Maytag A712 Question

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colloquor

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Joined
Jan 21, 2015
Messages
18
The orbital transmission in our "old reliable" Maytag A712 washer failed after 24 years of excellent service. After surveying a number of new washers, including the Speed Queens with the mechanical timer (probably the only new washer I would have purchased), and speaking with a number of experienced appliance service technicians, I've decided to repair the A712 instead of buying a new machine since its in excellent aesthetic condition, plus my wife simply likes the washer! FYI... I'm a retired auto technician, and have maintained all of our appliances since we bought this house in 1990.

After initial troubleshooting, I've decided to essentially overhaul the washer, replacing the majority of the mechanical internals, including the failed deep tub orbital transmission of course.

Here's my question: Do you install the brake assembly on the bottom of the suspension block (also sometimes called the damper) prior to installing the transmission, or after the transmission is installed through the suspension block?

Otherwise the overhaul is pretty straightforward. The snubber pads beneath the suspension block are also being replaced as they were worn down to the metal base of the washer.

Although some may feel it's crazy to invest $400 to $500 in parts in rebuilding a 24 year old washer, most professional technicians I have talked with have told me the Maytag A712 is a great washer, and worthwhile of overhauling. Thankfully, the outer tub and top have practically no rust, thus leaks after the overhaul hopefully won't be a problem.

Thanks for any insight on my question.
 
There are many people here on this site that will commend you for what you are doing.

Maytag's are good performers that last and last when maintained. Try to touch base with "Combo52" on this site. He has been in the appliance business for years and has given his support and knowledge to many to keep their machines going. His e-mail is listed on his profile page which you can access thru the "member profiles" tab at the top of the page.

Good luck with your restoration and welcome to AW.ORG.
 
Redcarpetdrew is another good resource.  He's an authorized Maytag repairman. 

 

Also, click on the Super Searchalator link at the top right of this forum's index page.  Type something like "maytag orbital" in the field and threads discussing that topic will be displayed.

 

Redcarpetdrew has posted some detailed threads about Maytag repairs, but I can't say for sure if they address your specific transmission and the related repair process.

 

I can assure you that there are people here who can answer your question.  You may have to allow them some time to check in here and notice your thread.
 
Perhaps I was incorrect in my choice of nomenclature for the transmission, perhaps it's called a helical transmission instead... I apologize for mis-speaking if I was incorrect.

No, it doesn't look like the transmission in your photo mrb627. I have a photo on file, but it's from one of the repair websites, thus I shouldn't use it here. But, it looks like a car's rear differention. The Whirlpool (OEM) Part Number is 6-2097750
 
I'm sorry, I meant to say "it looks like a car's rear differential." Darn tablet...

There are two transmissions available for the A712 from RepairClinic.com - one for the deep tub, and one for the shallow tub. Our's is the deep tub's transmission, and the Whirlpool (OEM) Part Number, as I listed in the above post, is 6-2097750.

I presume this is called the helical transmission... Correct. I have all of the new repair parts, and just need to know if I should mount the brake onto the suspension block before installing the transmission, or install the transmission first and then the brake. It looks like it could be done in either order, but just wanted to check first.

Thanks.
 
I was wondering about a 712 having an orbital transmission as well, but I don't know when Maytag made the switch. 

 

It's my understanding that the later orbital transmission provides a quick short agitation stroke and the older "helical" or pitman type provides the classic long agitation stroke associated with the virtually indestructible vintage Maytag washers beloved by many members here.

 

If using the Super Searchalator as I suggested above, modify your search terms accordingly.
 
Since I'm a new member, I can only post every 30 minutes, thus I can't reply to a post as soon as I would like. Well, if the helical transmssion, aka Pittman, is the long-stroke transmission, I would say I have the orbital as originally posted, since the agitation stroke is short. Attached is the photo of the dead transmission from our A712. The washer is in almond color, and here's the entire info from the serial number tag: LA-712 Series: 11 Serial Number 203927 BD

Thanks.

colloquor-2015012115065504239_1.jpg
 
 
The (newer) style that looks like a car's differential is referred to as "orbital" per the gearing inside that drives the agitator (output shaft) ... which is different from the style shown in Reply #3.  However, both types are helical drive, which refers to the method used to drive the tranmission's input shaft.

So, they're both helical drive ... but one is orbital and one is not.  :-)
 
I'm not familiar with this level of repair, but let's say the transmission was fine and you were only needing to replace the brake.  Could you do it without messing with the transmission?  If so, you have your answer.

 

Strange that you're restricted to 30 minutes between replies as a new member.  I've never heard of that, but it might be a defense against spammers and hijackers that our webmaster has implemented.
 
The transmission lower-shaft splines pass through the brake, but the brake screws onto the bottom half the suspension block. A special tool is required to remove the brake, and to put the final tightening torque when installing it. I have one of these $58 tools, and this will likely be the only time I use it!

Since the brake can be removed with the transmission in place on the upper portion of the suspension block, or conversely, can be installed with the transmission in place resting on the suspension block, I guess it's probably best to go ahead and install the transmission first, and then the outer tub, bearings, spin tub, etc. - and once all of the top end work is done, install the brake and the pulley on the bottom end.

I know the transmission can be replaced with the brake attached to the suspension block, hence my original question. There are a number of YouTube videos on A712 repair which are very helpful. In reality, either procedure could probably be followed.
 
Hi Colloquor,

May we refer to you as something else? There's not much in your profile, which is Okay, but some kind of name, whether it be an alias or not would be nice. I have to go to an appointment and when I get back I can post some links to other threads that will help you. I guess you know that you can upgrade your account and have full access to all the features offered here like the Super Searchalator, the different forums and so forth. It's only $12.00 a year and there's lots of great information here on all kinds of topics that you can only see if you're an upgraded member. Not trying to pressure you into anything. Just a suggestion. Looks like PayPal and several different type of credit cards are accepted. And the people here are fantastic. Some of the nicest people you'd ever want to meet or chat with, whether it be in person or over the internet.

As for the transmission/drive confusion thing; that comes up all the time. There's the orbital style and older standard (Pitman) style transmissions, but the drive is the same on both types of machines, unless you're talking about something really old, like early '50's stuff and before. Helical drive refers to the "helix" that's on the end of the drive shaft that the pulley climes up on when the motor reverses. I'll see if I can give you some more info when I get back.

Brian[this post was last edited: 1/21/2015-20:51]
 
I have everything out inside the washer. The brake tool worked very well in removing the brake. I replaced the main drive shaft in my wife's old Lady Kenmore washer (the one with the push button switch rails circa 1971) many years ago, and working on this Maytag is easy compared to that one. And, much easier than being an auto tech on European cars! All of the parts arrived less than an hour ago, so the complete rebuild begins tomorrow. First off is the gluing on of the new felt snubbers, the installation of the suspension block, suspension and springs, transmission, and then everything else. All new bearings and all new mechanicals - the only parts not being replaced are the outer tub, spin tub, drive motor and motor switch assy. I replaced the timer last month, so essentially this will be a new machine intenally. It looks new externally too even though we purchased it in August 1990. The machine will probably now outlive my wife and I.

Don
 
rebuild

When replacing the damper pads,I always use high temp rubber adhesive which lasts forever and then lubricate the pads with plenty of the polylube which should come with the pads.What they give you is often not quite enough so I get a separate tube of the stuff.The new transmission comes with a new stem and seal kit but I would replace the tub bearing and sleeve also if it looks as if water got at it.You will need a spanner wrench to remove the spanner nut and basket mounting stem.You should also clean up the bottom of the transmission support if it was rubbing on the base.If it is rough I would put a small amount of polylube on that as well.
 
bendixmark - Yes, I have the high temp adhesive and plenty of polylube. Amd, yes, a new tub bearing and sleeve were ordered as well, plus the outer tub has been completely cleaned and ready to go back in. I have the spanner wrench (bought the spanner wrench and brake wrench specifically for this job), as everything was dismantled last weekend. The transmission support is brand new as well, plus new outer tub mounting bolts and rubber washers - short bolt goes to the front! The only mechanical parts not new in this rebuild are the suspension arms, the motor and motor switch, the outer tub, and the spin tub. All of the other "guts" including the pump, brake, pulley, belts, hoses, etc. are brand new.

One question: the new transmission did not come with the spring on the top or agitator side (see photo above on the left), nor did it come with the rubber cone-looking seal on the bottom side of the transmission (see photo above on the right). I presume you have to remove those, and place them on the new transmission shafts. I did not see these pieces available separately from the website where I purchased everything.
 
Don,

Have you found a replacement or donor transmission yet? If you can find a parts machine you could snag one out of it. I've got a good one you can have but I don't know how much the shipping would cost. What part of Illinois are you in?

Brian
 
Rebuilding an A712 MT Washer

It sounds like you have it pretty well covered, answers to a few of your questions.

You should assemble the damper housing, supension springs, tub support arms and then screw the brake assembly in from below the baseplate, and then set the transmission in place. The brake assembly just gets screwed completly in place and locked in with the little bolt and clip.

The spring on the old agitator shaft is part of the old agitator shaft seal [ the new seal is an improved lip seal, so you don't need this part ], at this point it just gets recycled along with the old transmission.

It looks like you are having a fun rebuilding project and hopefully you will get many more years use out of this washer, however one of the problems of doing a rebuild like this is many of the NEW replacement parts are not as good as the orignal parts and the machine is not reassembled with the same quality controls as it was orignally, as result it will not likley last as long as it did the first time around without doing additional repair work over the comming years.

John L.
 
Brian and John,

Thank you for all of your information. Yes, I have all of the replacement parts and the new transmission. I purchased the majority of the parts from www.repairclinic.com, including the new transmission.

John, in reference to your statement: "The spring on the old agitator shaft is part of the old agitator shaft seal [ the new seal is an improved lip seal, so you don't need this part ], at this point it just gets recycled along with the old transmission." The new transmission's agitator shaft doesn't have the spring, but I am using the original agitator since it appears to be in good shape. Are you saying that I need to purchase a new agitator, or can use the existing one? I will post a photo of the new transmission and a close-up it's agitator shaft this afternoon, as I'm taking care of my 4 year old grandson this morning!

Thanks again for all of your input. I'm going to start the rebuild tomorrow.
 
John... Attached is a photo of the new transmission. I am a bit confused regarding the spring and seal on the old transmission's agitator shaft. Are you saying that with this new transmission (and seal) I don't need to use the spring? I just want to clarify that. And, do I need to remove the rubber boot from the bottom of the old transmission to use on the new one - since the new one did not come with one?

Everything else on the rebuild is pretty self-explanatory, especially with all of the help here, and the YouTube videos available on the A712. I just need to clarify the differences between the old and new transmission.

Thanks.

colloquor-2015012213552104650_1.jpg
 
Prior to disassembly, I took photos and also took measurements of everything. I'm pretty much an OCD person, and have an obsession with attention to detail. I guess this came from rebuilding BMW and SAAB engines over the years! Thus, I hope my QC on the A712 rebuild will be as close to factory assembly as possible. Probably not, but I'm going to do my best, and check and recheck all of the dimensions, etc. during each step.
 
Don, I think your OCD will pay off.  You are asking good questions.

 

If I knew an auto technician like you, I'd be a customer for life!

 

Ralph
 
Rebuilding an A712 MT Washer

Hi Don, I assume you are replacing the main water seal in the outer tub, it comes in a kit kit called a mounting stem assembly, this seal kit includes the aluminum part that the wash basket is bolted to. This mounting stem has a lip type water seal installed in the top of it, this lip type seal does not need the spring that is on your old transmissions agitator shaft.
 
Don,

If you read Drew's thread>

http://www.automaticwasher.org/cgi-bin/TD/TD-VIEWTHREAD.cgi?25520

again thoroughly you will see that the agitator drive shaft seal isn't absolutely necessary. It's just something that he added to help the new type mounting stem with built in lip seal work better. They have a tendency to fail more than the old type mounting stem with separate drive shaft seal. The spring and washer are inside the agitator drive shaft seal and you normally don't see them. It's reply #22, 23 and 24.

I've done it and it worked well for me.

http://www.automaticwasher.org/cgi-bin/TD/TD-VIEWTHREAD.cgi?38714 Reply #138, 139 and 140. This is what it looks like.

Like John said, you don't have to do this but it might make your repair last longer.

http://www.repairclinic.com/Shop-Fo...A4298-Model-A806-Maytag-Washing-Machine-Parts RepairClinic Item # 1480327 or this>

http://partsdr.com/part/6-0a57420-agitator-drive-shaft-seal/

You put the small end down over the drive shaft, add some grease to the inside threads of the mounting stem and the top of the drive shaft seal, put the mounting stem on, turn it down until snug and give the spanner wrench a few taps with a mini-sledge , (not a rubber mallet like I mentioned in my thread) following the rest of Drew's instructions. You'll be able to see the agitator drive shaft seal pushing up against the lip seal on the mounting stem. That's what makes it last longer. It's just a suggestion.

And the rubber water deflector that's on the bottom of your old transmission will need to be moved to your new one. This thing> http://www.repairclinic.com/PartDet...6/454354?modelNumber=A806&ss=a11b4d83319&mr=1

Brian
 
combo52 and Brian,

Thanks for the all of the tips and information. Yes, I am replacing the mounting stem and seal kit (I ordered one separately, but one was included with the new transmission as well), and the outer tub bearing repair kit. I am replacing all mechancial parts that can be replaced!

However, one part that I have not ordered, but will order today thanks to Brian's input, is the agitator drive shaft seal. Although apparently not absolutely required, I am going to order one and install it. RepairClinic is out of stock at the moment, but PartSelect has them in stock.

With all of the help, and insight, that I've had here, as well as the videos on YouTube, and the instructions provided with the ordered parts, the rebuild should go well.

I sincerely thank everyone for all of their excellent assistance. I'm planning to use high-temp synthetic wheel bearing grease for all of the bearings, splines, etc., but if anyone has a better suggestion on which grease to use, please advise.

Don
 
Rebuilding an A712 MT Washer

Top agitator shaft seals, Hi Everyone, The orignal type seal was pressed against a SS washer, I am very skeptical as to whether it is a good idea to put this upward pressure against the bottom of a lip type seal that is being used in the new mounting stem. If this pressure dislodges the lip seal you are done, or if the pressure just causes the seal to open up a little again you are done, the old type seal will not work without the SS washer being held in the proper place with the retainer clip, are you also putting the clip and washer under the lip seal ?.

 

John L.
 

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