I certainly hope you didn't drive by and not stop in!!!
New Dishwasher
- Thread starter countryguy
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PeteK,
Where are you located? We drove to Chicago via Sarnia.
Gary
Where are you located? We drove to Chicago via Sarnia.
Gary
I'm in Sarnia, the bridge is about 7 blocks away darnit
Yikes, I couldn't have gotten any closer! Next time!
If you want quiet... Miele
Gary,
Many dishwashers out there do a fine job of cleaning dishes. And we all choose our appliances based upon a number of personal factors. That being said a couple of "soft" factors have me sold on Miele.
First... you can't hear it running with a mimimum of background noise. I tend to entertain with dinner parties. After I am finished with food preparation and the drinks/appetizer course, there are generally enough dishes to fill the machine. (Alas, I do not have a two dishwasher kitchen!) It's great to be able to wash the first load while the rest of dinner unfolds over the evening. More than once a guest has opened the machine and been very surprised to discover that it is running. It's that quiet.
Second... I like the silverware rack. If frees up more space for dirty things on the lower rack. Once you grow accustomed to loading it, you will spend hardly any more time loading it than the normal basket style rack. And nesting of utensils is never an issue with this style rack. Now here's the nice thing... If you load utensils of a given type in one area of the rack (e.g. forks in one area, knives in another, tablespoons, in another, etc.), you don't have to sort while unloading, so unloading takes seconds.
I don't think you'll go wrong with any of the other recommendations above, but I have owned Kenmore, KitchenAid, Maytag, and Miele. All other factors being equal I would choose Miele again.
Good luck and happy shopping!
John.
Gary,
Many dishwashers out there do a fine job of cleaning dishes. And we all choose our appliances based upon a number of personal factors. That being said a couple of "soft" factors have me sold on Miele.
First... you can't hear it running with a mimimum of background noise. I tend to entertain with dinner parties. After I am finished with food preparation and the drinks/appetizer course, there are generally enough dishes to fill the machine. (Alas, I do not have a two dishwasher kitchen!) It's great to be able to wash the first load while the rest of dinner unfolds over the evening. More than once a guest has opened the machine and been very surprised to discover that it is running. It's that quiet.
Second... I like the silverware rack. If frees up more space for dirty things on the lower rack. Once you grow accustomed to loading it, you will spend hardly any more time loading it than the normal basket style rack. And nesting of utensils is never an issue with this style rack. Now here's the nice thing... If you load utensils of a given type in one area of the rack (e.g. forks in one area, knives in another, tablespoons, in another, etc.), you don't have to sort while unloading, so unloading takes seconds.
I don't think you'll go wrong with any of the other recommendations above, but I have owned Kenmore, KitchenAid, Maytag, and Miele. All other factors being equal I would choose Miele again.
Good luck and happy shopping!
John.
Thanks for your comments John! The Miele sounds like it would be a perfect fit. Now to find one at a reasonable price here in Canada.
Gary
Gary
How much are they selling for up around you Gary.. I can always check in the little store up the street from me, his prices might be better. He has a couple of Mieles currently but I can't remember the models or prices,, something like $1100 and ?
Pete,
Yes that is how much they are up here and higher! For now, the Miele will have to be put on hold - too many other expenses at the moment - just had to have the roof re-shingled, new soffit/fascia, etc.
Gary
Yes that is how much they are up here and higher! For now, the Miele will have to be put on hold - too many other expenses at the moment - just had to have the roof re-shingled, new soffit/fascia, etc.
Gary
WP disappointment
The other night I was browsing "Portable Dishwashers" on ebay and saw a couple of standard tub WP portables. They were in the DU9---- series. When I got into the owners' manual, I was disappointed to find that the Pots and Pans cycle is the only cycle that gives two rinses after the wash. The rest have that wretched "Purge" between the wash drain and the rinse fill like my 21 and 22 series Superbas had.
The other night I was browsing "Portable Dishwashers" on ebay and saw a couple of standard tub WP portables. They were in the DU9---- series. When I got into the owners' manual, I was disappointed to find that the Pots and Pans cycle is the only cycle that gives two rinses after the wash. The rest have that wretched "Purge" between the wash drain and the rinse fill like my 21 and 22 series Superbas had.
A few seconds of fill, an increment of recirculation to flush the pump and filter system, then drain. No water actually sprays on the dishes.
Well I am going to correct your description due to real experience. There is a purge between main wash & final rinse on my New Kenmo Elite. A regular fill is 1:40. The purge fill is 50 seconds. The pump circulation is 15 to 20 seconds. Leslie has told me frankly, contrary to all of y'all popular belief, the dish load is being sprayed and rinsed during those 20 seconds. And that is enough time for spray arms to revolve 3 or 4 times.
And, to be quite frank,... I have had no complaints at all about rinsing performance. And I have a very sensitive nose to deterrgent smells.
Yeah,like about a quart of water. I used to stand in front of those machines with 3 quarts of very hot water and added that as soon as the Purge fill stopped. It gave enough circulation to at least wash some of the detergent off the load before the only rinse. Fortunately, the pump out was long enough to handle it. It is no wonder that those machines had the vinyl degrade on the side bars at the top of the upper rack so that the steel underneath started rusting in a few years, less than 5 in some cases. I saw a lot of them tossed out at that age and the only thing obviously wrong was the rust and the price of a replacement rack. Maybe the customer was also fed up with the poor performance of what, at one time, had been one of the best made dishwashers on the market. The 21 also had a board that cost almost as much as a new dishwasher and there was no warrenty coverage unless lighting had caused damage that insurance would cover. Friends in Florida bought a new TOL WP with just a little more than it would cost to replace the board after lightning struck a tree in their yard.
My KUDS22 (which has now gone to live with my sister) does a 15 second (I think) fill, circulates for remainder of the 1.5 min increment. That's enough water to dribble from the wash arm, but it does not spray on the dishes nor does the arm rotate. It fills a little more (5 to 7 seconds) when the timer increments to drain. I never found performance objectionable, but then I never tried running an extra rinse for comparison. The upper rack does suffer vinyl separation/rusting as Tom describes, but it did go more than 5 years before that started. Or maybe I didn't notice it until later.
Tom, I've always remembered you doing that with my dishwasher's cousin. Well heck fire, since my sensor loads always trigger 140 degree wash temp because they're so much dirt, I might as well try Pots'n'Pans cycle because that does have 2 post-wash rinses assured.
stevet
Well-known member
TO PURGE OR NOT TO PURGE!
I am amzazed at the interest so many of you have with the purges.. Yes I do admit to the same interest but here is how I got around the problem:
I have had a few KitchenAids which had the purge during the cycles and during the rinses. I thought it was stupid to barely fill the machine and had often watched it fill with the door open and it would barely spit water at me, but it did seem to do a good job of washing out the fine mesh screen in the washarm support on my 21 series and 22 series machines.
I come from a history of a KDS15 as our first dishwasher and have always wanted a machine with 3 after rinses like that one.
For that reason, I still use a KDS18 machine to this day and even took it down to Florida with us when we moved to replace the GE Profile unit in the new house which I did immediately after the machine arrived on the moving van. Just for the record, I did leave the people who bought our house a fully rebuilt KDS22 series machine so they still got a good machine.
You may use more water, but you may not have to wash the dishes twice on some of these really water miserly units! But here is what I did to get rid of the purge and make it an effective washing tool:
What I did was I removed the flow restrictor in the fill valve and that made sure the tank filled up completely whenever it called for water. The float switch would stop the valve from overfilling and you got alot more washing action between the wash segments as well as the rinse segments and with that much water and even a minute or less of pump circulation, you removed that much more detergent and food waste.
As an added bonus, this extra amount of fill also made sure that there would be hot water available for the next segment. For those of you who's machines are far from the hot water tank or plumbing runs under your slab, you know how quickly the hot water can cool off between cycle segments.
I would suggest you throttle down the supply valve to the machine if you can just to err on the side of caution for those people who have very high water pressure.
I have a WP DU950 in my garage as my overflow machine at this time and am somewhat inpressed by it for washing and sensing the soil in the water. But the purge on that one is ridiculous. I am going to do the job on the valve in a few minutes just to see the difference. I will report back on the results.
I am amzazed at the interest so many of you have with the purges.. Yes I do admit to the same interest but here is how I got around the problem:
I have had a few KitchenAids which had the purge during the cycles and during the rinses. I thought it was stupid to barely fill the machine and had often watched it fill with the door open and it would barely spit water at me, but it did seem to do a good job of washing out the fine mesh screen in the washarm support on my 21 series and 22 series machines.
I come from a history of a KDS15 as our first dishwasher and have always wanted a machine with 3 after rinses like that one.
For that reason, I still use a KDS18 machine to this day and even took it down to Florida with us when we moved to replace the GE Profile unit in the new house which I did immediately after the machine arrived on the moving van. Just for the record, I did leave the people who bought our house a fully rebuilt KDS22 series machine so they still got a good machine.
You may use more water, but you may not have to wash the dishes twice on some of these really water miserly units! But here is what I did to get rid of the purge and make it an effective washing tool:
What I did was I removed the flow restrictor in the fill valve and that made sure the tank filled up completely whenever it called for water. The float switch would stop the valve from overfilling and you got alot more washing action between the wash segments as well as the rinse segments and with that much water and even a minute or less of pump circulation, you removed that much more detergent and food waste.
As an added bonus, this extra amount of fill also made sure that there would be hot water available for the next segment. For those of you who's machines are far from the hot water tank or plumbing runs under your slab, you know how quickly the hot water can cool off between cycle segments.
I would suggest you throttle down the supply valve to the machine if you can just to err on the side of caution for those people who have very high water pressure.
I have a WP DU950 in my garage as my overflow machine at this time and am somewhat inpressed by it for washing and sensing the soil in the water. But the purge on that one is ridiculous. I am going to do the job on the valve in a few minutes just to see the difference. I will report back on the results.
Tom........
-It gave enough circulation to at least wash some of the detergent off the load before the only rinse. Fortunately, the pump out was long enough to handle it. It is no wonder that those machines had the vinyl degrade on the side bars at the top of the upper rack so that the steel underneath started rusting in a few years, less than 5 in some cases.
So are you saying that the detergent ate away the plastic on the rack? This is the problem that I am having with my KUDS22 upper rack.
-It gave enough circulation to at least wash some of the detergent off the load before the only rinse. Fortunately, the pump out was long enough to handle it. It is no wonder that those machines had the vinyl degrade on the side bars at the top of the upper rack so that the steel underneath started rusting in a few years, less than 5 in some cases.
So are you saying that the detergent ate away the plastic on the rack? This is the problem that I am having with my KUDS22 upper rack.
I have a Kitchen Aid Superba which I bought 3 years ago. I purchased it because it looked well built, and I thought the performance would be superior to others, especially due to the high price I had to pay for it/ No matter how the machine is loaded, no matter what 'special' directions I follow, the dishes do NOT come clean. I have soft water, high temperature on my water, have had service twice, they couldn't find anything wrong. I have been told that because it is a newer mode that uses less water, it's cleaning power has been compromised. It also has very LONG wash cycles. It is by far the worst dishwasher I have ever owned. I would not recommend Kitchen Aid to anyone after my experience with it.
