Look What Happened to My 1958 General Electric Washer

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Wow

Hi Robert

I did something vaguely similar a few years ago, but much less sophisticated.

As I live with solar power, at the time we had a small PV system and needed to watch every watt.

My first conversion was was a Hoover Keymatic, it lost the timer and keyplate, replaced with two clockwork timers from a twin tub, 15 min for wash and 4 minute for spin. The original reversing motor (Keymatics reverse motor to spin) was replaced by two motors, a 12 volt golf buggy motor for spin and a Renault windscreen wiper motor for wash. Each had its own pulley and clutch on the back of the drum. To use - turn wash timer on full 15 minutes. 12 volts goes to first pressure switch, when low it fills via 12 volt solenoid valves, when high it operates the wiper motor for tumble. (not reversing, but keymatics can't reverse anyway, they are driven through 2 one-way clutches.) Next turn spin timer on for 4 min, 12 volts goes to the second pressure switch. When high the it pumps out and tumbles, when low the spin motor engages too. the pump was a Hoovermatic twinnie pump, belt driven by a car heater fan motor. As the 12 volt golf buggy motor had just enough torque to start the spin, a bit marginal, I had the tumble motor continue at the same time, to keep distributing the load till the spin motor can take over. (In the keymatic, there are two one-way clutches on the drum shaft, whichever is driving faster drives the drum, the other clutch idles along. )....repeat turning the timers for rinses. So I had a 12 volt DC Hoover Keymatic, though the keyplate didn't function.

my second conversion used a Belt Drive Whirlpool, Australian made version of course. This time I kept the original 240 volt timer, solenoids, inlet valves, wiring harness. I replaced the inefficient 240 volt motor with a salvaged computer tape drive motor from an ancient mainframe computer, bought from a recycler. This motor required 60 volts DC, so I used a toroidal transformer connected to the washing machine's original 240 volt motor harness, through a bridge rectifier to give me 60 volts DC. I had to make up an adapter plate to hold the new motor in place. The new motor used under 200 watts but washed and spun WAYYY better than the original 600 watts plus induction motor. I had no way to measure the spin speed but I would guesstimate about 900 to 1000 rpm spin. I also replaced the heavy gunk in the transmission with a lighter oil (ATF or manual gearbox oil, I can't remember) to ease the load on the motor. The transmission sounded "under stress" both washing and spinning due to oscillating faster than designed, but it worked fine for a couple of years. It washed really well, too. It was only replaced when I got a Fisher Paykel washer, which performed similarly and only used about 130 watts.
 
Excellent Job Robert!

It is always great to see videos from you about your projects and your fantastic collection. What a great machine you have created.

Enjoy,
Rich
 
Vintage Versatronicalness!!

Are two of your photos hinting that you might also customize your WA-755W? I'm wondering if/why you picked the solid tub model over the later one for the maiden flight.

You realized and achieved what GE/Hotpoint TRIED to accomplish but, ultimately, failed because their attempt was half-assed; you went full Monty. What you built is what these machines (which came and went very quickly because the range of speeds was minimal and made little or no difference to the consumer{I only wish that CU had had the cohones to rate either of these machines during their time})should have been.
I wish I had a WWA8800L to donate for enhancement; the extra knobs are already there.

I'd like to find the Hotpoint "All-Fabric", but I balked at the GE's when I knew what MAX WASH and MAX SPIN amounted to:

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I just want to ask one thing- can the gear case break 1150 rpm? I noticed you let the motor gradually slow down the spin?
Hi Chet, The entire inside of the GE transmission locks and turns together when the pulley is turned counter-clockwise so speed is a non-issue as long as the bearings can take it, which 1000 to 1200rpm is perfectly within the bearings specs. As a matter of fact the upper sleeve bearing in the 58's transmission is the exact same part number as the earlier AW6 fast spinning transmissions.

I do wonder how well the fins and drive block area will hold up under the stress. Seems like the old brittle Bakelite might be unforgiving of the extra stress.
Hi Steve, I think it will handle it just fine mainly because I'm not using the power boost agitation speed for more than 30 seconds or so just to get the load moving, I think it would be too hard on the clothing, although I have done microfiber rags at about 100 oscillations per minute and they came out perfectly fine.

As for the transmission, before I started this project I completely rebuilt it. I cleaned it thoroughly, installed brand new sleeve and roller bearings, all new seals, a brand new drive block and tub hub and then I refilled it with the proper amount of 40 weight non-detergent oil. It doesn't sound stressed at all when running at high speed.

Chris you projects sounded super cool, love to see some video or pictures of those running. I really surprised to hear that a belt-drive Whirlpool spinning at 900 to 1000, how did the suspension system handle that speed??? I've heard that even at 700rpm a belt-drive Whirlpool had some major vibration issues.

Are two of your photos hinting that you might also customize your WA-755W?
No I won't do that to that machine Ken because it was brand new and never used and I just started using it a few years ago. I'm also not sure how the perforated tub GE machines suspension system would handle high speed spin, although it may be just fine.

I suspect a Maytag would be another candidate for this and it could handle 1100rpm+ spin, but I'm not positive. Maybe we will have to find out!
 
VFD Primer for those who may want to try this...

A variable frequency drive or VFD is used to run 3-phase motors on standard residential electrical outlets without needing 3-phase power. It has many settings and inputs and outputs to allow you to do many different things such as control the motors rotation direction, speed, acceleration and deceleration time, etc.

Here is how I set up my VFD to control new motor in the washer...

Step 1:
I had to figure out is how am I going to tell the difference between the agitation and spin signal coming out of the washer's timer. So I studied washer's the wiring diagram. I found four wires going to the original motor. Red, Pink, Blue and White. Since the original motor was a reversing motor, clockwise for agitation and counter-clockwise for spin it was clear on the washers wiring diagram that the Blue and White wires do the reversing in the start winding. For agitation the White wire is energized and the Blue wire is neutral. For spin the timer reverses the polarity between those two wires and the Blue wire is now energized and the White wire is now neutral. I confirmed this with my electrical meter that during agitation the White wire has 120 volts on it and the Blue wire was neutral and when I set the dial to spin and pulled it out they reversed and the Blue wire now has 120 volts on it and White became neutral. So it was settled, the Blue and White wires will give the signal to the VFD and the Red and Pink wires can be removed as they are no longer needed for the new motor.

GE


Step 2:
Wire the VFD from the Washer's Power Cord to the New Motor--
The VFD power input get's wired directly to the washers power cord, however I made one exception. I wired it so the hot line is powered by the wire that power's the control panel dial light. This way the VFD is energized and ready to go when the timer dial is set to anywhere but off. So whenever the timer dial is lit the VFD is turned on a waiting for a run signal when the dial is pulled out to start...

Power


Step 3:
Program the VFD functions via it's control panel and decide on how to set up the blue control terminals. They use the word "programming" but it's really not anything more than just setting options on the VFD's digital display--
VFD


For the washer project I only needed three signals. Here is how I set them up:
S1 = 0: Run the Motor Clockwise for Agitation
S2 = 1: Run the Motor Counter-clockwise for Spin
S3 = 10: Use Alternate Acceleration/Deceleration Time
S4 and S5 Not used

For the motor acceleration times I set the primary acceleration time to 0.1 seconds as for agitation doesn’t need any delay in getting the motor up to full speed. But for Spin I set up the alternate acceleration time to 80 seconds to bring the tub up to speed slowly and not causes suds locks with the water being violently thrown around in the outer tub before the pump has time to drain it away. The '58 GE isn't like an earlier AW6, Frigidaire or other solid tub washers where the outer tub was huge and could hold the entire tubs worth of water below the spinning tub, so you have to be careful with acceleration time in this machine. As for the deceleration times, I disabled them and set the VFD to always coast the motor to a stop.

Step 4:
Wire the Relays and VFD Control Terminals
The diagram below is a simplifed version so you get the idea, however I actually wired the speed selector potentiometers into the agitate and spin relays as well, but I didn't show that as I didn't want it to get even more busy.

Relays.jpg


Okay who's gonna soup-up the next washer? ;-D
 
My Dream Machine

Beautiful work Robert!!! A 1957 or '58 Filter-Flo is my dream machene. My Mom had a 1960 model and eventually passed it on to my Grandmother. The machine was still going strong in 1988 when my Grandmother died.

Yes, my Mom DID get a new Filter-Flo to replace the one she handed down.
 
Well, the high speed "Activation" certainly gives a new meaning to the phrase "Live Water". Given the speed of Pulsation in ,say, a Unimatic, I wouldn't think it would damage fabrics as long as there is enough water to circulate easily.

I have Jason's tricked out '65 LK downstairs. It has a high speed pulley. Agitation with a Super Roto Swirl is comical as the clothes can't figure out if they should go up or down! They sure do get thrashed.
The suspension is not forgiving of the higher spin speeds and it really shakes and vibrates heavily. Would likely be better as a bolt-down! A fun and splashy machine but impractical as a daily driver, unless you leave the house.
 
It is incredible!

 

I wish the original design team could see your work, how amazed they would be.  Not only that their beautiful machine has been restored and is still appreciated after 6 decades...it's even been improved with modern technology!
 
"We Bring Good Things to Life"

Wow - the GE has morphed into a beast of a washer. Great job working through solutions for the Filter Flo system and the off balance switch from a Kenmore. Genius!

What are the specs of the motor? Frame number?

I've had dreams of doing this exact thing to a Maytag for years. Your work here is some good inspiration...

Ben
 
Good engineering Robert.

In the the early to mid 20th century, most industrial motors were 3 phase.
In the rail industry etc., gate turn off thyristor's became the new technology.
 
GE Washer

Wow, Robert, you have been busy, that's a fab fun project for sure, nothing like some customisation on your fav washer !! Is that an inline water heater tube under the LH of the washtub ??

Nowthen, am just thinking how and what your "Washer Customisation Department" will come up with this time for your total project washing machine, after the splendui job they did on your previous washer ...ducks n runs ha ha !!

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Hey Robert

I had a bit of a brainstorm a few months ago regarding doing a similar modification to the 2018 speed queen. My idea was to install the legacy drive train back in, keeping the 3 phase motor and mcu.

Only problem is that somehow I have to figure out how to reprogram the original mcu, or set up something different. The issue with that is the sq mcu is both the ccu, and mcu. The touch pad on top is strictly a user interface (I believe).

I’d love to get some input if you have any ideas.

-Eugene
 
Robert, why is there a hesitation of the tub spinning for a few seconds when the motor first kicks on? I know in the washer's original form the tub begins spinning as soon as the motor starts. Also, aren't you concerned that this high speed agitation will put a strain on the old GE tub pawl that prevents the tub from rotation during wash? Since GE didn't add a tub brake until 1960 I know how finicky this can be. Our old 59 had a problem with this in it's later years.
 
LOL Mike, you still have that Super-Unimatic picture I see! No heater in the GE, although because of its recirculation system it would be a perfect candidate for it.

I have to figure out how to reprogram the original mcu, or set up something different. The issue with that is the sq mcu is both the ccu, and mcu.
Hi Eugene, I'm not sure exactly what you mean by mcu and ccu. I would think taking on a project like that would require a new computer interface/board unless you can somehow gain access to what has been programmed on the SQ's chip-set. That would be super fun to be able to reprogram certain machines if one could get into the code. Would take a bit of research for sure.

Hey Les, those are really good questions.
why is there a hesitation of the tub spinning for a few seconds when the motor first kicks on? I know in the washer's original form the tub begins spinning as soon as the motor starts.
I was wondering if anyone would notice or ask about that lol. I programmed the VFD to do that purposely that when counter-clockwise rotation is called for (spin) to give a five or so seconds of delay time so the pump can pre-drain the outer tub of the extra Filter-Flo water before the main tub-full of water is thrown out in the outer tub.

Also, aren't you concerned that this high speed agitation will put a strain on the old GE tub pawl that prevents the tub from rotation during wash?
Not really because that part is made out of a nylon/plastic and is a perfect candidate to be 3D printed if necessary. When I rebuilt the transmission nearly 1/2 of the oil was gone, now that it is refilled I suspect the weight of a full charge of oil will help protect that part.

Ahhhh there is nothing like a properly spun wash-load!!! You can tell just by looking at it.

Properly
 
Thanks, Robert. The spin pause makes perfect sense now that you've explained it to me. I notice you've changed the grey rubber gasket that hold the filter pan in place in this photo to one with "teeth" from the original smoother one. Does this one hold the pan in place better with the higher speed agitation or are you just messing with us? LOL.
 
Geez I can't slip anything past you guys lol. Actually no, the rubber Filter mount I have for the copper filter pan is in perfect condition as it's brand new-old-stock and holds the pan perfectly. The last new one I had held the pan down for over 10 years but started to wear out and recently I found another brand new one on eBay. The slotted filter-mount on the picture in the post above is for the later pans. I like to have variety in my wash-day (variety prevents Monday-blues of course) so I routinely change the filter pan mount back and forth so I can use the later pans as well.

This was the pan I used last night for the fun of it, I love this one too...

Plastic
 
WOWZERS!!

That is really OUT OF SIGHT Unimatic1140/Robert! Of course, I love the gentler agitation and the faster spin speed!
LOVE IT!
Too cool!
:o)
 
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