Heating water Hell

[spacedogb]

Well I didn’t install my KUDS23, but decided to try my luck at KitchenAid so I installed my KUDS23 Architect series. I decided the maiden voyage should be Soak&Scrub with Sani Rinse. I got through the Soak and Scrub with 2 Heating water waits, but I’ve been sitting on the Sani Rinse Heating Water light for about 20 mins now and entire dishwasher is hot. My water at faucet is 140f. Is it normal to take this long or is it stuck? This is the second try. The first time I got nervous opened the door and the water was hotter than hell. I hit cancel and it completed through the cycle so I’m not sure if the timer is stuck or I’m just impatient. Thanks in advance for any reply.

 

[combo52]

Stuck Sani-Rinse ?

The SR uses a different thromostat, it might have a wire off it or it might be a bad thromostat, it could also be a bad program switch, or timer or a broken or disconnected wire elsewhere, but it probably shouldn't take over 20 minutes if your water is that hot, this DW was designed to work properly with 120F incoming water.

 

John L.

 

[pdub]

bottom panel off?

I notice in the picture your bottom panel cover is off. I assume it was off during your test? From my experience the t-stat is sensitive enough that the cooler air coming in under the dishwasher affects what it is sensing and so it never detects the true temp of the water in the tub. Try it again with the cover in place and see if there is any difference.

Best of luck!

 

[launderess]

" or I’m just impatient"

No, something certainly seems amiss IMHO. Even on a 120v circuit twenty minutes seems long enough to heat tap cold water to 140F or above, this much less boost hot water ten or so degrees.

In situations like this one reaches for our handy-dandy infrared thermometer. Wouldn't be without one!

Saves bending and allows for easier (and safer)reading of temps.

 

[spacedogb]

Sani Wait

Update, finally after about 25 mins. The dishwasher started up and completed the wash. Not very impressed with the performance.

 

[peteski50]

Kitchen Aid!

I have a friend that had this exact same unit and the cleaning performance was outstanding!

 

[spacedogb]

Losing its parts

When I finished load I lifted up the lower wash arm and this fell out. No clue where it goes. Maybe it has something to do with the washer performance.

 

[stevet]

That little washer

Needs to be there! It sits right above the white nylatron wash arm spindle and prevents or at least helps to prevent excessive wear on the inside surface of the wash arm and protects the brass bushing inside the arm as well.
It is actually supposed to be an interference fit and should stay put but many of them would slip out.
As long as you are aware of it needing to be there, you will surely make sure that it is in place whenever the wash arm is lifted out. It can affect washing performance but mostly when it isn't in place as the wash arm could begin to wear and slide down and actually slow down when revolving.

 

[spacedogb]

Worn parts

I wonder if something in that area isn’t already worn. I’ve gotten very little cleaning from the machine. I tried the peanut butter in a glass in each corner. Not a drop of peanut butter removed. I can confirm that both the spray arms turn and nozzles are clean. Just not sure that’s going wrong. I hate to say it but if I can’t figure out what’s wrong this will be headed to dumpster and the Miele G5105 will return to its place.

 

[realvanman]

Detergent?

I'm really green to this subject, but would like to share a brief expsrience. I relocated the kitchen in our current home, and the purpose was to be a senior care home. We wanted new, but cheap appliances that the staff could use (abuse). We ended up moving in ourselves instead, and found that the Maytag washer didn't clean worth a crap, even though the longest cycle takes around six months to complete (lol). We ended up trying those Kirkland pods from Costco, and it transformed the machine! Unbelievable! It actually cleans the dishes now (still takes around six months). I believe we had been using Cascade gel before. Keith

 

[bigalsf]

Sorry i'm a little late to this party, i was just catching up on this thread.

The delay you experienced for the sani-temp is quite normal for this machine. Water entering the machine must be at least 120 degrees (as John mentioned). If the water stayed at that exact temp as it landed in the sump than the heating time from 120 to 160 would be 20 minutes. But since the water temp always drops a couple of degrees it will take longer to heat. 25 min is the average i've experienced when working on these machines.

Regarding performance, what Keith (realvanman) said could be your culprit. I have very soft water in my home. Because of that I cannot use Finish or Cascade tablets because of the foam they produce. It so much that it hinders the wash action, especially in KitchenAid machines with their very powerful pumps. I do use the Kirkland tablets from Costco. They work great with our water conditions, and produce no foam. If you have soft water I highly suggest the Kirkland product.

Hope this helps. As others have said this is a very good dishwasher, and definitely should have cleaned that peanut butter. Don't give up yet, and keep us posted!

 

[bigalsf]

Water temp

My apologies, i didn't read the original post closely enough. You mention you have 140 degree water going to the machine. In that case it should not take 20 min to heat the water (more like 12-15). As John mentioned you may have a bad Sani-thermostat. It's easy to check by removing and checking against a water bath for continuity. If it's bad, replacements are readily available, and it's an easy fix. Definitely worth it.

Good luck and keep us posted.

 

[stevet]

uh oh! I spy?

Maybe.. now that you say it is not cleaning well, I looked at the third picture you posted. Is the small white bushing under the wash arm support and pin loose and possibly moved up under the top part? If so, then all the water will be diverted to the top arm and nothing much will come out of the bottom arm. In theory, everything up top should get really clean with all the water going up there, but if the bushing is loose, then the top part of the pump assy will need to be replaced.

 

[barcoboy]

I have this exact machine except in black, and my Sani rinse time is about 1/2 hour. I also have a KDS-58, and have to say that of the two of them, it's a toss up as to which one I like better. They both wash amazing (I use Cascade Fryer Boil Out), but I prefer the filtration system of the KUDS23, as the KDS58 seems to leave more gibbles on my glassware, even though the constant rinse arm is present and working. I do prefer though the three final rinses of the 58 compared to the purge and one rinse of the 23, and the Sani rinse seems to heat the water to 180F quicker in the 58 than the 23 heating to 160F.

 

[stevet]

Watts the difference?

I am sure someone can confirm this from a KUDS23 tech sheet. What is the wattage of the sump heater on the 23 Superba? I could swear I read or saw it somewhere that it was only 900 watts. The elements used from the 15 thru almost all the Superba 22's were dual element(2 700w wires encased in the same housing)1400 watt elements. They used the full 1400 watts during the sani rinse heating phase so they would heat faster even to a higher temp as was mentioned by Barcoboy above.
John L., can you confirm?

 

[combo52]

Heater Wattage On A KDS-23

I believe it was still 2, 700 watt elements, if the DW heats without the main pump running it uses the dual element in the sump.

 

If it has the larger diameter exposed element it is only 800 watts.

 

One reason a KDS-18 Sani rinse heats a little faster [ even to its sani rinse temperature of 180F ] is that the 3rd rinse fill on KDS-16 through 18 is less water, the KDS-23 with only one real rinse uses more water to heat to the Sani rinse temperature of 165F.

 

John L.

 

[spacedogb]

Update

I've been using this machine since August and I'm just not blown away. I read all the amazing reviews that everyone posts about their KA, but I just don't see it. I find my Miele Futura Crystal did a much better job. The only reason I stopped using it is due to the fact that it took soo long to get dishes done. I have tried different loading directions and angles. Dishes are "clean" but usually have a little something stuck to them or sometime still dirty. Even pots facing downward against the lower spray arm still come out with stuff suck to the inside. Usually baked on due to the heated dry. Many spoons and other items in the top rack come out still dirty. I just don't know what I'm doing wrong. LOL Everyone claims "hurricane in a box" I think I could pee on the dishes and do a better job.

 

[askolover]

Yeah, something sounds off there.  My KUDI23 does a fine job except on starchy dried stuff...and I have yet to use a dishwasher that could remove that glue.  Is your filter mesh deteriorated under the bottom spray arm?  I NEVER use heated dry.  Ever since Mother got her original KDS 17A we have always used energy saver dry and I still do.  If I'm home or awake when the DW finishes I pop the door open for a flash dry and since my water is 160F it does so instantly.   Truthfully, my Maytag did a better job on the dishes with the tiny spray jets and I loved the tapered top rack, but it still needs a little TLC and I'm going to turn it back into a portable to use as a kitchen island and to hold the taller things that I can't fit as well into the KA.  When I do a lot of baking I could really use 2 dishwashers anyway.  You could tape a clear shower curtain over the door and turn it on to see just what's happening in there or stick a camera in something water proof.

 

[combo52]

Best Vintage DW Cleaning Performace

KA DWs have always had all kinds of little things that can get out of wack and affect washing performance, one of the most common complaints we hear from customers when calling for service is " Not Cleaning Well "

 

And the truth is that none of the KA DWs from the 21-the 23 or the ISE models cleaned as well as the WP Power Clean DWs. As a WP-KA Authorized service agency we used to change out KA DWs and give the customer a new TOL WP PC machine and no more cleaning or drying complaint.

 

Hi Greg, you mentioned that your MT DW [ reverse rack I asume ] takes taller items than the KDS-23 ? That was the thing I hated about the MT RR DWs was nothing really big would fit anywhere in them.

 

John L.