beadsobleach
Well-known member
- Joined
- Apr 19, 2007
- Messages
- 179
I figured he'd make an appearance here sooner or later, so I'd start the ball rolling...
Joe the Plumber
- Thread starter beadsobleach
- Start date
Well . . .
It's been noted in the news that neither Joe nor the plumber who employs him are licensed, even though licensure is required where they're located.
Guys like Joe give me the willies no matter who they vote for. Most municipalities require that a contractor or subcontractor note his license number and insurance at the time a permit is issued, which means Joe is probably not pulling permits for his work. If he has proper training and knowledge then he should become licensed, or at least work for someone who is. A professional license doesn't mean the holder is better at his trade than an unlicensed individual, but it does mean he's taken the time and trouble to earn his license and keep it up to date, and in the event of a problem he can be more easily held accountable.
When an unlicensed building tradesman does shoddy work about the only remedy a homeowner has is to hire a lawyer and take him to court. That's often prohibitively expensive and can take years, which most unlicensed tradesmen are all too aware of.
It's been noted in the news that neither Joe nor the plumber who employs him are licensed, even though licensure is required where they're located.
Guys like Joe give me the willies no matter who they vote for. Most municipalities require that a contractor or subcontractor note his license number and insurance at the time a permit is issued, which means Joe is probably not pulling permits for his work. If he has proper training and knowledge then he should become licensed, or at least work for someone who is. A professional license doesn't mean the holder is better at his trade than an unlicensed individual, but it does mean he's taken the time and trouble to earn his license and keep it up to date, and in the event of a problem he can be more easily held accountable.
When an unlicensed building tradesman does shoddy work about the only remedy a homeowner has is to hire a lawyer and take him to court. That's often prohibitively expensive and can take years, which most unlicensed tradesmen are all too aware of.
toggleswitch2
Well-known member
- Joined
- May 23, 2008
- Messages
- 5,000
..an in the meantime they can put a mechanic's lien on your property and LAWD HAVE MUSSY, what a mess.
peterh770
Well-known member
And that changes Obama's tax policy how?
Interesting Results for Joe
It seems as he has gotten himself some un wanted attention. The shame of it all is that it would seem very greedy to speak about taxes for those over $250K when he is no where near that bracket. McCain spoke out for Joe and it seems just like McCain's running mate Failin, Joe has dirt in his closet that is coming out for cleaning. Obama definitely is more level headed professional of the two candidates as identfied by the debate and McCain's unprofessional facial expressions.
It seems as he has gotten himself some un wanted attention. The shame of it all is that it would seem very greedy to speak about taxes for those over $250K when he is no where near that bracket. McCain spoke out for Joe and it seems just like McCain's running mate Failin, Joe has dirt in his closet that is coming out for cleaning. Obama definitely is more level headed professional of the two candidates as identfied by the debate and McCain's unprofessional facial expressions.
DUH
An unlicensed plumber is quite unlikely to make enough for Obama's or Grampy's tax policies to matter much. If he's reporting his income truthfully, he would quite likely get a break, as would 95% of most Americans under both plans. Many are saying this guy was a plant by the McCain people so they could attempt to illustrate (incorrectly) that Obama's policies would hurt the average working man. Does Grampy even know what a plumber is? Puhlease! It's a joke to even begin to argue this man is "in touch" with any average people. And Caribou Barbie and her ridiculous "first dude" have a combined income of over $250/yr. so tell me how they are an "average working family" when the mean income in this country is less than $50K and many of those people just lost one third or more of their savings and/or retirement. The GOP have no leg to stand on, most thinking people can see the idiocy in their rhetoric and clearly are moving away from it. They don't want to talk about the economy, have no solution for solving any of the problems that REAL people face. (Grampy's idea of capital gains tax relief? Most working people will never be affected by capital gains in their entire lives - who is that geared for?)
This notion of "trickle down" economics from the GOP golden calf Ronald Reagan has worked so well for us thus far, why not have four more years? Anyone want lay odds on a full million jobs being gone by the end of 2008?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/story/2008/06/09/ST2008060900950.html
An unlicensed plumber is quite unlikely to make enough for Obama's or Grampy's tax policies to matter much. If he's reporting his income truthfully, he would quite likely get a break, as would 95% of most Americans under both plans. Many are saying this guy was a plant by the McCain people so they could attempt to illustrate (incorrectly) that Obama's policies would hurt the average working man. Does Grampy even know what a plumber is? Puhlease! It's a joke to even begin to argue this man is "in touch" with any average people. And Caribou Barbie and her ridiculous "first dude" have a combined income of over $250/yr. so tell me how they are an "average working family" when the mean income in this country is less than $50K and many of those people just lost one third or more of their savings and/or retirement. The GOP have no leg to stand on, most thinking people can see the idiocy in their rhetoric and clearly are moving away from it. They don't want to talk about the economy, have no solution for solving any of the problems that REAL people face. (Grampy's idea of capital gains tax relief? Most working people will never be affected by capital gains in their entire lives - who is that geared for?)
This notion of "trickle down" economics from the GOP golden calf Ronald Reagan has worked so well for us thus far, why not have four more years? Anyone want lay odds on a full million jobs being gone by the end of 2008?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/story/2008/06/09/ST2008060900950.html
Yeah, appear in the Campaign, national notoriety= TAX AUDIT, and since Joe has not yet purchased the business. I bet his current employer is so Pleased. Dig out those dusty boxes now, the IRS wants to see it all. Say it ain't so Joe.
pturo
New member
"Joe the Plumber" is a poor metaphor for the American Public.
That's the problem with living metaphores, they come back and bite you in the ass, Mr. McCain. Who in hell writes your speeches, Bozo the Clown?
That's the problem with living metaphores, they come back and bite you in the ass, Mr. McCain. Who in hell writes your speeches, Bozo the Clown?
Duh.
I can't believe there are people out there who are stupid enough to even consider for a second, McSame's "bait and switch" health care plan. Yeah, on top of everything else I have to worry about I want my employer to stop offering me health coverage so I can go from state to state figuring out which greedy health insurer will be the lesser of evils. A**HOLE!
This election is quickly boiling down to a contest of the hopefuls vs. the fearfuls.
I can't believe there are people out there who are stupid enough to even consider for a second, McSame's "bait and switch" health care plan. Yeah, on top of everything else I have to worry about I want my employer to stop offering me health coverage so I can go from state to state figuring out which greedy health insurer will be the lesser of evils. A**HOLE!
This election is quickly boiling down to a contest of the hopefuls vs. the fearfuls.
Well fact check...
Joe IS registered to vote, he voted R in the primary, his name is simply misspelled (wonder if that's grounds to invalidate his vote?)
Joe is unlicensed, but the part of Ohio he lives/works in does not require plumbers to be licensed if they are working under a company that is.
Joe has shades of a bigot when he said Obama tap danced around the question like Sammy Davis Jr.
http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20081016/NEWS09/810160418/-1/NEWS
Joe IS registered to vote, he voted R in the primary, his name is simply misspelled (wonder if that's grounds to invalidate his vote?)
Joe is unlicensed, but the part of Ohio he lives/works in does not require plumbers to be licensed if they are working under a company that is.
Joe has shades of a bigot when he said Obama tap danced around the question like Sammy Davis Jr.
http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20081016/NEWS09/810160418/-1/NEWS
We met Joe, now let's meet Sam ---
Joe the Plumber Meets Sam the Gas Station Guy
By John Seery
A few days ago (which is to say, prior to the Wednesday night presidential debate), I met Sam. Joe the Plumber should really meet Sam, too.
I was jogging away on the treadmill at my local gym when the guy next to me--who turned out to be Sam--introduced himself. He seemed to want to talk, which was fine by me. He asked what I did. I told him. He immediately replied, "Oh, I've never met a professor before. I never went to college. Seriously, in my entire life I've never read a book all the way through. Please, Professor, don't make fun of me."
Of course I wouldn't. Besides, I found Sam's humility, curiosity, and affability endearing. As Sam talked, I became only more enthralled in what he had to say. He told me his life story. He grew up in Yonkers, New York and came out to California in his early twenties. At 22 he found himself working as an entry-level cashier at a gas station. Eventually he cobbled together loans and a payment schedule and bought the station.
Cut to the future: Now 38 years old, Sam owns more than 100 gas stations in southern California and 25 restaurant franchises. He has over 800 employees working for him. He has four kids in a happy marriage. He's a devout churchgoer. He's a proud American and lets you know that.
We started talking politics. "You know what," he said, "I'd really like some reporter to come and ask me my views on the election. Why don't they ever seek out guys like me? I got something to tell them. Professor, why isn't the LA Times or somebody asking me for my opinion?"
I probed a bit. "So what is it you want to say to them?"
Sam opened the verbal floodgates. "Hey, I've always voted Republican. For the first time in my life I'm going to vote for a Democrat. I'm voting for Obama."
"Why's that?"
"My gas station businesses are hurting. I make the same profit margin--5 to 8 cents per gallon--no matter whether the price of gas is $1.99 per gallon or $4.99. The big oil companies are the ones raking in the profits when prices go up, not me. I can make money on gas only through volume sales--and if people are hurting, I make less on gas. Or I start to lose money, like now. Where I make money, though, is when they come inside and buy discretionary items--food, drinks, lottery tickets. Right now, people aren't buying. I know 20 of my gas station colleagues are about to declare bankruptcy. It's bad."
"So I'm fed up with the Republicans. Tax cuts for the rich, the war--all that stuff. The middle class needs help. I'm finally convinced. I'm going for Obama. First time in my life, I tell you."
I asked him about paying higher taxes.
"I don't care about that. If I'm making money, I don't care. I'll pay my taxes. But I'm not going to make any money if the middle-class guy doesn't have money in his pocket to buy my gas or my food. I don't need the big tax cut right now. That's not going to bring the customers into my gas stations."
Joe versus Sam. You could line up economists spouting elegant theories for each side, but the basic arguments can probably be reduced to Joe's and Sam's respective positions on very gut levels. Joe's never made $250,000, but he feels that if he ever reaches that threshold, he shouldn't be "penalized" for his success. He seems to believe that cutting taxes for wealthy individuals somehow serves his current financial interests and his aspirations for the future. Sam's already lived those trickle-down and dream-up Republican talking points but now rejects them with hard-won conviction.
Were the two of them to meet and strike up a conversation, side by side on adjacent treadmills, I dare say that Sam would be giving Joe an earful, not the other way around.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-seery/joe-the-plumber-meets-sam_b_135399.html
Joe the Plumber Meets Sam the Gas Station Guy
By John Seery
A few days ago (which is to say, prior to the Wednesday night presidential debate), I met Sam. Joe the Plumber should really meet Sam, too.
I was jogging away on the treadmill at my local gym when the guy next to me--who turned out to be Sam--introduced himself. He seemed to want to talk, which was fine by me. He asked what I did. I told him. He immediately replied, "Oh, I've never met a professor before. I never went to college. Seriously, in my entire life I've never read a book all the way through. Please, Professor, don't make fun of me."
Of course I wouldn't. Besides, I found Sam's humility, curiosity, and affability endearing. As Sam talked, I became only more enthralled in what he had to say. He told me his life story. He grew up in Yonkers, New York and came out to California in his early twenties. At 22 he found himself working as an entry-level cashier at a gas station. Eventually he cobbled together loans and a payment schedule and bought the station.
Cut to the future: Now 38 years old, Sam owns more than 100 gas stations in southern California and 25 restaurant franchises. He has over 800 employees working for him. He has four kids in a happy marriage. He's a devout churchgoer. He's a proud American and lets you know that.
We started talking politics. "You know what," he said, "I'd really like some reporter to come and ask me my views on the election. Why don't they ever seek out guys like me? I got something to tell them. Professor, why isn't the LA Times or somebody asking me for my opinion?"
I probed a bit. "So what is it you want to say to them?"
Sam opened the verbal floodgates. "Hey, I've always voted Republican. For the first time in my life I'm going to vote for a Democrat. I'm voting for Obama."
"Why's that?"
"My gas station businesses are hurting. I make the same profit margin--5 to 8 cents per gallon--no matter whether the price of gas is $1.99 per gallon or $4.99. The big oil companies are the ones raking in the profits when prices go up, not me. I can make money on gas only through volume sales--and if people are hurting, I make less on gas. Or I start to lose money, like now. Where I make money, though, is when they come inside and buy discretionary items--food, drinks, lottery tickets. Right now, people aren't buying. I know 20 of my gas station colleagues are about to declare bankruptcy. It's bad."
"So I'm fed up with the Republicans. Tax cuts for the rich, the war--all that stuff. The middle class needs help. I'm finally convinced. I'm going for Obama. First time in my life, I tell you."
I asked him about paying higher taxes.
"I don't care about that. If I'm making money, I don't care. I'll pay my taxes. But I'm not going to make any money if the middle-class guy doesn't have money in his pocket to buy my gas or my food. I don't need the big tax cut right now. That's not going to bring the customers into my gas stations."
Joe versus Sam. You could line up economists spouting elegant theories for each side, but the basic arguments can probably be reduced to Joe's and Sam's respective positions on very gut levels. Joe's never made $250,000, but he feels that if he ever reaches that threshold, he shouldn't be "penalized" for his success. He seems to believe that cutting taxes for wealthy individuals somehow serves his current financial interests and his aspirations for the future. Sam's already lived those trickle-down and dream-up Republican talking points but now rejects them with hard-won conviction.
Were the two of them to meet and strike up a conversation, side by side on adjacent treadmills, I dare say that Sam would be giving Joe an earful, not the other way around.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-seery/joe-the-plumber-meets-sam_b_135399.html
Well, am I the only one who wants to see equal time served?
Let's hear from Josephine the plumber! She's always managed to clean up stubborn messes.
Meanwhile, all political BS aside, I sure wouldn't kick hottie Joe out of bed . . .
Let's hear from Josephine the plumber! She's always managed to clean up stubborn messes.
Meanwhile, all political BS aside, I sure wouldn't kick hottie Joe out of bed . . .
peterh770
Well-known member
Oh, yeah, like the HuffPo is fair and balanced and a legitimate source...
peterh770
Well-known member
Here you go. A great description of Joe Derangement Syndrome from which so many of you suffer.
http://townhall.com/Columnists/MichelleMalkin/2008/10/17/the_left_declares_war_on_joe_the_plumber
http://townhall.com/Columnists/MichelleMalkin/2008/10/17/the_left_declares_war_on_joe_the_plumber
panthera
Well-known member
Peter,
I'm not doing politics till after the election, but have to agree with you, no there aren't too many truly neutral and well-balanced sources out there.
Personally, I have found the following to be useful:
NPR, Diane Rehm show. Today, for instance, she had senior people from The Wall Street Journal, The Atlantic, and Time Magazine on her program. Certainly a wide range of views there. As frequently on her program.
The Wall Street Journal. I know they are quite a bit to the left of you now-a-days, but their in-depth background analysis of current events often fills in gaps in my knowledge. The gods know, that's an endless job...
The New York Times, Washington Post, Sacramento Bee. All three are definitely on your left, but all three also have a reputation for apologizing when wrong. When caught being wrong, better said. That's worth something.
Blogs: Crunchy Con, The Dish, The Corner, National Review are my mainstays. I already know why I am a liberal. It does me good to read well written conservative viewpoints.
Of course, I will go out of my way to read George Will.
Of course, I also read German language publications as well as listening regularly to the BBC.
Where do you get your information from?
I'm not doing politics till after the election, but have to agree with you, no there aren't too many truly neutral and well-balanced sources out there.
Personally, I have found the following to be useful:
NPR, Diane Rehm show. Today, for instance, she had senior people from The Wall Street Journal, The Atlantic, and Time Magazine on her program. Certainly a wide range of views there. As frequently on her program.
The Wall Street Journal. I know they are quite a bit to the left of you now-a-days, but their in-depth background analysis of current events often fills in gaps in my knowledge. The gods know, that's an endless job...
The New York Times, Washington Post, Sacramento Bee. All three are definitely on your left, but all three also have a reputation for apologizing when wrong. When caught being wrong, better said. That's worth something.
Blogs: Crunchy Con, The Dish, The Corner, National Review are my mainstays. I already know why I am a liberal. It does me good to read well written conservative viewpoints.
Of course, I will go out of my way to read George Will.
Of course, I also read German language publications as well as listening regularly to the BBC.
Where do you get your information from?
peterh770
Well-known member
When I go to a news or network site, I always get sidetracked into other areas. There is only so many hours a day! So my info comes from a number of blogs that link directly to the articles that support their opinions. My mainstays are Michelle Malkin, Gay Patriot, Gay Conservative, Gateway Pundit, Patterico's Pontifications, Instapundit and The Jawa Report.
"Here you go. A great description of Joe Derangement Syndrome from which so many of you suffer."
...and here YOU are, joining right in! LOL
...and here YOU are, joining right in! LOL
panthera
Well-known member
Interesting, Peter
Thanks. You are right about there only being so many hours in the day. It is tough to find the time. I justify some of my reading by using topics of current interest in my courses on intercultural communication and business English.
Yup, teaching freshman English again this semester. I'm rather desperately trying to competently teach me students not to split their infinitives, pay they attention to declining pronouns and make many fewer mistakes in their modifiers.
Gay patriot and gay conservative are new to me, have to check them out. I gave up on Instapundit several months ago, primarily because the comments were driving the blog and not the opposite. Have they regained some semblance of order?
I'll check out those two gay blogs, how about you give the Wall Street Journal a chance?
By the by, Michelle and I almost never agree, as you might expect, but boy was she hopping mad and spitting furious about the Bush three-page, unlimited authority bail-out proposal. She sounded pretty much exactly like David Frum, Chris Buckley, Sullivan and Nancy Reagan on that one. Who knows, mayhap there's still hope. She's one of the few conservative (as opposed to Republican) commentators left who haven't come over to the dark side. Yet.
(Cue up Lugosi's dry chuckle).
Gonna leave it at that, my promise not to talk politics till after the election constrains me.
Thanks. You are right about there only being so many hours in the day. It is tough to find the time. I justify some of my reading by using topics of current interest in my courses on intercultural communication and business English.
Yup, teaching freshman English again this semester. I'm rather desperately trying to competently teach me students not to split their infinitives, pay they attention to declining pronouns and make many fewer mistakes in their modifiers.
Gay patriot and gay conservative are new to me, have to check them out. I gave up on Instapundit several months ago, primarily because the comments were driving the blog and not the opposite. Have they regained some semblance of order?
I'll check out those two gay blogs, how about you give the Wall Street Journal a chance?
By the by, Michelle and I almost never agree, as you might expect, but boy was she hopping mad and spitting furious about the Bush three-page, unlimited authority bail-out proposal. She sounded pretty much exactly like David Frum, Chris Buckley, Sullivan and Nancy Reagan on that one. Who knows, mayhap there's still hope. She's one of the few conservative (as opposed to Republican) commentators left who haven't come over to the dark side. Yet.
(Cue up Lugosi's dry chuckle).
Gonna leave it at that, my promise not to talk politics till after the election constrains me.
I much preferred the BBC's coverage of the primaries earlier this year. I'll probably tune into them for a good portion of the time come election night. They'll be a much more collected bunch than all of the foamers on network and cable news here in the U.S.
So Sam isn't as relevant as Joe? Why? McCain pulled Joe out of obscurity and what was the point? I have relatives just like Joe. My cousin has never made more than $25,000 a year but is so over the top republican that he almost spits when the rest of the family vote democratic. His sole reason is that when he makes it rich, he's 42 now, he doesn't want to pay taxes. He rants on and on about the so called "death tax" that will never impact him, and how all the dem's are crooks. Hmmm, OK.
You know what? My income has gone up and down, and when it was high I did not hate paying the taxes, I didn't like it, but I knew it was part of living in this country. There is a lot of crap in the budget that could be cut, no question, but there are lots of things there that benefit everyone too. You take the bad with the good, and hope the good outweighs the bad. When the middle class has money the country thrives, people invest and spend. Sam's story points out that fact. Simple as that.
You know what? My income has gone up and down, and when it was high I did not hate paying the taxes, I didn't like it, but I knew it was part of living in this country. There is a lot of crap in the budget that could be cut, no question, but there are lots of things there that benefit everyone too. You take the bad with the good, and hope the good outweighs the bad. When the middle class has money the country thrives, people invest and spend. Sam's story points out that fact. Simple as that.
perc-o-prince
Well-known member
and Palin is an uneducated hillbilly.
rickr- Um, I think your're WRONG!!! You have to have hills to be a hillbilly. I don't think there are hills in Alaska! Maybe she can be a tundra-billy, or a snowdrift-billy, but hillbilly??? I donno!!! But, she's an uneduficated something-billy... that's for sure!!!
Chuck
rickr- Um, I think your're WRONG!!! You have to have hills to be a hillbilly. I don't think there are hills in Alaska! Maybe she can be a tundra-billy, or a snowdrift-billy, but hillbilly??? I donno!!! But, she's an uneduficated something-billy... that's for sure!!!
Chuck
gyrafoam
Well-known member
Now Chuck, surely you know how mountainous Alaska is. All the more reason for her to GET LOST!
And in the south---------
http://www.theonion.com/content/news/southern_sheriff_pulls_over_obama
And in the south---------
http://www.theonion.com/content/news/southern_sheriff_pulls_over_obama
Hi Chuck, No she is a hillbilly. These days one does not have to live in the hills to qualify as a hillbilly. I did hear an interview of someone that lived in Alaska on NPR last week, and the person proudly refered to himself as a hillbilly. He was a big Palin fan. Go figure....
peterh770
Well-known member
The point is that Joe asked a question of Obama, and everyone on the left has attacked him, the media has gone nuts to dig up dirt on him, and McCain even has to defend him. It's just a question. Obama answered very stupidly as viewed to conservative Americans and Republicans. Who asked isn't relevant; Obama would probably have answered just as stupidly if it was his own plant so that he could show his own view to middle class America without a teleprompter. The left should be angry at Obama for sounding like the Communist Manifesto on CD.
As for Sam, shoot, he was probably made up by a writer at HuffPo. Every Patel that has a Paki-Mart or 7-11 is finding a way to make a living off of gas AND send money back to family back in their homeland. If that owner was educated on his business, he would know that the big nasty oil company is making .07 net on every gallon while the government is making .18. If he was really up on his business, he'd be more outraged that the govt made at least twice as much as what Exxon-Mobil reported as profits.
Greg, it's like a barfight. You're standing there, the fight breaks out, and you decide to hit someone with a beer bottle. Maybe it's stupid, maybe it's fun. Sometimes, you just have to join in.
Not for nothing, but like Panthera, I'm looking forward to the day after election day when we can all get normal again...until it starts all over in 3 years.
As for Sam, shoot, he was probably made up by a writer at HuffPo. Every Patel that has a Paki-Mart or 7-11 is finding a way to make a living off of gas AND send money back to family back in their homeland. If that owner was educated on his business, he would know that the big nasty oil company is making .07 net on every gallon while the government is making .18. If he was really up on his business, he'd be more outraged that the govt made at least twice as much as what Exxon-Mobil reported as profits.
Greg, it's like a barfight. You're standing there, the fight breaks out, and you decide to hit someone with a beer bottle. Maybe it's stupid, maybe it's fun. Sometimes, you just have to join in.
Not for nothing, but like Panthera, I'm looking forward to the day after election day when we can all get normal again...until it starts all over in 3 years.
Well, if the oil companies are only making .07 net/gal, they must be selling a hell of a lot of gas to have record profits every quarter. I know I like most people cut back on driving, apparently others went out joyriding to boost gas sales.
The Joe the plumber analagy strikes a chord with me, being that I operate my own audiovisual business. The way Obama's tax plan works, my business stands to be trampled HARD by taxes. Why? Well, it is very simple, audiovisual equipment is EXPENSIVE!!! Yet, I am not a millionaire, by any means! The profit margin on audiovisual equipment is nil....in the 2-1 percent range. We make our money off of installation and service. The problem is that I can move well over a million dollars worth of equipment through my shop in a year's time. The way Obama's tax plan has it laid out, my shop will be taxed by INCOME, not on revenues. That money I take in from my customers goes right back out to my suppliers, just like the gas station owner that MattL mentioned. The problem is that on the way in the front door, and out the back, Obama wants to tax it! The only way around this is going to be to significantly raise my prices on the products I sell just to break even....I am suprised the gas station owner is too short-sighted to figure out that chances are, he moves more than $250,000 gasoline and groceries through his store, and although he doesn't make any money off that fuel, the money he takes in for it will be taxed!
The second problem is that my company's core business comes from the $250,000 + "tax bracket". I don't see anybody in the ghetto installing high-end multimedia systems. If this tax bracket is taxed hard, then they will not be spending as much money on discresionary things like me installing high-end audiovisual equipment...double whammy! I am worried, really worried. My business is holding out fairly good through this recession, but we stand to loose some business here as schools and colleges get their budgets cut because of tax revenue loss. I am saving up now, because if I'm doing the numbers right, I don't know if I am going to be able to keep the lights on if Obama gets elected! Yea, let's "help" the middle class out by taxing the money faucet out of existance, and making it harder to run our businesses! Yea, my tax return will be smaller, but what good is that going to do when I don't have any income in the first place!
...and yes, I am licensed and CTS certified!!!
The second problem is that my company's core business comes from the $250,000 + "tax bracket". I don't see anybody in the ghetto installing high-end multimedia systems. If this tax bracket is taxed hard, then they will not be spending as much money on discresionary things like me installing high-end audiovisual equipment...double whammy! I am worried, really worried. My business is holding out fairly good through this recession, but we stand to loose some business here as schools and colleges get their budgets cut because of tax revenue loss. I am saving up now, because if I'm doing the numbers right, I don't know if I am going to be able to keep the lights on if Obama gets elected! Yea, let's "help" the middle class out by taxing the money faucet out of existance, and making it harder to run our businesses! Yea, my tax return will be smaller, but what good is that going to do when I don't have any income in the first place!
...and yes, I am licensed and CTS certified!!!
panthera
Well-known member
Steven,
I think, if you ask a tax specialist, she or he will tell you the same thing I've read: No, your business expenses will remain expenses, not taxable income.
My family situation limits me in what I can earn a lot. But the nature of my private business is such that I occasionally move significant sums of money through my accounts with only a few thousand Euros actually accruing through my value addition. In short, I know exactly what sort of situation you're in there. Good bookkeeping separates things out at the end of every quarter.
I understand your reluctance to see Obama elected, but this fear, at least, is not one you need have. As for the rest, well, if you do have real income of, say, $250,000/year after all allowable deductions, then, yes, you're going to pay more. At the moment, it looks like not quite $1000 more/year.
But hey, after the bailout of the last few weeks, I am certain of two things. One, Republicans had better never again lecture me on how they are not socialists and, two, we are all going to be paying through the nose for a long, long time...unto the seventh generation, at least.
I think, if you ask a tax specialist, she or he will tell you the same thing I've read: No, your business expenses will remain expenses, not taxable income.
My family situation limits me in what I can earn a lot. But the nature of my private business is such that I occasionally move significant sums of money through my accounts with only a few thousand Euros actually accruing through my value addition. In short, I know exactly what sort of situation you're in there. Good bookkeeping separates things out at the end of every quarter.
I understand your reluctance to see Obama elected, but this fear, at least, is not one you need have. As for the rest, well, if you do have real income of, say, $250,000/year after all allowable deductions, then, yes, you're going to pay more. At the moment, it looks like not quite $1000 more/year.
But hey, after the bailout of the last few weeks, I am certain of two things. One, Republicans had better never again lecture me on how they are not socialists and, two, we are all going to be paying through the nose for a long, long time...unto the seventh generation, at least.
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