Hard Drives/ External Hard Drives/ & BACK UPS

[mark_wpduet]

Need some advice on Back ups........Specifically external hard drives.......

Currently I have two (2) tb hard drives with the EXACT same thing on EACH of them just in CASE one fails.......I've heard the odds of them failing at the exact same time are pretty slim........so if ONE does fail you can quickly get another one and have another back up.......IS this a good strategy or no? Would THREE be better?

If you store ONE of the external hard drives not being used, where is the best place to store it? Should I have three copies and not 2? I have a small fireproof/waterproof safe......In addition to that, is the simple face that the external drive is being stored in a dark safe place going to extend the life?

I think the reason I'm suddenly so paranoid is that this 2 tb Western Digital I have is sort of in Limbo until WD sends me another cable, which is on the way....It's still under warranty but yesterday wouldn't mount to two different computers or my Micca Speck media player. The tech person said it could be the cable so he is sending another one and said if that's not it, they would send me a new drive.....I don't have another cable like this or I would try another one. I've never had an external hard drive fail. Hopefully it's just the cable.

I hate to use online backup because it takes FOREVER to backup and uses your bandwidth......

 

[whirlcool]

I use Western Digital drives exclusively. But the RMA form for sending your drive back to them is horrendous. It's like the Spanish Inquisition all over again. Plus they tell you EXACTLY how they want it shipped. Basically, you have to ship it the same way they shipped it to you. If the drive is not packed EXACTLY as they tell you to they won't honor the warranty. And how many people have saved the original box two years down the road after installation?

I have a WD 620mb hard disk running on a Novell network that was installed in 1998.
The drive is still running and pasts periodic disk testing without one error. Of course they back it up twice per week.

 

[jeffg]

We moved to compact flash/secure digital memory cards for our backups several years ago. Mechanical hard drives have heads, platters and other moving parts, they're orders of magnitude more fragile and their lifespans are very limited compared to this memory. CF/SD is a perfect format for backups since archived files are typically written once and then just read as needed afterward.

If you go this route, get memory with a lifetime guarantee (Sandisk Ultra or Extreme or similar). Memory with 1-3 year warranties are different flavors of the same inferior junk.

 

[whirlcool]

But what's the largest San-disk capacity.

 

[mark_wpduet]

Memory cards??

For 4 terabytes of data???

I can't imagine how many cards that would take.

 

[DADoES]

 
I used 4mm tape at work for many years, for lack of any choice with WinNT not supporting USB. Needing to occasionally move large files between work and home, had to use 4mm tape at home also.

Switched to external USB hard on the home system 5 years ago.  Had a 320GB LaCie that was moved to the office system mid-May when I got rid of the NT system there.

Home unit now is a 1TB LaCie.

Backup software of choice is UltraBac, which I've been using for YEARS, since it was in beta-testing phase.

I use a flash drive on the stand-alone ticket sales system at work. I've read those things have a limited service-life ... and for sure it was erratic the last time I needed to retrieve the files when replacing the failed computer (it's in a bad environment, they typically last 2 to 3 years) although that could been attributed to the computer having been flaky.

 

[washer111]

Would recommend you keep a third drive on hand, should worst come to worst, and store that "off-site" from your computer area (high shelve, friends house if you can password protect etc.). 

 

My other recommendation is installing one or two 2TB drives into your computer for backups, and keeping the external drive as your emergency plan. You could use larger drives, but from what I've heard quite a few machines today still have trouble with those large drives bigger than 2TB. I had to enable 48-bit LBA on my Windows 2000 Server to run my 2TB drive. With two or more drives, you could run a RAID-1 array, where data written to one drive is immediately mirrored on the other drive. This at least ensures you have redundancy if one drive fails, and always keeps your backups "up to date." Though many experts recommend keeping data backed up separately to the array, incase something other than drive failure causes chaos (Operating System error, power spikes, fire, Act of God etc.). RAID-1 only protects your data in case of disk failure (or something related). It cannot help with anything else. 

 

[jeffg]

Mark, you said you have 2TB of data (on two drives), not 4TB. You also didn't mention how much of the 2TB needs to be backed up.

CF/SD cards are available up to 256GB, SSDs have even more capacity, although the pricing sweet spot currently is with 32 or 64GB cards.

 

[mark_wpduet]

Jeff

I see your point.

Yes - Both of the 2 TB drives are about 60 percent full.....I should have mentioned that......

What is ON the drives? Movies & TV shows I've ripped and encoded and I would REALLY hate to have to go through all of that again, because it's been so time consuming and I finally got it all done......that's why I want to make sure I have back ups.........There's nothing really on the drives that I would say is vital information that I just simply can't lose......but even still, would hate to lose this......

Yesterday I got another drive and it's NOT the cable.........something is wrong with the drive.... I have to wonder what went wrong with it and if it's something I did.......I handle them with such care and keep them clean.......The DAY the drive went bad...I was vacuuming and cleaning the house really well and using the dusting brush to dust everything....When I got to the drive (which was OFF) I used the suction end of the vacuum to vacuum in the venting of the hard drive to keep dust out.....Later when I tried to use it, it wasn't working.....I can only imagine it had to be that..it's too coincidental to me because it had been working fine...I'm currently transferring everything to the new drive....and it's hour ELEVEN of transferring and it has FIVE hours to go...

I'm going to call Western Digital and tell them it's not the cable, that I have another cable I tried and hopefully they will send me another drive. I can't imagine that they would ask for someone's OLD hard drive back........Do they really do that? I mean, look at sensitive info that could possible be on drives......Not in my case....I find it ODD that in the case of something like a hard drive they would REQUIRE the old one with someone's DATA returned to them.

 

[mark_wpduet]

Oh Oh -.......

Another thing I forgot to mention - the drive that I have is a My book WD Passport which is made to sit upright and can be knocked over easily......It never has been knocked over but I googled to see if you could safely lay it on its side (of course turning it OFF before you do so) and from what I read the orientation of the drive didn't matter.......Strange enough, it had been laying on its side for 3 days then it died....so perhaps the orientation of some drives do matter. Not sure if that's what caused it or not. Could have been a million things.

 

[cadman]

Vacuuming and cleaning....

This is good advice for anyone with electronics- be very careful vacuuming or dusting around devices with exposed screws or case openings. Even though most reputable electronics are ESD tested to 15kV or more, there are factors that can adversely affect that threshold level. Air rushing through a vacuum nozzle can create a nice surface charge just looking to discharge to a nearby metallic component and lots of solid state designs leave much to be desired in that regard. If you must dust, try a damp cloth or wipe. -Cory

 

[kb0nes]

When the drive is experiencing a steady state 1G, orientation doesn't matter for any drive. If a hard disc was that sensitive I wouldn't trust them at all! Changing their orientation while they are spun up won't cause any damage either.

During times of shock then orientation may make more difference, but I try not to drop them

 

[DADoES]

 
My LaCie 1TB drive has been running standing on its side since being put into use.  I have three hard drives in the computer and heat is a concern so the side panel is off the computer and a small fan positioned to blow into it, with the LaCie partially in the air path.

 

[mark_wpduet]

cadman

I think you're right. I can't be 100 percent sure, but I think I MAY have killed the drive with my vacuum cleaner. If you look at the MY BOOK PASSPORTS, they have large vents across the top, side, and bottom, which dust can settle down into......When I was vacuuming, the clean freak in me wants to put the nozzle right up to the vents to suck any dust out that may have collected.......Later that very same day when I turned to drive on, that's when it would NOT come on....Seems too coincidental to me......

In the future, is it safer to blow them out? Or just not do anything other than wipe the outside

 

[cadman]

Mark, I'd wipe them out in the future. Blowing air can be just as risky.

 

[volsboy1]

I built my dream system last week,I spared no $$$ I had two Plextor 512 SSD and eight others Westren Digital Red 3 T.B. and Westren Digital 4 T.B. drives and the rest were Hitachi the good old ones.I have a Asrock Mob with a Intel Extreme and a Amd 7990.I work with P.C.s and have all ways wanted killer gaming system and I went for it.Well I destroyed it thanks to Seasonic SATA power plugs for the drives were faulty and the power supply was too.I never skimp when it comes to power supplies I see it all the time.The killer P.C.s that I have to repair and they have a Deer or a PoWork 900 Watt P.S..I always by Seasonic or Zippy-Emacs power supplies.Well all my drive cables that came with my PS that little L part was gone they were all like that.This was a Seasonic 1000 Watt X series I turned on my P.C. and poof I saw sparks and my P.C. with 15 years worth of data is gone all my movies,pictures,SOFTWARE,and the list keeps going.Seasonic is a joke I can't even talk to anybody.I call and call and no body picks up.My Aunt told me to get what I wanted from Falcon Northwest but I still can't replace my pics of Mom who passed away from cancer about a year ago.Plus the software which costs more than all of it.I am getting my a new P.C. and getting a Corsair 1200AXi that is made by Flextronics or a Zippy.I will buy the best Sata adapters I can find.It torched everything board and everything.Always Mirror your hardrive and keep one not attached to it just it case.I have the best luck with Enterprise Hitachi the real ones made in Malaysia.There cheap on Ebay and the ones from China are not that good once Westren Digital took over.I like Westren digital over Seagate I have always had bad luck with them drives.

 

[kb0nes]

Its pretty darned unlikely you can damage any electronics with static if they are assembled and in their case. Potential for ESD damage only really exists when you have raw components, and possibly unplugged cards. When the PC is assembled there are so many conductive paths that shunt off the charges away from the sensitive parts that damage is unlikely. Note I do say this as someone that always wears an ESD strap while working on a PC, so its not that I'm not cautious.

I both vacuum and blow out dust and I have yet to ever see any failure from my doing so. I have seen a number of failures from people NOT blowing or vacuuming out dust though! The one thing I am always careful to do is not to spin the fans with the air hose, I always hold the fan to stop it from rotating. I have seen fan bearings damaged by spinning them at high speeds.

As to the OP's failure of his drive I would consider it coincidental. Drives are quite robust especially if they are in an enclosure. I have been working with PC's with hard drives for about 25 years now and I have seen less then 10 drive failures out of many hundreds of drives. One system I work with has a 1Gb SCSI drive in it that has been spun up continuously since 1999. That old 486 is housed in a building at a local water tank and it has run in temps from 20 to 110 degrees F at times.

Drives are amazingly durable and failures are almost always either due to infant mortality due to a defect, or a power supply problem. I've only seen a couple fail from old age and that is generally the spindle bearing going bad. I'd NEVER buy any extended warranty on a hard drive.

 

[washer111]

Drive Orientation

Whilst it shouldn't matter which way the drive is oriented, I've done some basic reading when setting up my Active Directory and File Servers on the subject. 

 

It seems if you use the drive in one position (say, horizontal) the bearings and what-not are worn in certain ways. Altering how the drive sits (vertically) can upset this established wearing pattern and can cause issues. 

 

[whirlcool]

Yes, WD wants the original drive back and will send you a new one if the drive meets their warranty specs. The drive I had to send back was a WD Green 1TB drive. One day it just wouldn't power up. It took about four weeks for them to send me a new one and that is still running just fine.