Hot Rod Maytag SMALL washload

[scrubflex]

Swestoyz, can you make a video of your SuperTag washing a load with the SMALL water level setting. No one seems to like using the smaller load size. There's TONS of videos ONLY with medium to large loads using extra water. Awesome but, it will really would be cool to see the Power-Fin Washpower with the amp up agitation speed working a small load. What do you think?

The request is really for anyone that has a Maytag.

 

[yogitunes]

Harry, I was just thinking of you.....

after so much discussion and ideas back and forth, I was watching my machine the other day, and the reason I have come to is the small tub with the powerflex combined with the upgrade with the small level can really tear up some clothes big time, that little increase in speed churns up a major tidal wave in there at normal speed, unfortunately mine is only a one speed, and gentle should be used, at least with clothes in there, so I was about to put it back the way it was, but came across a small tub helical agitator, installed that one, and it's really a better choice for this application, low level gives a great wash as well as full level, with out tearing up the clothes and the tub does not index, I didn't really want to go back cause I like the way the higher spin removed more water, and alot cheaper than having the motor rewound....just some thoughts, if I had a video camera I would do vids for you....

 

[scrubflex]

can really tear up some clothes...

Hey Yogi, cool. So the straight edge vanes are harder on clothes instead of the curved/slope edge vanes. I wondered about that with my Whirlpool/Kenmore DD agitators.
BTW, which washer did you install the small tub helical agitator in?
After thinking about it, the upgrade is simpler and definitely cheaper so I'll stick with that. I have to have the higher spin and the higher agitation is perfect for the big loads.
As long as the brake package is strong the indexing will not be a problem. Speaking of indexing did you see the '2003 Maytag Dependable Care' videos (YouTube)? The power fin and the orbital tranny both index together, check it out. What do you think about that?

 

[swestoyz]

Harry - the Super'Tag has been pulled out of the line-up for now, so I won't be able to make a new video of it anytime soon.

However, the beginning of the video was shot either on small or medium. I can't remember which, but looks to possibly be between a small and a medium. When I did the upgrade I had to adjust the original standard tub pressure switch to compensate for the larger tub, so a small setting for that particular machine is really a medium.

Ben

 

[scrubflex]

supertag pulled...

What happened to the Hot Rod?

 

[swestoyz]

What happened to the Hot Rod?

Nothing

It was actally washing quite well once after about 10 loads. Very impressed with the washer. Loved the fast/long stroke with the Load Sensor, as well as the extra fast spin speed. Clothes came out almost APEX dry! (shhh, don't tell Robert I said that!)

But I brought home a new toy to play with so I gave the Super'Tag the boot from the main testing station.

Don't worry, it will surface again.

Ben

 

[scrubflex]

Was you still using the Power-Fin agitator as well?

And, what is you new toy?

 

[swestoyz]

Were you still using the Power-Fin agitator as well?

Nope - took it outside and used it as a flower pot

 

[yogitunes]

look at my collection....I installed it into the stacked unit...smaller tub with only one speed, even with the larger tub it should do OK as long as you have 2 speeds...I have tried the "load sensor" in mine also, but it's too tall and I can't slide the lid shut, this LS agitator fits a small tub with a regular drop down lid, I had to play around to see what I could do, since I had a few machines in the garage to play with, I now have the LS agitator in the Dependable Care unit, moves clothes a lot better than the 12 vane, if you can get a few different ones and see which one works best....

I have seen the videos, and it's neat how each agitator gives a different wash action, I just think the load sensor works best in all the machines, wether helical or orbital, that corkscrew allows you to wash more in a load and get guaranteed results, for me it would work great in the smaller tub if I didn't want the fabric softner dispenser...

IMO...I really thin the dual action agitators in any toploader helps move the clothes along better, just seemed to work beter also with a large load of clothes, not jammed in there, but snug, as long as the clothes were pushed against the corkscrew they would get pushed down, I know many people call them shred-mores, but I never had a problem with them, and in the direct drive units I installed the kitchen aid larger base agitator, for real movement big time at high speed, which its not supposed to run at(medium speed wash), but never had a problem and I could wash a big load, this is just my experience....

 

[scrubflex]

people call them shredmores...

As far as I can see, it's not the spiral vanes that's too hard on the clothes. It's the flex-vanes on the agitator base and the high frequency agitation which causes shredding for the DD. All the spiral vane does is twist and squeeze the clothes downward along the barrel then release the clothes into the flex-vanes.
You're right the daul action agitator really is the best at turning big loads. Not all kinds, but the biggest loads. The LoadSensoe agitator base is too small. If it was a little wider I'd use it as a second playtoy.

Ben, sounds like you don't care for the Power-Fin anymore.

 

[swestoyz]

Ben, sounds like you don't care for the Power-Fin anymo

The Power-Fin has it's place - in a stock Maytag! I love factory fresh Maytags just as much as the next guy/gal and feel that nothing really beats the original combination in a factory Maytag.

The main purpose of the Super'Tag was to make a fast spinning Maytag with a Big Load tub in an early cabinet. The smaller base of the Load Sensor and Power Flex 12, coupled with the fast/long stroke, really does a great job - without straining the power unit. You can't argue that

Ben

 

[yogitunes]

The survey says.....

and I'm gonna ramble some thought here...so bare with me...all machines have their fair amount of turn over, and most of the videos on you tube have a somewhat small load washing in a full water level, but the reality is right now, as for me, I have 5 kids and loads of laundry, and even with 6 machines running, I don't have the time to wash a few articles at a time, and this is the case in real homes, wash as much as possible at one time, and I don't mean to pack it tight, but a top load 3 cu ft tub will not wash the same amount as a 3 cu ft front load, as I said in another thread, it's a better idea to use the 1 bushel basket to measure out a load in any amount of clothes, and depending on the agitator, is how well a job it does or not, thats why kenmore made a big deal over the Dual Action, they were the only ones that had it, not even whirlpool, and this was a competitor, among many, with equal amounts of the same loads, which one had the best cleaning and turn over?....even Frigidaire had a commercial about their agitator compared to kenmores DA, sure it moved clothes under faster, but only a third of the size load that the kenmore had, you can't compare apples and oranges, I play alot with my machines, and get amazed at how much more clothes I can wash in my FL and the calypso, another thought, a FL is advertised as using only about 50% the water of a top loader, but they never make a point that a top loader only washes and rinses once per cycle, a FL washes once and 3 to 4 rinses per cycle, and this, if really figured out in a top loader, the machine would have to fill up at least 4 times, so a FL is only doing the load in 1/4 the water of an equal top loader, if this makes sense to you guys, I prefer the older FL because they used a little more water than the new ones, I have to see splashing, andeven after washing in a top loader, I have to spin one more time in a FL, if I was hanging clothes outside, I guess it wouldn't matter, but in a dryer, less moisture is better, think I'm finished for now, but keep experimenting, my mind is always running.........

 

[scrubflex]

Well said Yogi, it's obvious Maytag is one of 'my loves'. Too bad Maytag didn't "get it" about the dual action concept. They would have had an awesome agitator if they designed a one with the the power-fin agitator 4 large (fins), its fabric softener dispenser (cup) combined with a (spiral vane) and amped up speeds.
Yogi, do you know anything about the Wilkins Servis (Maytag) transmission? Any old post and pictures on the subject?

 

[mayfan69]

Wilkins Servis Transmission

Harry
The Wilkins Servis transmission is exactly the same as the Maytag transmission with the wide sweep 210 degree washing arc and 618rpm fast spin speed.

I doubt Yogi would know anything about it considering these were built in Australia. You could have used the search function and you would have found a few links to pics about my Wilkins Servis's, but here's the interior pic of my 506 with the stainless steel bowl showing the transmission...look familiar???

And before you ask, yes, thats a plastic outer bowl that was unique to Wilkins Servis with the use of the stainless steel bowl.

Leon

 

[scrubflex]

Maytag transmission...210 degree washing arc...

Hey Leon, AWESOME! I take it, there's very little next to none transmissions left around these days. I would love to have a Wilkins Servis (Maytag) 210 degree washing arc transmission in my dream machine.

You know, you never did respond to my request to measure your stainless steel bowl and compare it with Maytag's deep tub (16" L x 21 3/4" W)

Have you ever thought about increasing the wash and spin speeds with 50 hz set up?

Harry

 

[mayfan69]

Any transmissions left?

Harry

You're right. These transmissions are NLA in Australia. I've managed to secure a brand new Wilkins Servis one that was never used from an old repairer, but i have about 4 others from various Maytags that i have stripped for parts. Pic attached.

I will measure when i have the opportunity. As for the 50hz set up, i honestly don't know if thats possible considering all Maytags and Wilkins Servis machines would be already set up for our 240Volt 50hz power supply, but i could be wrong.

Leon

 

[mrb627]

Speed Queen / Kleenmaid

I thought the Speed Queen machines were the only line that had the 210 degree washing arc. Wasn't that part of their claim to fame?

MRB

 

[scrubflex]

Myatg...stripped for parts...

Yeah Leon, I think you're right these machines are 60 hz. Do you know if this Wilkins Servis tranny (gears) similar to the Maytag transmission.
I ask because, when I learned these tranny's practically look the same I began to wonder if the gears are similar. Then I thought maybe their interchangeable.
Like the parts that control the agitation speed (65 OPM) and the agitation arc (210 degree).
If the transmission doesn't work then use the parts, if possible.What do you think about that?

Harry
PLEASE let me know if you 'MIRACULOUSLY' come across an extra Wilkins Servis (Maytag) transmmission.

 

[scrubflex]

MRB, Frigidaire, White-Westinghouse, Tappan, Gibson and Kelvinator washers all had a 210 degree agitation stroke as well.

 

[yogitunes]

the main that made Speed Queen some what special in my book was not only the 210 degree, but the agitator had vanes all the way up to the top of the water line, and with the speed of the oscillation, caused the water to splash upward out of the machine and hit the lid, no other machine I have ever seen did this, maytag may have had the same stroke degree, but the vanes were limited to the bottom only.

a maytag repair guy once told me the reason maytag lasted so long was because of the belt that would slip under strain, if you were washing a load of dungarees or work clothes, the machine would adapt to "save" the mechanics of the machine rather than do the actual job of handling the load and scrubbing the clothes clean, but the speed queen was what was the "chosen" one among construction workers, farmers, mechanics, these were heavy duty clothes that needed scrubbed and a machine that wouldn't back down, SQ was preferred over maytag, and if the customer wasn't sure what to buy, he would ask what line of work they were in, that would determined which machine would work best.....always talk to a repairman before you see a salesman, even when buying a car, go out back of the dealership and ask a mechanic which car do they see in the shop more for repairs?....then decide

food for thought!

 

[scrubflex]

Hey Yogi, are all Maytag motors designed and built to adjust to the agitation strain? Does the Dependable Care 1/2 hp motot operate the same? The orbital trans agitation stroke seem stronger and harder. I figure a 1/2 hp motor would enable the Power-Fin agitator to pull the clothes down from the top of the tub much better. The 4 large fins should not have any problems 'sucking' and 'pulling' the load down, up and over. Of course, it will not force the clothes downward like the dual action (spiral vane) but, better than it does. If the motor didn't 'give' the power fin could turnover more clothes per load size. What do you think?
The older Speed Queen 210 degree Polypropylene 3-Vane agitator was COOL. I loved the splashy-splash but, the washtubs weren't big enough.
Harry

 

[qsd-dan]

It takes a lot to strain to cause a Maytag transmission belt to slip. Believe me, I tried and only succeeded once.

 

[brettsomers]

Thats true, Dan. Overloaded my parents long-stroke and orbital machines and saw no noticeable belt slippage. Just because the belt is meant to clutch during spin doesnt mean it slips during agitation.

And i tend to load heavy, esp when the articles are lightly soiled.

 

[yogitunes]

to over come much of the "give"...I usually add an extra spring, theres already the slots for it, the orbital seems to "jump" a lot, and the extra spring holds it tighter, to really moved the agitator, you can even test this by putting a small board (like a broom stick) between the motor and the front suspension spring, watch the wash action, and with your foot, apply a little more "pressure" to the belt, and watch the agitator speed up a little and stronger, and then you'll see why the extra spring helps, and doesn't let the load make the system give in, I have asked about adding the spring and the damage it may cause, all they said was that it could cause the motor to burn out a little sooner but not much, I have done this on every maytag I come across, except for the "50hz upgrade", that made it too tight, and the motor over heated during the first spin and shut down, but i never had a problem with all the other machines... after putting the orbital powerfin in the helical small tub, I then put the helical powerfin in the orbital machine, added another spring, now this may be different because of the smaller tub, but it handled a jean load nicely...so I would say I have 2 happy maytags.....

my sisters SQ was a large capacity, it would wash a goodsize load, the nice thing about SQ was as the tub got bigger, the vanes also changed, not just taller but the bottom vanes increased, only about an inch or two, but unlike maytag, kenmore, GE they only added 2 inches of height to the agitator and brought the top of the vanes with it, it just to me a taller tub needed a bigger agitator to compensate, as well as a longer wash time than the regular capacity...but back to SQ small tubs, I always thought the laundromats only had the small tub, because of what they were meant for, then I found out later, SQ never made a big deal on the control panel about being EX-Large capacity, It was built in to the time fill to add an extra minute of fill time for the larger tub, only way you knew the size was by opening the lid and looking, odd things we just notice, I never like maytags as a kid, because could never seethem wash, even though all the guys in here recommended using a stick or similar item, at our laundry the attendant was always watching you, I tried to peek, but couldn't see much, and I had to know how the machine was washing, not when you open the lid and it stops!...but thats just me

 

[scrubflex]

I never liked maytags as a kid...could never see them wash..

I felt the same exact way about Maytag. As long as I can remember I'd like to watch washing machines wash and spin etc. Maytag became one of 'my loves' from the AWOR club and YouTube. Could adding a Start Capacitor Kit help prevent the extra motor spring from overheating and shutting off with the "50hz upgrade"?

 

[yogitunes]

thats possible, I wouldn't know, but there doesn't seem to be any slippage with the conversion, even with a good size load...this could be because of the material the new pulley is made of, it grips!...this pulley is a heavy solid piece unlike the original which is 2 pieces riveted together

weak springs alone will cause slippage, even if you get a 10 year old set, its alway as good idea to replace the springs and gliders and relube...

slippage may be minimal, but it's there, it won't stop agitation, it just slows it down slightly, like with the stick test, even with good springs, you will see the agitaor speed up a little bit, and you didn't even know that is wasn't going as fast as it could be all along....

 

[scrubflex]

Yogi, you know what my plan is for my Maytag dream machine. I want the strongest stroke that can be created for the Power-fin agitator with 50 hz upgrade. All of the Whirlpool/Kenmore 'straight vane' agitator stroke seem to pull the load down to the bottom of the tub stronger with steadier strokes, more so than the Power-fin. They used 1/2 hp motors. Would the extra spring for the motor absolutely make this possible?

Harry

 

[yogitunes]

I would think so, you may not need the extra spring, that new pulley really grips, I know it does in mine, and a heavy load of towels doesn't hold it back, and the power fin would actually work better if it didn't flex at the bottom, if I am correct the first black ones were connected at the bottom, you have to think like you said, whirlpools surgilator is a solid agitator all the way down, definate movement, and a solid power fin would get every bit of action if it didn't flex under pressure, but try the 3rd spring and if not it takes seconds to take it off and its only about 3 dollars, you could be hitting on winning combinations with the 1/2hp motor, the 50hz upgrade, and the non flexing larger powerfin, on this you may need a new brake package to hold that puppy still...lol...make sure its a 2 speed, cause on lower levels you'll really want to slow it down, mine is not and thats why I had to go to the orbital smaller base agitator, but there's still no question as to what it can handle, I have tried a number of different loads, and it pulled thru with the helical, and with the stick test there was no marked amount of "give" in the belt, the only other attempt would be a "load sensor" agitator, at least then you know the clothes will definately get pulled down and scrubbed, even a jean load, or heavy towels, and this would handle a bigger load, I would sacrifice the larger power fin just to have positive rollover, no matter what the load, even if it was a Whirpool/Kenmore, go Dual Action, with a surgilator, this works fine on a few items for rollover, but why not get the benefit of the full tub of water and know its going to move clothes everytime, and most maytags only have a short rinse so you want maximum movement in the short time....just some thoughts.....

 

[scrubflex]

I figured the power fins 'FLEXING' would have no problem pulling clothes down to the bottom because they're large and the added size would make the rollover action much better because they flex.

 

[yogitunes]

I would try different ones to see which one works best for you and the application, took a few tries till I got it to where I wanted mine....experiment!