Pics of KD2-P and Drain Valve Issues

[stevet]

right on! Toploader

You have the sequence perfect. The WM series, based on the KA 15/16 series was the first to use the flow thru valves. The UM-s and all the KD's up to the 14 used to solenoid to hold the drain closed.Then dropped out to let the water drain.

Sounds like we could use a guy like you in our office! Weahter is great here this time of year! Want a Job?

 

[toploader55]

Maybe

Hi Stevet.
Hmmmmm.Florida. I do have some friends there. What is it that I would be doing in the office ? And what do you do ? I have always had a passion for Hobart Machines. I still think the best door machine Hobart ever made was the (I think the model no. is) AM6-T2 or T3. Am I correct in saying that the T2 Timer was a 48 sec. wash ,5 sec dwell and 12 second Rinse ? While the T3 timer was a 45 sec wash,3 sec dwell, and 12 sec rinse ? Those cast iron wash arms (They use to call them NiResist) and the external ballbearing mount for the upper spray arm, Now that was a Tank of a machine. Right down to that little Buss fuse inside the timer box.
The UMs...another work horse. I know of one in a guys basement that I am trying to get. It is in perfect working order and condition. He used it as a glass washer behind the bar and replaced it with (I really am not up to speed on the newer models) but I want to say it is an LX series. 2 years old and has 12 service calls on the machine while the UM which is roughly 40 years old has had 1 motor, 1 fill solenoid and 1 door spring and maybe 12 or so pilot light bulbs. Pretty good record for 40 years.

 

[Unimatic1140]

When it's energized it is shut. So another words while it's filling and washing or rinsing, the valve is energized and is shut.

Yup after looking at my Bendix last night and my KD-12 and 14 dishwashers I see the drain valve actions are reversed. So while it worked fine in my '47 Bendix this wouldn't work in a early KA dishwasher. Oh well, I'm sure you can come up with something, that machine too beautiful not to be up and running.

 

[stevet]

Toploader knows his stuff!

Top,
I posted a message on the other KD2 thread about the drain valve, and yes those AM models were absolute tanks. They did away with many of those features in the AM 10 series which also was the first Solid State machine Hobart sold here.
The 10 and 11's had the cast iron arms, and the AM12 had the stainless steel arms. The AM14 had the same mechanicals but was changed to a 24volt power system and a single Solid State Control board. Turned out to be the most reliable machine Hobart ever made! Thanks to the low voltage electrical system, all the contactors and valves were 24 volts and the motors were normal 115/208/230/460/480 single or three phase electric.
They made the 14 series for nearly 25 years and now replaced it with the AM15 which is even better!
That is the machine with the glass door and featured in the youtube video clip.
As far as a job.. you would probably make a great field technician.. We are always looking for a few more good persons!
Steve

 

[toploader55]

Stevet

I am working now in a restaurant with a Meiko Machine. I really have to say this , but What a piece of crap. You would think a machine made in Germany (My native backgound and Mercedes, and BMW )The machine would be fantastic as far as the engineering would go..The machine cleans unbelievably. Choice of three wash programmes.(Especially for a Breakfast Restaurant with dried egg yolk etc.)They built the machine with very heavy gauge stainless steel. The wash arms are very well designed for the spray pattern. But...The manifolds feeding the upper and lower wash arms are made of PLASTIC. !!!!! Can you imagine the abuse these machines these days from dish handlers slamming sheet pans (18x26) into that machine and cracking the manifolds ? My last tech that has repaired endless issues with circuit boards told me to replace the upper wash manifold would cost $750.00.
As far as the newest Hobarts go, I see the same technology as far as the machine will not rinse or stop washing until the temp hits the specified sanitizing temps.
Give me the Cam Timers,Cast Iron Wash Arms,Hatco Boosters along side of the machines,the Buss Fuses,and Manuel Fill Valves and NOW YOU HAVE A GREAT MACHINE. Just my preference.
Do you remember the XM models ? I was going to a summer camp where they had a XM with the HUGE motor mounted on the left,(I belive it was a 2 HP motor) The R-1 Crescent reducer in the center to drive the conveyor and the Pump at the far right all connectected together the whole length of the machine ? Of course you had your choice of right to left ot left to right in your specifications on the machine being built for your dish area specs. It also had a control arm that you had to press down to push the last rack out. This was located just under the inspection door that would let the rack "Dwell. " Stay in the center of the wash action for a type of "Soak and Scrub". The name plate on that control arm that you pressed down to get that last rack out was "Hobart-Crescent Dual Drive". How that for a memery ? I believe Josephine Cochran sold the Dishwashing machine to Crescent and than it turned into Hobart. It even had a small "Port Hole" in the Inspection door.It was so cool to watch the spray action of the machine as it was running. When you fired that machine up all you heard was a low hum of the motor and water spraying. The Top spray was a three arm revolving wash arm while the lower one was stationary. All made of NiResist and the revolving wash was external ball bearing mount. Wash Gauge was on the Left,Rinse on the right and you could see the ball bearing mount for the upper wash exposed to see if it was rotating. This machine resembled the C-44 except I think it was 36-40 inches in length and had rounded hoods on either end. What a machine they built back then.
Then there was DuBois Chemicals. They had a soap called "Kloro-Kol". A chlorinated powder that went into the "Viz-a-trol" Soap resevoir and was dispensed and the "Rinse-a-Trol that dispensed the drying agent. It had a piston pump that lit up every time a rack went though the rinse section of the machine. The Viz-a-Trol had a electrode in the tank that sensed the titration (sp?) of the detergent in the tank. What a great aroma of that chlorinated detergent. It smelled so clean as the dishes passed out the end of the machine, in the old Heavy Stainless framed Sani-Stack Racks with the Plastisol 7 compartment Plate Racks, The Compartmented Glass Racks and the "Flat Racks for Silver ware."
Those were the days my friend. Lots of energy used and Lots of Hot Water. And great Results. It has been a fantastic pleasure running into you and everyone else on automaticwasher.org. I'm thinking about your offer. it's mild up here but maybe I'm ready to make a change. Please stay in touch.
Oh by the way, I don't care what the cost is for that drain valve, I'll maybe have a tech do it for me. I can do the little stuff, but the KD2 means so much to me, I need to see her up and running practically as my daily use machine. Fond memories brought into reality...I can't put a price on that. Eddie

 

[stevet]

Don"t expect Hobart to do it!

Eddie, you may buy the valve at Hobart, but their techs would not fix the Kitchenaid for you!
First and foremost, Hobart doesn't have anything to do with Kitchenaid as you well know.
Secondly,They never worked on the domestic lines even when they owned KA except in very rare instances and I know the Boston office never did.
Third, unless there is a real oldtimer in the office who would know what a UM machine is,(they dont even teach about these units anymore in school) nobody would know how to remove and install the valve, no less take the whole drain pump and reservoir assy apart.
Then again I have to wonder if they do actually know the machine as you mentioned that there were a bunch of them at thr resort areas.
I know about the XM's and the setup they had back then, amazing how many years they used it as a succcesful deign incorporating it into the C-Line machines(C44-54-64 etc)
It wasn't too long ago that they obsoleted the Crescent reducer and replaced it with a Winsmith reducer.
I know some old timers who have probably passed on now back in the NY office who would have even converted the XM's from those big motors to the newer style C44 style motors. I even have the TSB's that show you how to do it!

Those XM style motors were also used on the Mixers of that day and many are still going on and on as we speak!

In a company that has been around for over 110 years, there is a tremendous amount of history that is behind much of what they manufacture. Ahh.., but I can go on and on.
Hurry and get those valves.. you shlould be able to do the repair yourself. Believe me, it isn't hard to do. If you venture into it I can help you over the phone!

 

[toploader55]

stevet

Thankyou for all your help. I'm listening to my Mobile Maid bang some dishes around. It's a comforting sound knowing that there is some water pressure in the machine as compared to today's machines. I will contact the Hobart Office and get the valve. Maybe I should buy both. Just incase someone else in the club shall need one some day.I will be in touch as I certainly will need guidence on this challenge. Thanks for your support, and will start a new thread when the time arrives. Eddie... PS I guess I've turned into an old timer.(Not a Cam)