engineered back in the 1990's.
Until I see these new machines in action doing something useful, I don't think I can form an opinion about them, but I can certainly say that that the GE machines from 1995 are almost radically different from the machines they make today.
So, I think that GE has come further in the past 20 years then they have in the last 30 years, for sure. I wonder how much Jack Welch moved things along and forced the engineers at GE to innovate. I can't even imagine using the same exact basic design for 30 years like GE did.
In the last 20 years since GE first abandoned the FF design, I still see that 2004 era design used on their Hydrowave machines. They're still using the same tub and the same agitator, probably the same suspension.. but with a different motor, the switch from a transmission to a mode selector and electronics.
We're also seeing new "Asian" style designs coming out of GE which kind of shocked me. While they are still using the same tubs, the agipeller design is completely different and new. Heck, they're slowly moving away from their classic control panel look which they engineered back in the 1990's.
Until I see these new machines in action doing something useful, I don't think I can form an opinion about them, but I can certainly say that that the GE machines from 1995 are almost radically different from the machines they make today.
So, I think that GE has come further in the past 20 years then they have in the last 30 years, for sure. I wonder how much Jack Welch moved things along and forced the engineers at GE to innovate. I can't even imagine using the same exact basic design for 30 years like GE did.
In saying that, one small note here..
A lot of us Gen X'ers certainly do have nostalgia for those old GE FF machines, but nostalgia and washing machines isn't something that appliance companies usually think about. "OMG IT HAS A FILTER PAN!", said nobody ever. (At least from their point of view.)
I think that in some ways, GE sort of has kind of brought one half of the Filter-Flo philosphy back into their modern machines by having a recirculation feature for their HE washplate machines.
The video in the link below illustrates how GE has brought back recirculation. I'm sure that engineers know that recirculation provides for a much more effective HE style wash. Also notice too that the design of the machine is very different from anything GE has had before in the past. I don't recognize anything!
In all seriousness, I don't think that GE will ever go back to using the Filter-Flo filter pan. Even HE style washing and automatic water level detection negate the need for the Mini-Wash basket.
Now in saying that, there is one thing that a FF washer can do better than any other washing machine on the planet and that is remove dog and cat hair from clothing. I honestly wish GE would continue making FF machines just for this purpose alone. An HE style or front loading machine just won't cut it for this, but that is a special exception.
A lot of us Gen X'ers certainly do have nostalgia for those old GE FF machines, but nostalgia and washing machines isn't something that appliance companies usually think about. "OMG IT HAS A FILTER PAN!", said nobody ever. (At least from their point of view.)
I think that in some ways, GE sort of has kind of brought one half of the Filter-Flo philosphy back into their modern machines by having a recirculation feature for their HE washplate machines.
The video in the link below illustrates how GE has brought back recirculation. I'm sure that engineers know that recirculation provides for a much more effective HE style wash. Also notice too that the design of the machine is very different from anything GE has had before in the past. I don't recognize anything!
In all seriousness, I don't think that GE will ever go back to using the Filter-Flo filter pan. Even HE style washing and automatic water level detection negate the need for the Mini-Wash basket.
Now in saying that, there is one thing that a FF washer can do better than any other washing machine on the planet and that is remove dog and cat hair from clothing. I honestly wish GE would continue making FF machines just for this purpose alone. An HE style or front loading machine just won't cut it for this, but that is a special exception.
transmission and startup sounds
I thought GE has always used steel gears in their gearboxes instead of plastic. I also noticed that the agitation on my filter-flo would start normal speed on gentle, whereas my post filter-flo jumped right into normal. Do they use the same type of gear oil or did they use a differend kind?
I thought GE has always used steel gears in their gearboxes instead of plastic. I also noticed that the agitation on my filter-flo would start normal speed on gentle, whereas my post filter-flo jumped right into normal. Do they use the same type of gear oil or did they use a differend kind?
The majority of washers in my rentals have been the lower end GE washers and dryers post FF era.
Here's what I know:
- They do clean decently well.
- They are more violent than the Shredpool DD design, since they have a very fast 90deg. arc. 2 speed machines are preferred.
- The plastic, ribbed Xtraction baskets actually wring out a lot of water for a slow, plastic tub.
- Their very small transmissions have nylon reciprocating gears.
- They have fairly well built, quiet 1/2HP induction motors. I've seen them made in USA to India.
- The mode changing clutch is directly attached to the motor spindle. (non hydrowave)
- Hydrowave models use the exact same mechanical innards as post FF GE washers, sans the digital motor/transmission-less drive system.
- Hydrowave machines have a variable arc from 360 to 180 degrees.
- Hydrowaves also have some kind of load sensing technique, where they spin the dry tub of laundry and measure the kinetic energy.
In summary, they're fairly cheap on the surface, but they do tend to last several years or more if you get a good one.
Their matching dryers seem to be the same dryer design as from the the FF generation, with that giant grill vent in the back. And it's actually my favorite dryer design ever. Even a little more than the Maytag design.
One caveat is after advanced age, the GE dryer drums can sag in the front, and clothes can catch in the opened drum seam. Watch out.
Here's what I know:
- They do clean decently well.
- They are more violent than the Shredpool DD design, since they have a very fast 90deg. arc. 2 speed machines are preferred.
- The plastic, ribbed Xtraction baskets actually wring out a lot of water for a slow, plastic tub.
- Their very small transmissions have nylon reciprocating gears.
- They have fairly well built, quiet 1/2HP induction motors. I've seen them made in USA to India.
- The mode changing clutch is directly attached to the motor spindle. (non hydrowave)
- Hydrowave models use the exact same mechanical innards as post FF GE washers, sans the digital motor/transmission-less drive system.
- Hydrowave machines have a variable arc from 360 to 180 degrees.
- Hydrowaves also have some kind of load sensing technique, where they spin the dry tub of laundry and measure the kinetic energy.
In summary, they're fairly cheap on the surface, but they do tend to last several years or more if you get a good one.
Their matching dryers seem to be the same dryer design as from the the FF generation, with that giant grill vent in the back. And it's actually my favorite dryer design ever. Even a little more than the Maytag design.
One caveat is after advanced age, the GE dryer drums can sag in the front, and clothes can catch in the opened drum seam. Watch out.
<blockquote>I also noticed that the agitation on my filter-flo would start normal speed on gentle, ...</blockquote> FilterFlos all had a 1-speed motor for maximum pumping rate on the filter and draining at all times. Multiple agitation and speeds were had by way of a centrifugal clutch mechanism. Two-speed clutches always started on low speed even if high speed was selected, engaged high speed after a few seconds of running. There was also a 3-speed clutch, and a variable-speed that wasn't available for long.
GE laundry push
I have read the article about GE's profile Maxus line. It said, "Steel is a critical way to go in transmissions. From present models to the new ones, oil capacity drops from 86 to 5.5 ounces." It also mentioned that these washers had a heavy duty 1/2 horsepower motor both 1 and 2 speeds. GE also claimed to have a 154 stroke wash action.
I have read the article about GE's profile Maxus line. It said, "Steel is a critical way to go in transmissions. From present models to the new ones, oil capacity drops from 86 to 5.5 ounces." It also mentioned that these washers had a heavy duty 1/2 horsepower motor both 1 and 2 speeds. GE also claimed to have a 154 stroke wash action.
GE washer and dryer
my 2000s GE washer and dryer got taken to the dump I believe after 17 years of use. It had a plastic tub in the washer. The matching dryer had the plastic lint trap grill under the door. I remember when we got the pair, they did feel and sound cheap while operating. I now have the Kenmore elite fl pair made by lg. It works well.
my 2000s GE washer and dryer got taken to the dump I believe after 17 years of use. It had a plastic tub in the washer. The matching dryer had the plastic lint trap grill under the door. I remember when we got the pair, they did feel and sound cheap while operating. I now have the Kenmore elite fl pair made by lg. It works well.
How post FF washers are lasting as long as they are is mystifying me. I remember these washer would be set to the pile as though they were napkins with every known failure mode.
