Miele's new HE Detergent

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Didn't even know of it until now. My first guess was that it's simply repackaged Persil, until I read the detailed description that says it doesn't have zeolites... I wonder how it manages to do adequate water softening without them...

Highly concentrated multi-purpose detergent for white or light-colored textiles and heavily soiled, colored fabrics.

Achieve optimum stain removal and keep your whites their brightest, even as you use temperatures as low as 104°F. Miele UltraWhite protects your fabrics by preventing encrustations and other fabric-damaging soil/stains.

Environmental benefit: Contains neither phosphates nor zeolites.

Form: Powder
Fragrance: Fresh fragrance of flowers and fruit
Appearance: White powder with blue pearls
Contents: 2.5 kg for 48 washes (regular soil)
 
I've told ya, Zeolites are on the EU's target site for elimination in consumer products, due to environmental concerns. Persil by Henkel long ago stopped using Sasil (Zeolites), in their detergents in favor of soda and other agents such as phosphonates.

The Miele detergent is not made by Henkel, but near as one can figure out is repackaged product from a German commercial detergent maker, probably Kruessler.

Methinks Miele or at least Miele North America, like many other vendors on both sides of the pond, going for "store brand" products to increase their margins.

L.
 
Miss Laundress is correct! The detergent is made by Kruessler. I bought a box of the UltraWhite and it does a decent job. There is a slight citrus scent to it. Plus one thing I like is that it came with a Miele measuring cup in it. Persil doesnt normally come with a scoop which is maddening since I have use a measuring cup for the stuff. I know its no big deal but if you are going to buy a $50 box of the stuff...damnit have a scoop in it!
On the box of the Miele detergent it says NOT to use on colors. It will fade darks fast. I dont think that its any better than Persil and certainly not better than SA8. I should do a test and see what cleans best in my Miele.
 
Persil stopped using Zeolithes long ago?

Dear Launderess,
your wisdom is normally always appreciated and worth reading, but on this one youre so absolutely wrong Im afraid.
Henkel Persil still uses Zeolithes as a main ingredient for their powders and Megaperls. The phosphonates which youre talking about are only used in small amounts to support the Zeolithes. Maybe there are plans to phase them out in the future, however I have never heard about, but also not sure about.
If youre interessted in current Persil formulations, dont hesitate to contact me over e-mail, I can send you the ingredients list from the German Henkel site.
 
Interesting article, but seems to be faulty researched.
All powdered Henkel detergents sold in Germany for domestic use still contain nonsoluble materials by today.
Maybe Mr Kirschbaum was talking about the new Miele detergent ? :-)
 
Oh Yes

That "HE" label gives the game away. Miele is going private label with their onw brand of laundry products for the USA/North Amercian market. One does not find that silly "HE" label outside these shores as most all European laundry products, absent those designed for twin tubs and such are meant for front loading washing machines.

Wonder what the retail cost of the detergents are verus Persil, and if Miele dealers receive a better deal in terms of wholesale cost/margins than selling Persil.

Bet Henkel/Persil folks aren't happy!

L.
 
I'll look for the new Miele detergent offerings the next time I visit my local Miele dealer.

Meanwhile I'm relieved that Persil still has zeolites. I think they do a pretty good job in a phosphate-free formulation, much better than soda ash ever has.

The Henckel article is interesting. So many yummy "smart chemicals". I wonder if anyone at Henkel would like to do a little challenge with me. Here's a list of the "smart chemicals" mentioned in the article that are being added to laundry detergents and related products:

alcohol sulfate surfactant
nonanoylbenzene sulfonate
diethylester dimethyl ammonium chloride
cationic aminosilicone
pectate lyase
mannanase
ethoxylated quaternized sulfated amine
n-octyl pyrrolidone

The challenge: The chemical representative can mix all of the above together in a bucket, take a teaspoon full, mix it into a glass of water, and drink it.

I'll do the same with a teaspoon full of STPP.

Guess which one will wind up at the hospital at the receiving end of a stomach pump!
 
Only one I know is "nonanoylbenzene sulfonate", which is also known as "NBOS". NBOS is a bleaching activator used with perborate oxygen bleach. P&G's holds several patents involving this chemical, and is one of the star substances behind Tide with Bleach, and IIRC Coldwater Tide as well. Lately P&G has begun adding this bleaching technology to other detergents such as Gain. P&G also used NBOS in "Biz" oxygen bleach/enzyme detergent booster, when they had that product. Not sure if the Redoux stuff uses the same technology.

NBOS is the preferred bleach activator for detergents used in the USA, because of the short wash times normally found there, in Europe TAED is the activator of choice.

L.
 
The box of the Miele Ultrawhite cost me 40 bucks and that was with out the 7 dollar shipping charge. Persil runs here about 47 bucks. I have been using the big box stuff and not the MegaPearls. I will switch back to the MegaPearls once the other stuff is done. They also sell the MieleCare Fabric softener. I did buy a bottle and it doesnt really smell of anything. When the clothes come out of the dryer its a slight fresh air scent to them. It doesnt soften like my fave Downy April Fresh liquid.
 
I hope to hell they're at least gonna keep the Persil available. I've already got several customers started on it, and I'd hate to tell them its no longer available after building it up so much.
 
Andy--- It would be a shame if they dropped it. Persil (Henkel version) is an excellent detergent. I bought a big box of it and although I know it's made for my front-loader, it gives great results when I use it in the TL'er, as well.

A friend who frequently stays at my place loves to wash her clothes in it; loves the scent of fresh rosemary.
 
Well the prices are only slightly less than Persil for Miele's private brand, but even factoring in the cost of importing the products, they still probably have a better margin than selling Henkel's products. Margins would be better if only the products are bulk shipped from Europe and the empty containers printed, made and filled in North America.

As one has often stated, great as Persil products are, compared to what is on offer in the United States for front loaders, Persil really isn't anything that special in Germany or elsewhere in the EU. There are some great store/private label and MOL detergents that cost less than Persil and do the job just as well.

L.
 
Shipping detergent across the atlantic probably makes no sense from a cost or environmental point of view.

Is it possible this stuff is made in the US or Canada ?
 
Best of my knowledge, Kruessler is strictly German and or EU, no plants in North America. Know some persons in various import businesses,and they said it is cheaper to import bulk of most substances, rather than individual packaging.

When one thinks about it, a shipping crate of a certian size, probably holds more bulk powdered detergent, than say trying to fit the same amount already in boxes. Also packages add weight, and take up space.

Matter is easily solved, someone who has these products will have to have a peep at the packets. Because of NAFTA and other things, goods shipped into the United States/North America must be labeled as to where content was made, for tariff purposes.

L.
 
Maybe Henkel/Dial is getting ready to release a high-end Persil-like detergent Stateside, so Miele decided to instead go this route to protect profits?

One never knows, now, do one?
 
I wouldnt hold my breath with them releasing something Persil like. Remember when the Purex Advanced detergent came out...it bombed. Although I thought that it cleaned well the price point was a bit much for people that thought Purex was supposed to be cheap. But one never knows what could be up the sleeve. I remember when they had Dial dishwasher detergent. It was OK. Dont see it anymore.
The Purex Advnaced was a collaboration between Henkel and Dial. It had the blue and green crystals in the powder. It wasnt an HE detergent either. At the time they had a marketing agreement that Henkel will keep their stuff off the market and not compete with Dial...now that Dial is a part of Henkel that may change.
 
Not tried the HE, but have tried

The new Miele dishwasher detergent. I do like it. It seems to do a better job on stainless items. I have not tried the the Miele He, but have played around with their commercial detergetns. I especially like the finishing rinse for linens.
 
I've been using the "UltraWhite", "UltraColor", and Delicate detergents for about a month now. I have to agree with the above posts. Even though they are solid performers, It's not worth the cost compared to the results. I've found that it doesn't perform as well as the Henkel products. The whites version performing the best and the delicate the worst. I've found that I have to use close the recommended amounts to get the same results with much less of Henkel's variants.
I think the colour variant is harsher on the fabrics than Persil Color and the delicate doesn't remove stains when pretreated with it, unlike Black Magic or even Perwoll.
The white formula doesn't get the oil stains out of my massage linens as well regular Persil, even at the max dosage.
The powders look like they have a lot sodium carbonate in them, even though it's further down on the list. But the way the ingredients are listed it's ambiguous. I'll post the list when I get a chance.
When I spoke with the Miele rep, he told me they had no intention of discontinuing the Henkel products and were adding the Miele branded Krueesler products to the line up. Stating that the two companies worked together formulating these products for the American mkt. I think they've just rebranded the commercial products they've been selling here for several years, to cater to the retail mkt.
 

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