How Can Handwashing Dishes Increase Your Chances of Getting Sick?

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Everything that goes in our mouth (or that our mouths go on) goes in the dishwasher...

Though we're waiting for our daughter to out grow her "mini" dishes & silverware that aren't dishwasher safe, or at least not break our "adult" dishes so that her stuff can get washed in the D/W, too!

Aren't there different trade names for "sanitizing" among certain brands of dishwashers?

I've seen on Kenmores, 'Sani-Temp', and some other brand had 'Hydro-Boost'... What are/were others?

-- Dave
 
Wasn't there some article that got linked to here a few months back that suggested that using heated dry on a dishwasher alone would sanitize dishes well enough for home use?
 
bleach

Yeas ago an inspector for the state health department told me to add one part per million of household bleach to the rise water and all the nasties would be killed. When I do have to wash dishes by hand I add a little bleach to the wash water and I try to have a clean field and a dirty field.

I think the part of the problem is we don't teach home eco in schools like we used to. We have several generations of folks that grew up on fast food and have no idea how to manage home kitchen. Not only general household operations but food safety as well. One doesn't thaw meat on the counter top for 3 days before cooking or make french fries with the lid on the skillet..or like my future daughter-in-law...squirt dish soap on a dirty sponge..give the dish a swipe and rise in cold water...you know..that hot water can burn your fingers as well as mess up your nails!!
 
There's certainly a lot of useful information posted here that goes beyond the dishwasher. One of the things that I find helpful is the hot water circulating pump that came with my house. I didn't think much about at first but now I don't think I could live without it. Another thing I like is Clorox Spray Cleaner. Another one of my weird quirks...I sort of like the way chlorine smells.
 
Dishmasters

I prefer to use the Bosch and do 99% of the time. But for the things that MUST be washed by hand, the Dishmaster is great. You can squirt HOT soapy water on stuff, use the non porous brush on the items then rinse in HOT water. And you don't have to immerse your hands in a HOT dishpan so you can use much hotter water and NOT burn your hands.

It does a nice job.
 
You mean there are people (other than my dad) who actually use a dishpan or sink filled with soapy water?!?

I remember hearing a few years ago, that thanks to bathroom cleaning products, that the kitchen is by far the least sanitary room in the home.
 
@washerboy

Its not that there ins't Home Ec (Here in Aus, anyway), its that they don't teach how to wash dishes CORRECTLY.

 

In our cooking class, they use just ONE sink (which is pretty small), and it forces you to not rinse, before or after washing. Who ever I work with, I DO THE DISHES. My way is the right way (my way or the highway baby!). I rinse EVERYTHING before washing, and use water that I can barely touch. Even with a small load of dishes, I will do 3-4 water changes. Sometimes I will rinse everything afterwards too. 

When I rinse, I use the hottest water available at the tap, and since the school is probably wary of germs etc, the heater is set so hot the water STEAMS quite severely out of the tap (Scalding risk).

 

Some people are pretty hopeless, whilst others are not. 

 

With our DishDrawer, the "Normal" cycle, the Main-Wash is at 122-131ºF (50-55ºC). The Final Rinse is what some machines of the 80's (GE GSD2800) would call sanitised: 140ºF/60º. 

Recently, with my frequently changing loading patterns, I've used the Heavy/Heavy-Eco cycles in order to get rid of any musty smells inside (so 158º/149º or 149/140). The best part of the Heavy (and Eco version) is that it includes 3 post-wash rinses. I had to hang around to see whether that was true! But the dishes sparkle more than ever when washed on Heavy (I tested it on some regular dishes yesterday. I've never seen dishes so sparkly!)
 
-Drink water from garden hoses

-Share bottles/cans of pop (soda) with your friends (no straws- just lip it)

-If your sandwich hits the ground, dust it off and continue eating it

I won't let the kids on my bus (any age) use hand sanitizer while on my bus. I tell them to use it before they get on the bus or after they get off, if they want. My excuse is that there are too many kids with sensitivities, and there's a risk of spilling the messy stuff thereby making a mess. Now, add to that that I can't stand the smell of most of it and that's a distraction to the driver (safety concerns are always looked at seriously!).

We've gotten too hung up on a lot of this. Yes, there are far worse "bugs" out there now than when most of us were kids, but with all the sanitizing these kids go through now (hand sanitizer, anti-bacterial soaps, etc.), it's no wonder they can't fight anything off! Our dishes are clean, dishwasher-done or by hand. Common sense prevails, if one has it. Whether it had raw meat on it or had water in it, it gets the same treatment. Good old hot water, soap, and a (thorough) rinse. That said, 90% of our stuff goes through the Hobart KA as neither of us likes hand-washing the everyday stuff.

Sheesh. Rant over.

Chuck
 
Kids are good for somethin'

Back to the slimy Tupperware for a moment.

Due to the slimy cups when I was growing up I won't allow plastic cups in our house.
Only glass and stainless steel glasses allowed. Period. I think the trick to getting Tupperware really clean is to wash it BEFORE you wash the plates & frying pans. At the time, my sister was only 14. My parents thought the dishwasher used way too much electricity to use all the time. So they put my sister to work. We had a GE Mobile Maid at the time.

And of course we always use "High Temp Wash" & "Sanitary" settings on out DW. Each washload take 2:30 to complete, but we know it's clean!
 
How handwashing can keep you from getting sick

Twist on the subject so far, and definitely works for me, I haven't had more than a 24hr runny nose in 5 years.

1. Never touch your face when out in public.

2. Wash your hands the minute you get home.
 
Sanitising & Dishwashers

Most of that action comes from the scrubbing off of foods, soils, residue, biofilm etc along with germs from surface of dishes. This along with alkaline conditions and the chemical action of chlorine or oxygen bleach will bring down the "germ" count on loads cleaned in a dishwasher.

E Coli requires temps >160F held for ten minutes (IIRC) to be killed, and unless mistaken no modern American made domestic dishwasher washes or rinses at that temp. Perhaps some European units do and certain commercial units on both sides of the pond, that is unless they are using chemcials in the final rinse for sanitising dishes.

Anyone at home worried about "germs" in their dishwasher and or on a load simply stop the machine at the rinse and add the proper amount of LCB, restart the machine to finish the cycle but it will require another rinse to take away the bleach.

As for keeping kitchen sinks and or surfaces free or at least reduced of bacteria a good scrubbing with any chlorine bleach containing cleanser (Comet, Ajax, etc...) should do, just look to see if the label has an EPA number indicating it is registered as a disinfectant.

Failing that there are plenty of commercial and or household cleaners that will do the job. Just make sure they are safe to use on or near food prep surfaces. Do NOT use vintage Lysol or other phenol containing products as the residue is toxic to humans and pets.
 
Just thinking

The first thing a domestic dishwasher does is spew the sump water--which has sat for ~23hrs at ideal bacteriological growth conditions--over the entire load. So that anything that was NOT contaminated now is.
 
Which Is Why One Is Thankful For An "Older" DW With

First one sets our DW to the end of the first wash of the "Pots & Pans" cycle, this causes a purge rinse with fresh water, once that is over machine is stopped and reset for "Normal". Oh and always reset for an extra rinse on all but the most lightly soiled loads.
 
Purging old water from the sump: Don't most dishwashers start a cycle with a brief drain? My LG does, and I believe Smokey The Maytag and the Frigidaire which preceded it did, as well. Although, come to think of it, maybe this only drains water from the hose and pump.

Don't recall if it was a 1974 Lady Kenmore or the 1984-ish KitchenAid Superba which replaced it...anyway, with one of those, you could actually see some water sitting in the sump at the bottom of the tub at the end of a cycle.
 
I think my Bosch starts off the cycle by draining and then adding some water and draining again, before starting up the spray arms.

It heats to something like 165F in the final rinse so anything left in the sump is probably pretty dead, anyway.

I think there are probably more bacteria growing in the food residue on the dishes held in the washer for a day or two before it's full enough to warrant a run. I normally don't do a "rinse-hold". Perhaps because of the dirty sump water issue mentioned. The Bosch does a good job of removing dried on food residue anyway. The only thing it has a real problem with is dried guacamole. That stuff is like window caulk.

On the same subject, I read some time ago that studies have shown kitchen sponges, after use, harbor a tremendous amount of potentially harmful bacteria. As well as the garbage disposal, which has a lot of nooks and crannies as well as food particles conveniently macerated and sprayed all over the insides, where normal drain action doesn't dislodge them. Particularly nasty is the underside of the rubber flange that most garbage disposers have... I hate cleaning those.
 
Launderess...

I certainly hope 158º is enough to kill E.Coli. Thats the HOTTEST our DishDrawer gets, and thats only the main-wash. Our hottest rinse is in the region of 149º.

 

I've been using "Heavy" recently, to help sanitise stuff, and washed my hands before emptying the machine. Everything sparkles!

 

On a side note regarding sump water, our DD now and our older Dishlex both used to drain water before starting. With the dishlex (connected to the sink drain), you could hear some water being pumped out (even before the pipes were "fixed"). When you started it, you'd hear like a gentle "raspberry" or "flatulant" sound (that was the drain pump), before the water kicked on and it turned off. 
 
well said perc-o-prince

How long have humans needed to be kept in sanitised , hermetically sealed environments ?

Next it will different soaps to wash my face and arse
 
Well Maybe It's Just Moi

But one hasn't used the same cleansing products on one's face as one's body since teenage years if not slightly before.

Pure soaps in particular can and often are very drying to human skin and that is something one does not want for the face.

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One Other Stupid Hand-Washing Trick:

I forgot to mention one of my pet peeves with many peoples' hand-washing:

Soaking. While soaking dishes certainly has its place, many people use soaking as a delaying tactic to keep from having to Get Cracking. They pile dirty, unscraped, unrinsed dishes into the sink, squeeze in some dishwashing liquid, run in some hot water, and walk away. For the night, if not a couple of days. In their minds, this kind of "soaking" evidently equates to having actually done something about the dirty dishes, when it's really no such thing.

What people who engage in this habit are really doing is making bacteria soup. Once the water cools, germs and nasties are securely in their comfort zone and free to multiply like gangbusters, which they do. You'd need to be a very conscientious hand dishwasher, using very hot water, to get all the resulting witch's brew of bacteria off the dishes. And I've never seen a "soaker" yet who did that.

If soaking is necessary, there are two ways to do it. If there is no egg involved, you can run water that's too hot for your hands to stand over the dishes, and as soon as it cools enough to put your hands into it, whatever is stuck to them should be loosened. If egg is involved, a 20 or 30-minute soak in cold water should loosen things up, after which you should wash the dishes in properly hot dishwater.

If you have dishes you don't want to wash right away, it's actually better to let them sit out dry than to put them in to soak for overnight or longer. Fewer bacteria will grow under those conditions.

P.S.: Going ahead and doing the dishes results in one other dividend: You don't start out your next morning with last night's nasties staring you in the face. To my way of thinking, there is nothing more depressing than waking up to a dirty kitchen.

Unless it's coming home to an unmade bed.
 
Sit overnight? You mean someone besides my 20yo 1975 acquaintance actually does that? Walking in his kitchen I always wished for a hazmat suit.

I might let baked stuff stuck to casseroles soak for 3 hours, but I handwash WHILE I cook, leaving only a plate and fork when I'm done eating.
 
Anti-bacterials

I do not believe in them.

Over a decade ago, there was evidence that products with Triclosan embedded into them (chopping boards, bins, etc.) were giving bacteria the chance to adapt and resist the bactericidal effect.

Anti-bacterials are only effective to 99.9% efficiency.

Chlorine bleaches (sodium hypochlorite) are effective to 100% of ALL KNOWN GERMS (e.g. Unilever's "Domestos").

I use either Domestos or Jeyes "Parozone" - and the kitchen sink is always sparkling (so's the loo!).

rolls_rapide++9-15-2012-22-27-37.jpg
 
Soaking of cooking and tableware.

It is well to soak heavily soiled dishware and pans (a must for flatware) before pre-scrapping and washing in the 3 CPT. sink or dishmachine. However bacteria can and do grow in the soak solution. This said it is very importand to follw a good warewashing procedure to clean and sanitize these items after soaking. In my experience it is best to send them through the dishmachine.

As far as changing water goes(posted earlier in this thread). Water in the dishmachine tanks as well as presoaking water should be changed every 2 hours or following each meal service. This is the word of Ecolab and Hobart. The same should be observed for manual 3 compartment sink warewashing.
WK78
 
Just so you know

Bacteria can grow in jet fuel. And there is no such thing as killing 100% of them, except at the bottom of the Black Sea where the dissolved gas is hydrogen sulfide and ZERO onygen.
 
There are additives in jet fuel to combat the microbial effects in jet fuel. During heavy periodic checks the fuel system is inspected for damage from these little devils.

Here in Houston, a now deceased television reporter, Marvin Zindler just about made a career out of reporting "Slime in the Ice Machine!". Due to our climate in Houston slime in the ice machine is quite common unless you clean it periodically.

 

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