Mr Draper, your General Electric Frost Guard Refrigerator is here...

[epixstar128]

The hot gas bypass whould close way before it got too warm . I did the same thing when i first got my combo. Left the thermostat off and the inside got to 80 in my 65 degree basment. I felt the butter condisner and it was still giving off heat even with the thermostat off.

 

[Ultramatic]

 

 

Yep Eric, it was on soft. Perhaps that contributed to the heat build up.  The dial is on 1 now until I can completely turn it off  for a thorough inside cleaning. I have to some how address that broken plastic panel on the freezer door that attaches to the wire basket. Wish I could find a replacement.

 

I'm not sure what happened Eugene, only that the coils became very warm. The minute I switched it on, they started to cool.

 

[lorainfurniture]

I just trashed the fridge last summer.

Or I would have had every part you would need. I do have the cold control still.

 

[rp2813]

I'm confused.  John said this fridge (30" wide) didn't have the hot gas system, but the larger size did.   That's why I mentioned a  defrost timer.

 

[Ultramatic]

 

 

What a shame Eugene. I wouldn't even know where to start to look for one.

 

[epixstar128]

The later models of this size went to electric. Heating defrost i belive after 65 or 66. The units with exposed coils just scream hot gas defrost by design. My guess whould be exposed coils=hot gas defrost

 

[combo52]

1964 GE Bottom Freezer Frost Guard Refrigerator

Hi Louie, love the new refrigerator hopefully it will work out well with the Coloric range.

Questions and answers

This GE Ref has hot gas defrost, the later 30 1/2 " models without the coils in the top of the refrigerator section had resistance electric defrost. All GE 34" wide bottom freezer refs had HGD with a single evaporator in the back of the freezer, these had two evaporator fans and two thermostats [ one in each section to control temperatures ]

This ref has a timer to initiate a defrost cycle after 12 hours of compressor running time has accumulated. It does not cool a little colder before going into a defrost cycle.

This ref has two evaporators, the Freon travels through the freezers E first then through the E in the top of the fresh food section. On this type refrigerator the frost melts off the FF E every time the compressor shuts off and to keep frost from accumulating on the ends of the FF E there is a little electric heater on both sides of the FF E, these little heaters are ON whenever the compressor is off, this is why when you turn off the cold control the FF E actually gets warm.

The advantage of this type of refrigeration system is no taste or odor transfer from ref to freezer sections. The main disadvantage is there is no separate temperature control for each section.

Even though GE used there own compressor on these HGD refrigerators you can install a normal compressor if it fails. I have a 1960 GE Frost Guard up-right freezer that had a bad compressor when I found it almost 30 years ago, my brother Jeff installed a regular compressor in it and it works perfectly to this day.

These were good performing refs if everything was working correctly, but dual evaporator refs were prone to more temperature issue problems. A ref like this will easily use 3-4 times as much power as a new ref of equal capacity, and other than not transferring ref odors into the ice in the freezer does not keep food any longer than a new refrigerator, Louie I would keep your little chest freezer for foods that you want to keep in the freezer long term.

Enjoy your new classic, John L.

 

[washer111]

The defrost system you mention John was common on Kelvinator "Cyclic" models here in Australia for many years - except the freezer was typically manual defrost. 

 

When the fridge cycled off, very small heaters assisted defrost on the "U" coil in FF section (It followed the left, rear and right hand walls), into a little gutter, then onto the compressor to be evaporated. 

 

These fridges without the frost-free, even with thirstier compressors, are very quiet, even older models still running and probably use very little electricity for their age. 

Its a shame that models like this were discontinued; Manual defrost freezers are much better for food, and save so much energy - and I consider it quite wasteful to have a electric "frost-free" refrigerator compartment, like in our large refrigerator-only model, which defrosts every six hours (Fan-on + a 300w heater). 

 

[Ultramatic]

 

 

Hey thanks John! I'm very happy with it, and can't wait to see it together with the Caloric and the Maytag!

 

[rp2813]

John, thanks for explaining both systems and their pros & cons.

 

[lorainfurniture]

Defrost timer?

John, is that what that "probe" thing that is located in the top of the freezer compartment? I thought that to be a sensor of sorts, but I can easily See how it could be a temperature activated defrost timer.

 

[combo52]

1964 GE Bottom Freezer Frost Guard Refrigerator

The orignal defrost timers on GE FF freezers was a timer combined with a capillary sensor bulb, the sensor halted the defrost hot gas valve operation when the bulb was warmed to a temperature well above freezing, somewhere in the 45F-55F degree range, it varied by model etc. Toward the end of GE hot gas defrost refrigerators they simplified the system by just using a 12 hour, 10 minute defrost timer, this seemed to work very well as HGD refrigerators defrosted very quickly. These capillary defrost timers have been NLA for many many years so if it fails we just use a 12 Hr 10 Min timer as a replacement.

I have never figured why new refrigerators do not use HGD with the quest for energy efficiency today, not only does using the compressor use far less power than a resistance defrost heater, 150 watts for a compressor vs 300-500 watts for a defrost heater, and the HGD method puts the heat exactly where needed [ the frozen evaporator tubing ] so the air around the evaporator and the freezer itself warn up less, AND HGD is much faster since again the heat is applied exactly where the frost has formed.

I have asked many people who work with design and building home refrigeration appliances and have never gotten a answer, if anyone out there has a good reason why they don't use HGD any longer I would love to hear it.

John L.

 

[Ultramatic]

And a week before Christmas...

 

 

The G.E. stopped cooling.

 

 

[Ultramatic]

 

 

I'm not sure if it's the condenser fan, thermostat, defrost timer...I turned it off, to let it defrost. I do need to remove the freezer basket to gain access to the fan.

 

[Ultramatic]

Update:

 

 

 

The heater kicked in, the frost is beginning to melt.

 

[rp2813]

Yeah Louie, that looks more to me like it didn't know when to quit cooling! 

 

The serpentine coil on mine was growing a thick layer of frost a while back and it was due to the cold control having gone bad.  Not the same defrost system as yours (no heater involved) but the coil had built up much more frost than usual, and the fridge wouldn't stop running.

 

At least the frost on yours formed an even layer.  If it was all on one section of the coil, that would be bad news.

 

Keep us posted!

 

[Ultramatic]

 

 

Well, turned it back on. Compressor kicked in, evaporator fan in freezer section did not. So I suppose it's the fan.

[this post was last edited: 12/19/2016-04:38]

 

[rp2813]

You mean the evaporator fan inside the freezer, right?  The condenser fan would be under (outside) the freezer way in back -- it blows warm air over the condensate pan and out the front of the grille.  If the condenser fan stopped working, the fridge -- and freezer section in particular -- would have trouble cooling down to the set temperature.  Ice cream firmness is a good indicator.

 

And if the freezer has a door (drawer) switch, did you push it to see if the fan would run?  On some early frost free systems, they used such a switch so the freezer's evaporator fan would cut out as soon as the door/drawer was opened.

 

Either way, I hope you can find an exact replacement or one that won't require major modifications.

 

[Ultramatic]

 

 

Yes, my mistake, the evaporator fan isn't running. The evaporator fan would run, regardless on whether the freezer door was open or closed. Come to think of it, I don't feel the condenser fan running either. The coils are cold in the refrigerator section now. Just barely some frost on them, the few things I left inside are cold. 

 

[combo52]

Hi Louie, What quit cooling? the ref or freezer section?Was the evaporator in the back of the freezer section also badly frosted over?

 

If the freezer section fan is not running when the compressor is running in cooling mode the door operated fan switch may be bad, test this first and it is OK to bypass if no replacement sw is readily available.

 

The condenser under ref should be running whenever the compressor is running except it may not run when compressor is in Hot-Gas-Defrost mode, the early models the CF did not run in defrost later they did.

 

With all the frost you had in the ref section the food should have been pretty cold and even freezing some. If the food was freezing [ in the ref section ] you may have a bad cold control, unfortunately if not you have a weak compressor, was the compressor ever changed on this ref? If not you have a serious problem on your hands.