Out of the Closet.....No Not yet

[panthera]

you can say that again, Travis

I acknowledge the reality of bi-sexuality, but gosh - how can you marry someone knowing that you want relationships with people of your own sex? What a terrible thing to do to a woman.
I'm gonna stop posting right now, this election has every nerve in my body stretched to the breaking point.
Let's hope for the best!

 

[toggleswitch2]

You are what you eat, dear.

~Bi-sexuality probably does happen, but not at the frequency that CL personals or public parks may lead you to believe.

True bisexualty means that one has no preference and dips his wick and quill into various ink-pots. Most people have a preference, be it ever so slight, or one that changes from one side of the fence to the other, cyclically.

Let us also not mistake narcissists for bisexuals. Narcissists tend to boff/shag anyone who admires them or pays attention to them.

Bisexual acting is another story and probably closest to the reality of the human sexual nature.

I kinda liked the way the Ancient Greeks worked their sexuality before Judeo/Christianity screwed them all up.
Before your beard you were the student (Read: bottom) and after it the teacher (Read: top). You had your wife for family and procreation and your "FILOS" (friend) to help you relieve tension. Everyone was keen to it and it was expected.

As we all know, a varied Mediterranean diet has been proven to be healthiest.

 

[revvinkevin]

Mothers always know.....

Shifting back to coming out, "they" say that mothers always know and I do believe that the majority of the time, that is true. Granted they may not want to admit it or confront their child about it, but they usually know.

The exception: unless they truly are living under a rock OR they are truly and completely oblivious.... but in this case the chances are that they DO know, but are just in total denial.

 

[toggleswitch2]

My mother confronted me and extracted a "confession". I was 16 y.o. She then proceded to say. "Why bother going to school, become a hairdresser like the rest of them".

She then gave me the silent treatment for a year. FEH! Talking is LOVE for Women, for men it is NOISE. It was a wonderful quiet, peaceful year. She got over trying to torture me, I however endured and continued to give HER the silent treatment. Who got hurt in that transaction? Hint: not me.

She insisted I go to therapy. I insited she come with me for a does of it as wll or no deal. "All I need to do is get out of here". She knew my talk is/was not idle threats and backed off a lttle bit. I was finally out of there at 19 and never looked back.

It may have taken me years to catch up to those who have it all handed to them on a silver platter, but I cherish everything I have and earned. No one GAVE me anything. In fact. I was thrown obstacles.

Coming out is an amazing sense of personal freedom. But one does pay a price for freedom.

I actually know someone whose dad gave him HELL about being homosexual. YEARS later he told his son he was bi/closet ("don't tell mom"). Tortured for nothing. *SIGH*

The lifetsyle ain't for sissies, you gotta have SOME wicked backbone and a hard-@$$.

 

[toggleswitch2]

~I insited she come with me for a does of it as wll or no deal.

I INSISTED she come with me for a DOSE of it as WELL, or 'no deal'.

 

[xyz]

a post to all here, I am a straight guy who is happily married. I have the right to say that multiple sex partners is immoral. It is immoral. I do not appreciate some here calling me and other Christians "bastard Christians", what do you have against us? You ask us to tolerate your lifestyle but it seems that you are the hypocrit with your namecalling of Christians. Is it guilt of the way you live that makes you feel justified in namecalling of decent folks? I have a guy who I used to be my friend but I cut him loose when he and his wife joined up in a swingers (group sex) club. I don't want trash like that in my house. Not even in my yard. Marriage is sacred and in no way includes multiple sex partners. That is called ADULTRY, which is one of the Ten Commandments. But is you are a Godless heathen, then why not go out and have your fun by having sex with any and all, be it male or female. What do you have to lose but your life, health and soul? The wages of sin is death. But if you are a heathen and do not know or care about the words of our Lord above, then you will ultimately face His judgement upon your actions. I'm not saying that you are going to hell in a handbasket, God will make sure of that. I don't have that authority. But as a Christian, I would like to see you in Heaven one of these days so we can reflect upon our days in our shops working on our machines. Don't beat me out of that one please. What is it with some of you here? You make it so very clear that Christians are terrible people when in fact you are the terrible person if we need to namecall. But I'm not getting into any namecalling here, God can take over on that one with his own method of justice upon immorality. A man sleeping with another man is spitting into the face of God. Read your bible and you shall see.

 

[jeffg]

Marty, the angst toward Christians (at least here on AW) is directed toward that segment of the religion which is trying to impose their belief system on everyone else, via the sponsorship and campaigning of *civil laws*. As long as this is the case, on issues ranging from marriage rights to reproductive rights for women, I'll continue to defend against their concerted attacks.

 

[toggleswitch2]

~I have the right to say that multiple sex partners is immoral.

You do. But there are other opinions.

It is techinally a sin to waste one's seed on anything but reproduction, so please send your right hand my best regards and a "Hello" because based upon what you have written, that is technically a second/multiple sex partner and you are in default of you own high moral standard, and as such are doomed to hell.

Everyone needs to love and be loved. There is an ethnic ditty/song that says "without love and pain no one lives" (I supposed getting both at the same time is the answer to life, but I digress).

For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction- Newtons'; laws of Thermodynamics. F--s are against SOME Christians because that institution is against F--s. Not too difficult to see. Perhaps we are also pointing out that only low-level Crhristians ("Christianists") and other religious-in-name-only people are haters. That is a HUMAN value not a divine one.

~God can take over on that one with his own method of justice upon immorality.

God is not vengeful, but the All-That-Is is simply love; past present and future. It is possible that the attitude that bad behavior is punished belongs with a 6 to 10 year old. But hey if it comforts you.....

A man sleeping with another man is spitting into the face of God. Read your bible and you shall see.

Unless God herself has told you this in person, it is a rather large stretch. if you claim to hear voices and God voice. Please get checked for paranoid schizoprenia first.

The Bible is to a large extent man-made and reflects the time and the place of its origin. Unless one is referign to the matric that is the Torah, I'd say there might be some room for interpretation.

Remember:

STHN APXH HTAN O LOGOS.

Translated as: "In the beginning there was the word ". It also EASILY mean: In charge was the authority". So unless one is fleutn in Hebrew, ARamiac and Biblica Greek, ti is best nto to say what the Bible says, becasue YOU & I DON'T (CLEARLY) KNOW.

And if your think a Protestant break-away faction of a Protestant break-away facton (to the tenth power) has any CLUE of the written and unwritten traditions of the faith, I hate to say you may be mistaken.

This message was composed in love, dignity, repsect and concern.

In my interpretation. religion and spirituality is not meant to limit one and narrow their thinking; it is to free one of bad thinking and human limiations.

As I have said before itis my understanding that G-d granted my life by giving me the option to take on the burden of homosexuality. (I was ddeathly ill as an infant). It does the universe a service by keeping Yin and Yang in balance. But that is antother story for another time.

People, open your heart and your mind (but not at both ends). Life is SO SHORT.

Let's not have this fight again.

 

[toggleswitch2]

Sorry. My proof-reading skills are weak, when at work!

 

[panthera]

Marty,

I wish you would take the time to read my posts more carefully.
The term "christianist" is a word used to describe these Evangelical Republicans and hate-filled, spiteful people who use the cover of Christianity for perpetrating their vicious hate-crimes.
I did not say "Christian".
We go through this regularly here, although the term is neither all that new nor, for pity's sake, was it invented or redefined by me.
The question of moral/immoral is a tough one. I am in a faithful, committed, true, monogamous relationship with the man I love. I hope to soon marry him in Europe. We offer each other mutual faith, love support and comfort. If you find that immoral, then there is no basis for our even trying to work together.
Sure, the bible has some things to say about homosexuality. Of course, the bible also explicitly allows polygamous marriage. Now, you can't cherry pick...and I find nothing in the scriptures to justify the fundamentalist position that only the New Testament counts...
Try reading some other parts of the book, I suggest this passage: I Corinthians 13:4-8
Now, I genuinely agree with you that multiple sex partners are not the key to happiness. FOR ME. I can not, nor do I see how you, can seek to impose your and my perspectives upon other people here. Sex with a consenting adult is not, per se, immoral. Sex with a child, forced sex, sex with someone outside of a closed relationship, sex with someone whom you know to be in a closed relationship, unprotected sex when you know or suspect you might be HIV positive...those are bad things to do. But the judgment of moral or immoral is reserved to God. I am justified in trying to protect my students against child molesters. I am not justified in personally collaring and beating the living shit out of every strange man who shows up at our school. See the difference?
Now, as a practical matter, gay men and women in California were just stripped of their human rights. The last group of people to write discrimination into their constitution, the last group of people to take away rights granted were the Nazis. Am I to assume you are in accord with them?

 

[travis]

Marty,

I'm sorry that you feel the Christians are being attacked. I think that if you reread what's been posted that you'll find that only the far right is being attacked, the same folks that are attacking us for being gay.

You can believe multiple partners is immoral. I don't go for that, but I realize that it's none of my business to bitch about it. I don't analyze my friends and reject them for having views that are different than mine.

I appreciate that you want me in heaven with you, but I really don't want to be there if all my other friends are somewhere else. I'm content that I'll be in the ground somewhere. I only hope that when I'm gone that more people liked me than hate me and that all my toys go to good homes and not the scrap guy.

 

[xyz]

Well I wasn't trying to open pandoras box with you guys. So come on here. The Bible does in fact say that homosexuality is an abomination unto God. Isn't that easy enough to understand? It is easy enough for me to understand. I don't twist my beliefs around to fit my lifestyle. I may be wrong but I really think that some of you here do just that to justify your immorality. I am not in any way judging who you sleep with or marry. You are your own person and have the sense to do what you please. God gave us humans the choice between doing right or doing wrong and He also gave us a rulebook explaining the rights and wrong that He holds us to. It is your own choice to listen to Him or not. I can't make you listen to Him. I also will not cram any of my beliefs down your throats, only will I express myself and my opinions much as you have on your posts here. If you find no wrong in homosexuality, then hey, go for it. Find out for yourself one of these days that it is wrong. I don't ever say that HIV & AIDS is a homo disease because it isn't. It is a social disease and most cases are spread by drug addicts and stupid ass people who don't practice safe sex no matter who that sex is being had with. I do love the fact that I am HIV negative and so is my wife and that I can sit in my living room with her and know that she and only she is my sex partner and our marriage has been condoned by GOD, not the freaking state government or federal government. And she and I can rest easy when we are away from each other that we aren't sharing our bodies with friends or strangers just because our hormones kick in at any given time and place. She respects me as I respect her and we would never dream of such garbage in our Holy union. If it is any consolation to any of you guys and gals here, my wife was raped at the age of nine, molested by her biological father at 15 and molested/raped at the age of 16 by one of his buddies. I protect my wife to the fullest and sometimes it is a giant job keeping her mind in order when she begins to obsess about her past. She is 34 now and still has nightmares about that day when she was nine and raped. I feel that what brought the two of us together was we both shared the same morals and I'm very passionate about morality. Maybe your definition of morality is much different than mine but that's you. As for as for me and mine, we will obey God's orders that He set forth in the Bible. Not orders set forth on the internet. All I have to say in closing is , go ahead and do as you may, I will not judge you, just remember that I will care for you no matter what lifestyle you choose. If my family judged me then I would be a drug addict out on the street if I were lucky enough to still be alive. Yes, they stood by me through serious drug addiction and alcoholism and I thank them for not judging me and turning their backs on me in my time of need. So please don't judge me for my beliefs just because I may disagree with you. Thanks for listening.

 

[jeffg]

> If it is any consolation to any of you guys and gals here, my wife was raped at the age of nine, molested by her biological father at 15 and molested/raped at the age of 16 by one of his buddies. <

Good grief. Why would this be "any consolation" to anyone?

Dear Jesus, protect me from your followers.

 

[xyz]

Jeff, I said that if it was any consolation to anyone was to maybe shed some light upon why I feel so passionate about immorality. I guess that until your family goes through such a crisis, then your stupid ass won't understand.

 

[xyz]

And if this here is any consolation, I didn't come to this site to argue with people who are here for that reason only. I come here to discuss and learn about my trade. If homosexuality is your main interest then I'm pretty damn sure the internet is full of sites for you to visit. Start with google and ye shall be directed to such directly.

 

[jeffg]

What's immoral about homosexuality? Keep pointing to your Bible, and like most other "christians", avoid answering that question honestly.

And in the meantime, keep your mythology out of our civil laws.

 

[panthera]

There is only one person

here who decides what may and may not be discussed on this site. The site's owner, Unimatic1140.
It is not up to anyone else to tell folks what they may or may not talk about here.
If you, xyz, don't like such threads, don't post on them.
You will no doubt find that we do share many common interests, but telling us what we shall or shall not do here is not appropriate.
I have had quite enough of christianists this week, thank you. Despite your best efforts, this is not Nazi Germany and lasvegasrox enjoys full human rights here.

 

[toggleswitch2]

XYZ- Marty is it?

I wanted to acknowledge your pain and your wife's. I wanted to acknowledge with hearfelt sincerity the good that you have done for another human being whose spirit is otherwise crushed. And not to be a pig, but just you two being able to have a physical life after all she has been through shows me your love and patience and kindness and understanding. You too have been through a great deal in resolving your issues and eviciting your demons.

Love and peace and forgiveness are the only thing that matters. And I do hope we all (on this site) do that for and to each other.

May peace reign eternal
May health follow us all
May kindness flow
May healing continue at unprecedentedd levels and may we all find comfort in joy in all the beauty that surrounds us.

AMEN

 

[revvinkevin]

[No message]

 

[jetcone]

Marty

Maybe this will help your understanding of our position since you have not lived through being gay in a "straight" world.

God is Love.
God does not make junk.
I and my gay brothers and sisters are not and never were junk.

And as for abominations in the Bible there are many as Toggles has shown and if you are going to take the Bible Literally THEN they all carry the SAME WEIGHT so YOU CAN'T ever select one as worse than any other.

And in turn you cannot select any one over any other to apply to a human condition.

The great use of the Bible to mankind is that it is a store house of human experience and truth. The Bible is a tool and should be used as a tool for life but it is VERY important to know that the Bible was never and will never be finished.

And that is because God is Infinite.

To limit the Bible is to limit God and that I can tell you is a REAL Abomination to God and Creation.

People at the COngregational Church around the corner here say "God is Still Speaking, "

So one can never learn it all by just reading the Bible.

Peter Gomes, the Dean of Theology at Harvard wrote a very good book on this very subject, its called 'The Good Book' and it was designed to snatch back the Bible for everyone from the hands of the Fundamentalists.
COnsidering the issues you raise I think you might find it a good read.

But as JeffG says we as gays will no longer tolerate injustice or discrimination in culture or law from any segment of society.

Silence=Death