New Tide Compact Powder

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Long story short, Tide specifically states on their site that powders are better for removing ground in soil such as dirt and mud, and liquid is better for removing greasy, oil based stains.

Its true, both powders and liquids can equally have their drawbacks, but it all depends on factors such as fabric type, water temp.. etc.

I've also had people tell me that its just a matter of personal preference and that they both equally do a good job of getting the job done.
In the end, I guess its good to have both liquid and powder on hand, and have the best of both worlds.
 
For me:

100% powder 100% of the time. I've been very pleased with the performance of powdered detergent over the years and the cost savings compared to liquid is substantial. Also, it's easy to recycle or reuse the box (near-dryer lint trash box) but the liquid bottles often aren't accepted in recycling programs. Plus, the liquid bottles and dispensers tend to become a gooey, sticky mess.

I'm curious to see how the new detergent formulations stack up. I hope the rinse out better,
Dave
 
Hate the liquids. The mess potential, and dosing difficulties especially at different temperatures, gunking potential etc. But they can do a better job with less fabric wear, shorter cycles, and less energy on certain stains.

Tide Free HE Coldwater liquid is just awesome at most stains. Even the pro line Tide (non bleach) powder can't beat it for dried in blood that has sat and hardened. There's at least one laundromat owner who uses it as a cleaner for the boot and doors for his front loaders. Sunlight Deep Clean Coldwater is the best dog dander remover I have ever used.

I'd love better powders and am trying to find some OK source for UK Persil Biological powder to test. Right now though the liquids are among the best in my arsenal.
 
Thought I'd throw this out, I guess it also depends on what type of washer you have. From what I'm hearing, the liquids tend to gunk up inside the front loaders. I couldn't relate, since Ive never owned a front loader. Using my top loader it seems to handle both powder and liquid well.
 
@Volvoguy

Because of our hard water, I use a 1/4 cup of Borax per load in my FL. I recycle the boxes as next-to-the-dryer lint containers. By the time the Borax box in current use has been emptied, the previous Borax box is full of lint and ready to be tossed.
 
@pinpoint22

Agree. The drawers of most FLs passively dispense the detergent by gravity into the outer drum when the drawer is closed (i.e. release is passive....I'm referring to main wash here rather than pre-wash). When the wash cycle starts, water is pumped through the drawer to wash the detergent down into the drum. With a powder, most of the stuff stays in the drawer until the cycle starts, though some of it goes down to the drum by gravity when drawer is closed. But since it's mostly dry inside, the powder doesn't have much chance to cake up and form a clog.

With liquids, there is a potential to form a gooey mess not only in the dispenser but also in the tubing between drawer and drum. In particular, if one uses a delay wash feature and liquid detergent, one is allowing sticky liquid detergent to sit in the drawer and slide down toward the drum without any water to rinse it down. It's like asking for trouble. When visiting in Europe, I've noticed either they use a powder, or a liquid with a dispenser ball (placed on top of the clothing, does not touch clothing or washer parts until cycle begins). I use my washer's delay wash feature quite frequently (e.g. set up a load at 21:00 to run at 5:00 so it's ready for the dryer while I'm up and fixing breakfast the next morning). If I used a concentrated HE liquid, that stuff would be all over the drawer and tubing to the drum for 8 hours, forming a gooey mess.

The fact that some liquid manufacturers in Europe even supply dispenser balls (for free) with their product is almost an admission that residue is an issue when used in FLs. We don't have dispenser balls in the US, but I used to use liquid HE and would add it to one of the small plastic measuring cups (that came with spigot-style liquid bottles) and place the cup on top of the clothes. I have never used the dispenser except for powders, and have used only powders for the last two years or so.
 
Speaking of Powders:

I see that the new compact powders are entering the race, does this mean from what little I read that the new Cheer compact powder is HE compatible or is it in the make? Does anybody have any info on these new compact powders? I believe the product had to be marked HE in order to use in the Fl machine, so I'm wondering if Cheer has gone HE in powder form? Should be interesting to see what P&G will do with their powdered detergents in this format? :)
 
CHEER HE COMPACT POWDER FRESH CLEAN SCENT

I purchased a box of Cheer HE powder in FRESH CLEAN SCENT, this past Saturday at my local SAMS Club. I have not tried it.
 
as for Ultra's and smaller doses of original formulas.....

does anyone remember when Era first came out, and was a 1/4 cup per use....we used to have the big bottle with the pump that dispensed 1/4 cup with just 2 squirts....I prefer something like this rather than a cap with lines inside of it....

and your mileage may differ from machine to machine.....HE formulas weren't common when I got my first Neptunes, but I used to get the big 200 ounce TIDE liquid, and used a full cap per load, and never had an issue with oversudsing....most other detergents I had to cut the dose in half, mainly powders, until I discovered Sears Ultra Plus.......when I had a Frigidaire TallTumbler, Pathmark used to have a store brand controlled suds detergent in a five gallon bucket, which was great for FL's, but was discontinued around the time when the Neptunes came out....
 
Laundry Detergent Liquids UK/Europe Dispener Drawers

One must also take into account the good number of washing machines that still are cold fill, and or consumers use them that way. Since "cold" tap water can vary in temperature depending where one is, and the season, there is a very good chance when frigid water meets the liquid detergent it will not shift totally or at all.

Another factor would be the pressure of water as it comes from the taps. Am not sure what it does, but feel the water pressure is stronger when my Miele (W1070) is set to a temperature, versus "tap cold" (ie, no temp chosen). Me thinks it opens both incoming (hot and cold) water valves which in theory should create stroner force into the dispenser than strictly tap cold alone.

Either way, one or more of the above can lead to residue build up of liquid detergents over time. Especially if the drawer is not removed and cleaned, along with the housing compartment.

For liquid detergents my older model Miele comes with a tray one inserts into the main wash compartment for holding the stuff. Long as one does not fill over the max, whatever liquid one places in there isn't going anywhere until the proper cycle. According to the owner's manual, one only uses the insert if you are using the pre-wash. This holds the liquid detergent until the main wash cycle. OTHO if one is simply using a liquid detergent for the main wash, the manual states to simply place the desired amount into the drawer without the tray.

The dispenser drawers on this Miele have little flaps at the end on at least the main wash side. This holds back much of what is put in there, liquid or powder until the force of incoming water pushes it out and down.
 
Tide Compact Powder

Newest addition to my stash just arrived. An older box of Tide "Ultra" (see pic above), and as one suspected, P&G has been playing fast and loose over the years.

Directions for dosage on back of the box clearly state one should use less for "low water and front loading washing machines".

Curious thing, the stuff is "Made in Canada", not one of P&G's United States plants.
 
new tide

While shopping at Sam's Club yesterday, I noticed the "new" Tide boxes. Upon closer look, the original non-bleach powder still suggested using HE formula if you have a front loader, but the original with bleach says it is compatible with both....wonder if the "new original" is low foam? doesn't sound like it, since the box has the HE suggestion on it....does anyone know?
 
Well I remember years ago back in the mid 90's Tide w/Bleach powder was touted to be able to be used in a front load washer. At the time I had my Amana's and never tried to see if that was right. Could be that as more people get HE machines that we will see more detergents that are compatible in both. I do like this new Tide.
On thing I wish was that Wisk Power Scoop would make a comeback. I loved that stuff and it had a great scent.
 
Some Several Years Ago

P&G began swapping out foam creating agents in some versions of Tide powder for surpression agents. You can go to P&G's "Tide" website for listing of ingredients by product.

Do know that one of the powders, I *think* it may be TwB contains suds suppression chemicals (not the HE version), according to the list on website.

P&G does not produce several totally different versions of Tide powders. Rather all are based on the same master formula, with perhaps a tad more foam supression agents added to the "HE" version. I say this because MSDS for all versions of Tide list the whole product line.

Obviously Tide free powder does not contain "scents" or "dyes", but not sure if all versions contain oxygen bleach or not to some extent. Low levels of sodium perborate are used for "colour protection" in that the hydrogen peroxide will counter the chlorine found in most tap water in the United States. My vintage box of Tide list this, and Cheer powders did or still do for all one knows.

Early versions of Tide "HE", both liquid and powder were very highly sudsing if not dosed correctly. Even when they were the stuff still could create lots of froth and or was hard to rinse clean. This is why one always thought such products were not built from the ground up as true "HE" products. However the latest incarnation of Tide "Free and Gentle" liquid is very low foaming and rinses cleanly.

Methinks P&G may see the handwriting on the wall and may be going back to the way detergents were once sold in the United States. Compatiable with *all* types of washing machines, and dosage based upon amount of water used for the wash.

This would make more and more sense as heavy water use top loading washers are being replaced with "HE" and or other versions that are stingy with water.

There really isn't any need today for the fillers and heavy sudsing agents P&G used with some versions of detergents.
 
@passatdoc

I agree, I also remember when I was in Europe 2 years ago, the European Market for liquid detergent is very small. It seems as if over 95% of the detergents are powders, and all for a very good reason just as you mentioned; the overall messes using liquid.
That definitely explains the detergent balls that come along with the liquids. But you know what? I think one of the main reasons why people are having issues with Mold and Mildew with their front loaders here in the US, is because of the liquids, and the fact that people here are dispensing them in the detergent drawer, rather than in a little ball, and placing it in the drum like the Europeans do. Basically, the water is not thoroughly washing the liquids down the drum, at the start of the cycle causing residue, thus causing that residue to turn into mold and mildew over time. Just simply my theory..
 
Liquid is actually pretty popular here especially with the advent of super concentrated formats, as well as liquitabs.  Some are dosed in drawer, e.g. Persil/Surf, whilst P&G offer dosing devices in which the liquid (in a squeezy bottle not unlike ketchup) is squirted into and placed in the drum - practically leaving no mess.  We also have pre-measured liquitab formats too where a sachet of liquid is placed in the drum - again no mess.

 

However, we also have a somewhat new problem with liquids here in that continued exclusive use can lead to mouldy & musty washers, along with using a combination of using only low temp washers and shutting the door - both things the average consumer will do nowadays.  Liquid detergents don't contain bleach, where powders here do, and hence are theoretically supposed to keep the insides of the machine cleaner.

 

I would say though that mouldy washer syndrome is often linked to the user rather than the detergents; you can still get a mouldy washer from somebody who uses powder 100% of the time with low temp washes and closes the door between uses, and a thoroughly clean washer from somebody who prefers to use liquid but regularly uses high temp washes, keeps the door open, cleans the dispenser regularly etc etc.

 

Jon

[this post was last edited: 2/16/2011-10:53]

lavamat_jon++2-16-2011-10-53-9.jpg
 
@pinpoint22 and lavamatjohn

Surveying the shelves of Swedish supermarkets, it seems to be 50-50 split between powders and liquids. My friend in Stockholm seems to prefer 2X liquids, probably for being easier to tote home from the market, but they never use the dispenser drawer for liquids, they know better.

For bringing it home on the plane, powders are safer (duh) and no liquid would be allowed on board in cabin luggage. Even in checked luggage, if a box of powder breaks it's a mess, but not as bad as a leaking bottle. I encase any detergent boxes in a gallon-size (3.8 liters) zip-lock bag for safety. For my upcoming stay in London this spring, I will probably buy some UK Persil and bring it in my cabin bag, since luggage is now limited to one checked piece in Economy up to 23 kgs/50 lbs. Overweight (between 50-70 lbs/23-32 kgs) bags are charged an extra $60 (although if you use this charge to cart back an additional 20 lbs/8 kgs of purchases, you can also look at it another way: you could never ship the goods on a same-day basis from UK to California for $60, so maybe best to pony up). On this particular trip, I upgraded to Business eastbound (three bags allowed) but return in Economy (one bag allowed). BA allows the same luggage allowance on the return, even if the return is in a lower class cabin (i.e. Business outbound and Economy return gets two bags in both directions). But as far as I know, American Airlines does not extend this courtesy to returning Economy passengers.

I agree with both of you re: moldy washers. My FL is in my garage (never freezes here). In a summer heat wave, the temperature inside the garage can exceed 90 F/32 C, but I have never had mold issues in this five year old machine. Basically, the door is NEVER closed unless the machine is in use. I didn't learn this from a manual. I learned it from 30+ years of observing what friends in Europe (and their parents) did---doors were always ajar. I also wipe the gasket dry after the last cycle of the day. I suspect that issues with washer mold in the USA are the result of inexperienced buyers---most of the time, it's their first FL---keeping the door shut instead of ajar, and not keeping the gasket dry. I think the user manual mentions wiping the gasket dry, but no mention of leaving door ajar.

 

I suppose someone using only liquids and cold water could have mold issues too, but most US FLs have onboard heaters and the buyers often make use of Hot or Sanitize cycles. But these hot cycles won't prevent mold in a washer not allowed to dry out by keeping the door ajar. I believe a majority of washers now sold in US are FL, but there are so many older TLs still in use that the majority of washers in US homes are still TLs. It will take another decade or so of predominantly-FL sales before FLs become the majority. At the same time, most FL owners are currently on their <span style="text-decoration: underline;">first </span>FL, and as such as still making mistakes with respect to proper care of the machine. Moreover, most ads show the machines with the doors closed (often in a room off the kitchen, with designer built in cabinets, etc.) so buyers assume they can shut the doors (to make it look better) just as in the advertisements. Also, buyers with small children may have to keep the doors closed/locked. The ideal setting for a FL in a home with small children would be an enclosed laundry room with a locking door, so that the FL door can be left ajar with the room door secured. However, if the laundry area is in a garage or pantry area off the kitchen (or in a mud room without a locking interior door, etc.) then it's more difficult to leave the door ajar.
 
@passatdoc

Yep, Europeans definitely know their Front Loaders pretty well. If you ask me, I don't think the Top loaders will truly go out of style here in my opinion; at least not any time soon.. The reason is, many people are still just finding out about Front Loaders. That, and the fact that Top Loaders are still being made today, which people are buying because they are cheaper, cheaper to repair, and that they finish a load of laundry much quicker in general.

But definitely, I agree with you on the Mold & Mildew issue, many people here using the Front Loaders really are inexperienced as far as wiping down the gasket after the last wash, improper dosing of detergent, using Standard TL detergent instead of HE... Inexperienced users will learn.. In the meanwhile, a class on: "Laundry 101 the HE Way" wouldn't be such a bad idea after all.
 
If ever there was an environment that would promote the growth of mold in a washer, it would be in my garage, which faces south in Southern California. We used to have a huge coral tree (South Africa) which provided shade protection to the garage, but its roots were lifting the pavement and sadly it had to be removed (it was a poor choice for the space in which it was planted, and it had been installed by the developer). The replacement tree is not as large (or old) and so the garage get heat up past 90 F in late summer. No mold problems whatsoever in the washer, but I never close the door unless it's in use. I also remove the drawer dispenser, invert it to drain leftover water, and remove the top lid, allowing all of them to air dry. Formerly, I didn't remove the lid of the dispenser, but one day found black slime on the inside surface, so now at the end of the wash day, the dispenser is dissembled and placed over a small waste bin to air dry. The slime never returned and no mold in the washer. I clean it once per quarter using a hot cycle plus ½ dose of detergent, followed by a hot cycle with 1/3 cup citric acid. Never any bleach.
 
Ultra Gain with Bleach

Finally got some more variety at work. We got in Gain Original and Gain with Bleach Alternative. Bought the Gain with Bleach Alternative 80 load (100 oz concentrate).
 
Ultra Compact Powders

we need more ultra compact powders in the UK, they disappeared in the late 90s with Ariel Futur, Tablets seemed more convienient but they use alot of packaging still compared to a compact one scoop powder.

130ml seems too much, if this dosage was reduced to 70ml per wash. with a small scoop per wash, would be better.
 
Thanks for the pics Jt1985. How is everybody's overall experience with Gain? I think its a detergent with too overwhelming of a scent (for me at least..) I've used the liquid before once and remembered that it also left clothes (towels especially) with a terrible waxy sort of a residue when they came out of the washer.. I tried the powder, but don't remember too much about it.. but have never tried this Bleach Alternative powder pictured here. I could never find it except in liquid form. How does it size up to Tide cleaning wise?
 
Gain HE powder

Works as well as Tide HE. Light fragrance, not bothersome. Hard to find locally in stores, but easy to find at Amazon or soap.com. The former (Amazon) requires you buy in bulk, either a four pack of the medium size or a two pack of the large size. It's my "daily driver" detergent. I save imported UK or Henkel Persil (or national Unilever equivalents in other countries, e.g. Via in Sweden = UK Persil) for my work clothing (98% of which are all cotton wrinkle free shirts and trousers from LL Bean), which I want to treat as gently and thoroughly as possible. Sturdy cottons, linens, and towels get Gain HE or Tide HE powder.


I know that Gain is P&G's product in "ethnic" markets in the USA where (per P&G) the customers like their detergent to have a heavy/fruity fragrance. Look at Gain's US website http://www.ilovegain.com/fresh_smelling_laundry_collections.do and the emphasis is on fragrance. Perhaps marketing to a Latino clientele, I'm not sure. Be that as it may, Gain HE powder's fragrance is toned down. The HE tab http://www.ilovegain.com/high_efficiency_detergent.do is almost an afterthought on the website, and HE powder is offered only in "original" and "Island Fresh" versions. The only variety I've ever seen in stores or for sale on the net is Original.
 
See that's the thing, Gain is way too overly scented to the point of giving you a headache. But yet than again, their entire marketing is geared to those that like a detergent that has a heavier scent. To me, I'm more worried about how well that detergent will wash my clothes rather than having a nauseating smell.
I have a top loader, so I'm not sure about the HE version, especially since you said the fragrance is toned down a little. From wbut whats even more crazy is the new compact powdered formula. They advertise the "Fresh Lock" which is basically an overkill of more fragrance added.
 

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