modern version of these vintage kenmore dishwashers

[pierreandreply4]

@Chetlaham how would you see modern version of these dishwashers in 2025? 1 model is the white push start button the other electromechanical time

 

[Chetlaham]

I would see them as Power Clean Filter modules. The upper model would be a rapid advance timer, stainless steal tank and door liner, back water distribution system, Pots and Pans, Heavy, Normal, Light, China and Rinse only cycle. Blower assisted dry.

The lower version I would see as a plastic tub, back distribution system. The knob would have Heavy, Normal and Light start demarcations. The push buttons would add or over-ride thermal holds.

Tuned sound damper on both motors. Solenoid actuated dispensers.

Cycle sequence for both models from Pots/Pans and Heavy would be Wash-Rinse-Main Wash- Rinse - Rinse - Final Rinse- Dry. 2.25 gallons per water charge. 13.5 gallons total.


I am debating the wash if of having 3 washes- an open cup and two closed cups, though I can't see such a great need in a power clean. I wouldn't keep the roto rack design. I think Whirlpool had a good upper rack in latter productions.

 

[neptunebob]

Would you really want a modern version? D&M dishwashers were noisy, often rusted, had sharp edges, did not last long with daily use, but did seem more solid than GE machines at the time. GE had that Plastisol which often rusted. The porcelain on steel Kenmore units looked better at first but after 2-3 years most users were in the market for a new dishwasher. I wonder why Sears did not source from Whirlpool earlier than they did around 1985 and then only for the higher priced models.

 

[Chetlaham]

Right, however these machine had the benefits of simplicity and fast cycle times not seen in machines today. Such control systems implemented on a Power Clean or Jet-Clean these would make for leading dishwashers.

Personally Kenmore should have just sourced everything from Whirlpool. Have the BOL all the way up to the TOL lineup be power clean adding features and cycles accordingly.

 

[pierreandreply4]

@Chetlaham i wish there where youtoube videos of these 2 models going trough a full cycle

 

[Chetlaham]

I am sure someone must have something.

I wish I could have the tech sheets to these. I remember reading a generic appliance repair manual that had the cycle sequences to either latter D&M or WCIs that was very elegant. It was something along the lines of this:





Old machines are great inspirations of cycles, features, times, racks, style, control and water systems that could be applied to modern machines. I'd love to adapt such things to a modern Jet-Clean or Modern Power Clean.

FWIW, Robert (Unimatic1140) owns the lower dishwasher. Perhaps he can post pics of the insides, cycle sequence and perhaps do some type of video?

 

[circlew]

Right, however these machine had the benefits of simplicity and fast cycle times not seen in machines today. Such control systems implemented on a Power Clean or Jet-Clean these would make for leading dishwashers.

Personally Kenmore should have just sourced everything from Whirlpool. Have the BOL all the way up to the TOL lineup be power clean adding features and cycles accordingly.

Chet, at the time Sears started selling dishwashers, Whirlpool didn't have a factory making them. Until 1955, Whirlpool only made laundry equipment. That year they acquired both refrigerator (Seeger) and range (RCA Estate) manufacturing facilities. If I remember correctly, Whirlpool sourced their dishwashers from D&M for the first few years.

 

[Chetlaham]

Right, however I think Kenmore should have started re-branding Maytag Jet-Cleans with a re-designed cycle timing sequence and standard rack setup along with Kitchen-Aids with a redesigned upper water distrbution in the early 70s and then switched to full Whirlpool Power Clean Filter module in the mid 80s onward. D&M while cheap, was a huge energy and water wasting mistake.


Those mistakes continued with Kenmore selling GE, WCI, Bosch, and Frigidaire until the 2000s.



Maytag and then latter Whirlpool gave the best run for the money.

 

[pierreandreply4]

@Chetlaham it also ment the end of portable dishwashers whirlpool still makes some and ge but kitchenaid maytag ect we no longer see portable models unless buying a whirlpool not all appartments have space for built in models unles you look newer appartment building aspecaly if some like to use the dishwasher worksurface as an extra prep surface looking back in time to when my mom bough the place we live in if it had this model i would of told my mom to keep it but it had this kitchenaid dishwasher that my mom did not went to keep

 

[Chetlaham]

I would have kept the Kitchen-Aid, it is one of the best dishwashers ever built and from a durability stand point the best residential dishwasher ever built.


If that Kitchen-Aid had a Whirlpool Power Clean Filter Module, extended main wash EM dial timer and redesigned water distribution system it would be a dream machine for me.

 

[neptunebob]

Chet, what if this happened: Hobart, the original builder of KA, decides to reenter the consumer market with a dishwasher like their undercounter commercial models but with residential programming and racks and features. They sometimes run an ad on Facebook that shows such a machine in a nursing home like setting so could they be "feeling out" the market? I doubt if this would happen because Miele has a commercial model and there is a lot of competition but would this concept be something you approve of? Oh, by the way, D&M machines often broke down a lot and Sears sold a lot of maintenance agreements with them, the only reason Sears customers put up with them.

 

[neptunebob]

Chet, you might also like the first dishwasher when we moved into this house in 1975: A Tappan that was already 3 years old that the builder provided that was NOT D&M and it was an awful machine but it did clean the dishes and it just refused to die. Was not replaced with a Kenmore until about 1980. It had a plastisol interior that rusted, was very noisy, had edges so sharp I cut myself twice, had missing plastic parts, broken racks, probably guzzled hot water and energy, and had a timer knob.

 

[Chetlaham]

Chet, you might also like the first dishwasher when we moved into this house in 1975: A Tappan that was already 3 years old that the builder provided that was NOT D&M and it was an awful machine but it did clean the dishes and it just refused to die. Was not replaced with a Kenmore until about 1980. It had a plastisol interior that rusted, was very noisy, had edges so sharp I cut myself twice, had missing plastic parts, broken racks, probably guzzled hot water and energy, and had a timer knob.

Most older dishwashers did not clean. They all lacked one or more of 5 things. The Power Cleans, high end Maytag Jet-Cleans and high end GE dishwashers were the first to successfully identify and rectify all 5 causes. And of course, did away with those awful plastisol tubs.

 

[Chetlaham]

Chet, what if this happened: Hobart, the original builder of KA, decides to reenter the consumer market with a dishwasher like their undercounter commercial models but with residential programming and racks and features. They sometimes run an ad on Facebook that shows such a machine in a nursing home like setting so could they be "feeling out" the market? I doubt if this would happen because Miele has a commercial model and there is a lot of competition but would this concept be something you approve of? Oh, by the way, D&M machines often broke down a lot and Sears sold a lot of maintenance agreements with them, the only reason Sears customers put up with them.

I'd be totally onboard with it and I would totally approve of it. As long as it has the soil handling capabilities of a Whirlpool Power Clean Filter Module and a long heated main wash for that scouring power.

Commercial dishwashers have but two limitations though. They are more for fine cleaning and sanitizing dishes in real time. They do not have macerators, fine filters, seperators, ect and the wash time is very short. The idea is that things go in mostly pre-rinsed.

Any commercial units built for residential would have to handle unrinsed dishes as well as dried and baked on soils.

Now, if such a unit existed I'd certainly buy it!

 

[pierreandreply4]

@Chetlaham i do not know why but even do maytag dishwashers are now made by whirlpool they should bring back the reverse racks design to offer more optins in models and they should also bring back a portable version same with kitchenaid in my toughs

 

[Chetlaham]

Sadly, in 2006 Whirlpool bought Maytag and it was over.

Maytag (Whirlpool really considering where certain Maytag employees (ie cough Ralph F. Hake cough) previously worked... made a lot of bad decisions.

They sold cheapened appliances which failed prematurely and when the Neptune lawsuit required Maytag to accept responsibility for their short comings it was over for Maytag.

A tragedy.