mrb627
Well-known member
To Be Honest...
I am not sure how they have lasted this long...
Malcolm
I am not sure how they have lasted this long...
Malcolm
Sears Appliance Sales Lose Heat
- Thread starter tomturbomatic
- Start date
Help Support :
twintubdexter
Well-known member
decided to take the flak...
...and repost my comment. A few months ago there was a thread where Sears was nailed to the cross while members threw tons of rocks and stones. A second thread popped up but the wise webmaster pulled the plug on it. It should be interesting to see how many pins get stuck in this new "Sears Voodoo Doll."
An interesting study was recently published by a firm called CoreBrand in which they surveyed more than 10,000 "business decision makers" and asked them how they perceived brands in terms of overall reputation, management and investment potential. PepsiCo and Coca Cola were at the top. As far as the worst 10, Best Buy and poor JCP were listed. At the very bottom was greedy Delta Airlines which, if you follow the news, is totally understandable. I'm sure Sears was in that list somewhere but it didn't make the least respected 10...and yes I'm aware you can take a survey and make it come out any way you like.
OK, I'm ready for the rocks and stones
...and repost my comment. A few months ago there was a thread where Sears was nailed to the cross while members threw tons of rocks and stones. A second thread popped up but the wise webmaster pulled the plug on it. It should be interesting to see how many pins get stuck in this new "Sears Voodoo Doll."
An interesting study was recently published by a firm called CoreBrand in which they surveyed more than 10,000 "business decision makers" and asked them how they perceived brands in terms of overall reputation, management and investment potential. PepsiCo and Coca Cola were at the top. As far as the worst 10, Best Buy and poor JCP were listed. At the very bottom was greedy Delta Airlines which, if you follow the news, is totally understandable. I'm sure Sears was in that list somewhere but it didn't make the least respected 10...and yes I'm aware you can take a survey and make it come out any way you like.
OK, I'm ready for the rocks and stones
I think that unless someone has personally had a bad experience with Sears, the chain is still coasting on its formerly good reputation. Plus, in general, service in many stores has disappeared, so Sears is hardly alone in this unfortunate trend.
However, it is obvious that management is taking money out and not spending anything on upgrades or improvements, and this is a trend that goes back long before current management. It has merely accelerated under hedge fund ownership.
There is nothing wrong with wanting to make profits for investors, but some companies are in it for the long haul and do make investments and improvements. Retailers like Target, Costco and Kohls come to mind.
Other retailers, like Sears, are clearly on a downward trend.
However, it is obvious that management is taking money out and not spending anything on upgrades or improvements, and this is a trend that goes back long before current management. It has merely accelerated under hedge fund ownership.
There is nothing wrong with wanting to make profits for investors, but some companies are in it for the long haul and do make investments and improvements. Retailers like Target, Costco and Kohls come to mind.
Other retailers, like Sears, are clearly on a downward trend.
Should the once-mighty Sears fall, I wonder if some other corporation would buy the rights to the name 'Kenmore'? It is still a well-known brand. Whirlpool, maybe? Seems they make everything save for GE, Frigidaire/Electrolux, and Speed Queen. Perhaps the Kenmore brand could then be sold at indie dealerships as well as Lowe's, Home Depot, etc.
Sears lost a lot of business when they closed all their small town 'catalog' stores. I would purchase any number of highly-rated Kenmore appliances but can't, unless I want to haul them 70 miles and install them myself, which I don't.
On the other hand, the closing of my burg's catalog store 20+ years ago has been good for the three local indie dealerships.
Sears lost a lot of business when they closed all their small town 'catalog' stores. I would purchase any number of highly-rated Kenmore appliances but can't, unless I want to haul them 70 miles and install them myself, which I don't.
On the other hand, the closing of my burg's catalog store 20+ years ago has been good for the three local indie dealerships.
iheartmaytag
Well-known member
As I have written in the past few months, I had a very good buying experience with Sear's in February when I purchased my new stove and dishwasher. The saleslady, Donna, was very helpful, knowledgeable, and searched to get me the best price.
My biggest worry if all the doomsayers are correct, is what will happen to the extended warranty I purchased on these appliances?
My biggest worry if all the doomsayers are correct, is what will happen to the extended warranty I purchased on these appliances?
I believe the extended warranties are administered by an outside company and are contractual obligations that would be fulfilled, though you might have little recourse (going back to Sears to complain) should you not be satisfied.
Sears has dug their own grave when it comes to retailing in the 21st Century. While their brands like Kenmore, Craftsman and their automotive brands were top sellers, much of this business model depended not only on good products at fair pricing points but also was heavily dependent on availability of consumer credit. Being a powerhouse of retailing, they had enormous resources to provide worthy customers an open credit line when others, independents, etc. did not have access to such marketing tools. At 18% interest, the credit department became the cash cow of the retail model.
Sears was one-stop shopping for nearly everything including home improvement. New siding and gutters as well as back-to-school clothes for the kids and a Kenmore washer to keep them looking smart, all in one stop. Short of cash and your refrigerator conks out? Head over to Sears and bring one home today, nothing down. Satisfaction guaranteed or your money back. You can imagine the quarterly reports for Toughskins jeans sales being rather insignificant compared with the line item for interest income on revolving credit balances.
Once this credit model of retailing began to erode, Sears didn't change with the times. Coming out with their Discover Card in the 80's was too little, too late. While it was a good product with attractive terms, it couldn't hold a candle to the name recognition and worldwide acceptance of Visa and Mastercard.
In the mid 70's, First National Bank of Omaha challenged and won the Federal law that prohibited the sale of financial products (credit cards) across state lines. Previously, all banks offering Bankamericard and Master Charge products were regulated to in-state institutions. After the Supremes ruled against this, nationwide sales of credit cards became the norm and credit-worthy individuals across the country saw their mailboxes fill up with competitive offers for lower interest rates and generous credit lines on credit cards from banks they'd never heard of. The availability of competitive credit products drove up consumer spending numbers to all-time highs within a decade. Other than the slight bump from Discover card accounts, Sears missed much of this bandwagon relying on their established base of credit customers as well as dwindling numbers of new customers to the Sears family. Their refusal until the early 1990's to accept Visa and Mastercard for payment also hurt sales numbers dramatically. It wasn't an instant plummet to the bottom, but a steady decline.
Relying on their aged, tried and true business models, Sears didn't keep up with Lowes, Home Depot and a myriad of automotive sales and repair outlets that exploded across the country. Then the Wal-Marts, Targets and the like who also offered a similar, but more basic-need range of shopping under one roof; a set of new tires, clothes and ice cream sandwiches - all on the Visa card, tied to the untapped pool of equity in your home.
I think the writing was on the wall when Sears merged with K-Mart, never a smart powerhouse of retailing in itself. We've lost so many of our big names over the years, but Sears has lasted longer than expected.
Sears has dug their own grave when it comes to retailing in the 21st Century. While their brands like Kenmore, Craftsman and their automotive brands were top sellers, much of this business model depended not only on good products at fair pricing points but also was heavily dependent on availability of consumer credit. Being a powerhouse of retailing, they had enormous resources to provide worthy customers an open credit line when others, independents, etc. did not have access to such marketing tools. At 18% interest, the credit department became the cash cow of the retail model.
Sears was one-stop shopping for nearly everything including home improvement. New siding and gutters as well as back-to-school clothes for the kids and a Kenmore washer to keep them looking smart, all in one stop. Short of cash and your refrigerator conks out? Head over to Sears and bring one home today, nothing down. Satisfaction guaranteed or your money back. You can imagine the quarterly reports for Toughskins jeans sales being rather insignificant compared with the line item for interest income on revolving credit balances.
Once this credit model of retailing began to erode, Sears didn't change with the times. Coming out with their Discover Card in the 80's was too little, too late. While it was a good product with attractive terms, it couldn't hold a candle to the name recognition and worldwide acceptance of Visa and Mastercard.
In the mid 70's, First National Bank of Omaha challenged and won the Federal law that prohibited the sale of financial products (credit cards) across state lines. Previously, all banks offering Bankamericard and Master Charge products were regulated to in-state institutions. After the Supremes ruled against this, nationwide sales of credit cards became the norm and credit-worthy individuals across the country saw their mailboxes fill up with competitive offers for lower interest rates and generous credit lines on credit cards from banks they'd never heard of. The availability of competitive credit products drove up consumer spending numbers to all-time highs within a decade. Other than the slight bump from Discover card accounts, Sears missed much of this bandwagon relying on their established base of credit customers as well as dwindling numbers of new customers to the Sears family. Their refusal until the early 1990's to accept Visa and Mastercard for payment also hurt sales numbers dramatically. It wasn't an instant plummet to the bottom, but a steady decline.
Relying on their aged, tried and true business models, Sears didn't keep up with Lowes, Home Depot and a myriad of automotive sales and repair outlets that exploded across the country. Then the Wal-Marts, Targets and the like who also offered a similar, but more basic-need range of shopping under one roof; a set of new tires, clothes and ice cream sandwiches - all on the Visa card, tied to the untapped pool of equity in your home.
I think the writing was on the wall when Sears merged with K-Mart, never a smart powerhouse of retailing in itself. We've lost so many of our big names over the years, but Sears has lasted longer than expected.
It doesn't stop with the Kenmore, Sears also degraded the Craftsman line.
Craftsman hand and power tools use to be good quality, U.S.A. made often rebranded from top manufacturers. Now many items are mediocre at best and Chinese made.
Same thing with the Lawn Tractors. They spared no effort in their misguided cost cutting, eliminating features, smaller tires, thin sheet metal, flimsy controls, etc.
Craftsman hand and power tools use to be good quality, U.S.A. made often rebranded from top manufacturers. Now many items are mediocre at best and Chinese made.
Same thing with the Lawn Tractors. They spared no effort in their misguided cost cutting, eliminating features, smaller tires, thin sheet metal, flimsy controls, etc.
Craftsman Tools & Lawn Equip: Misguided cost-cutting, etc.
In which case, a late-model Mont. Ward could give you more good ol' American-made quality, until they got out of that line of goods just in time...!
(Going out of business altogether, a few years after...)
-- Dave
In which case, a late-model Mont. Ward could give you more good ol' American-made quality, until they got out of that line of goods just in time...!
(Going out of business altogether, a few years after...)
-- Dave
twintubdexter
Well-known member
Sort of like Depot and Lowes, heavy-duty handles and coverings made of pretty orange and blue plastic covering cheap junk. The year or so I bought Craftsman outdoor power equipment for OSH I delt mostly with companies like Ryobi and MTD. Depot bought the once high-quality Rigid Company, turned it into a mediocre-at-best manufacturer and painted everything signature orange. I loved the Craftsman hand tools I grew up with. You could ruin the tip of a screwdriver, snap it in two in a vice and Sears would hand you a new one no questions asked. I don't think that works at Sears or anywhere else today. It might if Nordstrom carried tools. In retail, although margin is important, product turn is crucial. A pricey American-made 10" crescent wrench would probably gather dust on the shelf. I think cheap-a-fying and Chinese-made are just a part of today...like Edna Turnblad (Devine) told her husband in "Hairspray," "it's the times Wilbur, there a changin."
Relying on their aged, tried and true business models,
On the contrary, if they had stuck with their proven business models they would probably be in much better shape today.
Sears had tons of brand loyalty, they chased their customers away.
On the contrary, if they had stuck with their proven business models they would probably be in much better shape today.
Sears had tons of brand loyalty, they chased their customers away.
twintubdexter
Well-known member
You're probably correct, of course you would have had to get rid of almost all of the newer big box retailers, cut the cord on the Internet and merchants like Amazon and then go dig up Wendy Ward and her Signature line just to mention a few changes. The department store (of which Sears is) has changed dramatically in the past few years. Most of them have been flushed down the toilet along with the Charmin provided you believe as I do that changing the name on the building to Macy's is to have not survived at all. The original concept of the American department store was to be all things to all people. Lady Kenmores with lighted consoles and chrome trim couldn't have saved any of them.
No more comments from me on this thread , the red limit light is flashing...and everyone breathes a sigh of relief
No more comments from me on this thread , the red limit light is flashing...and everyone breathes a sigh of relief
whirlcool
Well-known member
Anyone here ever belong to the "Craftsman Club"? It was a free membership program that Sears had. Enrollment was free. This got you what looked like a credit card with a number and you name on it. The backround art was a photo of somebodies workbench, complete with tools.
Just present this card with any purchase of any Craftsman tool and you got an instant 10% off the purchase price. Craftsman Club members also got special unadvertised sale fliers in the mail on their private tool sales. I used mine a few times. One time I bought one of their 120 piece metric tool sets and the Craftsman card took $40. off the purchase.
I wonder if Sears still has this? Last time I used it was at least 9 years ago.
Just present this card with any purchase of any Craftsman tool and you got an instant 10% off the purchase price. Craftsman Club members also got special unadvertised sale fliers in the mail on their private tool sales. I used mine a few times. One time I bought one of their 120 piece metric tool sets and the Craftsman card took $40. off the purchase.
I wonder if Sears still has this? Last time I used it was at least 9 years ago.
jerrod6
Well-known member
I don't think any appliance business is as it was. Look at KitchenAid. Once it was acquired my Whirlpool the first thing they did was scrap the kitchenaid design and use a Whirlpool model, so there is at most no reason buy a kitchenaid because all you are getting is a Whirlpool. Same with Maytag, so if any specific Whirlpool design has design idea flaws every brand they make may get them.
People are a bit smarter today, so they are able to tell that Sears brand is nothing but a Whirlpool or LG often with less than the brand name offers.
None of these companies stands behind their product or offers direct service. Service is through a 3rd party which is not responsible for the product so you are at there mercy.
I am reminded of an old Joni Mitchell song from the album "The Hissing of Summer Lawns" The name of the song is "Harry's House. At the end of the song she repeats over and over....."nothing's any good.....nothing's any good....."the song ends while this repetitive phrase fades away.
People are a bit smarter today, so they are able to tell that Sears brand is nothing but a Whirlpool or LG often with less than the brand name offers.
None of these companies stands behind their product or offers direct service. Service is through a 3rd party which is not responsible for the product so you are at there mercy.
I am reminded of an old Joni Mitchell song from the album "The Hissing of Summer Lawns" The name of the song is "Harry's House. At the end of the song she repeats over and over....."nothing's any good.....nothing's any good....."the song ends while this repetitive phrase fades away.
I almost recently gave Sears a chance...
But there was no way I could because the Sears my family shopped for 40 years closed. I would have to go to the other side of the city to find a Sears. We do have the outlet stores nearby but not a regular Sears. I had to replace a garbage disposal and if Sears were around I would have bought Kenmore.
I went to HH Gregg to see if they had one. Nobody came by to ask if I needed anything and two clerks were outside smoking. I found the disposal display with a KitchenAid and a whirlpool and I was looking around wondering if someone would help me. I walked out slowly emptyhanded and they let me go out the door! Its a wonder people don't just steal and when they do, more power to them.
I ended up buying a "Badger" at Home Depot. But how does HH Gregg plan to stay in business?
But there was no way I could because the Sears my family shopped for 40 years closed. I would have to go to the other side of the city to find a Sears. We do have the outlet stores nearby but not a regular Sears. I had to replace a garbage disposal and if Sears were around I would have bought Kenmore.
I went to HH Gregg to see if they had one. Nobody came by to ask if I needed anything and two clerks were outside smoking. I found the disposal display with a KitchenAid and a whirlpool and I was looking around wondering if someone would help me. I walked out slowly emptyhanded and they let me go out the door! Its a wonder people don't just steal and when they do, more power to them.
I ended up buying a "Badger" at Home Depot. But how does HH Gregg plan to stay in business?
machinehead
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 1, 2006
- Messages
- 86
Educate me?
Fantastic, informative thread. I too have seen declining business (as in the showrooms sparkling and nobody cares, except the nail biting piraña sales folks-- not all are like that, but many I ran across) and wasn't sure why, till now. My cornfusion is, how did Sears screw up Whirlpool's relationship? They were inseparable for eons, no? I read through the whole post, but mayhap I missed that point...
Fantastic, informative thread. I too have seen declining business (as in the showrooms sparkling and nobody cares, except the nail biting piraña sales folks-- not all are like that, but many I ran across) and wasn't sure why, till now. My cornfusion is, how did Sears screw up Whirlpool's relationship? They were inseparable for eons, no? I read through the whole post, but mayhap I missed that point...
machinehead
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 1, 2006
- Messages
- 86
Duh!
Sorry, never mind-- just re-read that bit about replacing Whirlpool with LG, etc. yeah, that was not well thought out, from what I've seen about LG reliability...
Sorry, never mind-- just re-read that bit about replacing Whirlpool with LG, etc. yeah, that was not well thought out, from what I've seen about LG reliability...
I used to be a member of the Craftsman Club.Let mine run out years ago.don't know if Sears still has it-I buy tools from Lowes,ad even Harbor Freight at this point-HF is another cutthroat competitor to Craftsman.Some of their stuff isn't too bad.
Todays consumers are very savy. They know the difference in appliances mfr by Whirlpool and knockoffs. We all played along for years. Even Whirlpool has slipped with the Kenmore laundry equipment ( mostly because of energy regs). It will be a sad day when the tried and true 29 inch dryer is discontinued. I know they are available under other brand name labels. ( we have the admiral at present). I am sure the profit margin is higher on LG than the Whirlpool. Sad. I do know Sears owns many of their properties. The real estate value has helped through this downward spiral.
To add to what Jerrod wrote, someone here recently mentioned how Whirlpool destroyed the ability of KitchenAid owners to keep their perfectly good 30 year old dishwashers running by eliminating the parts inventory. Ganavisher mamzerim.
whirlcool
Well-known member
We do have the outlet stores nearby but not a regular Sears.
The two Sears on the north side of Houston (Greenspoint & The Woodlands) closed some time ago. The Greenspoint Sears is now just vacant, like the rest of the mall. The Woodlands Mall, rather upscale Sears closed down two years ago. Nordstrom's came in and tore the Sears building down and built their own in the same spot.
So now in North Houston we only have a Sears Outlet store (which isn't even owned by Sears) and a large Sears Hardware store. So if people really wanted to shop a Sears store they'd have to drive at least 35 miles to find one.
In the meantime the oldest Sears store I have ever seen (probably built in the 30's) is still open in a rather bad part of town. It's a full line Sears store at that. I wonder how long it'll last.
You hardly ever hear anyone anymore say "I bought it at Sears."
The two Sears on the north side of Houston (Greenspoint & The Woodlands) closed some time ago. The Greenspoint Sears is now just vacant, like the rest of the mall. The Woodlands Mall, rather upscale Sears closed down two years ago. Nordstrom's came in and tore the Sears building down and built their own in the same spot.
So now in North Houston we only have a Sears Outlet store (which isn't even owned by Sears) and a large Sears Hardware store. So if people really wanted to shop a Sears store they'd have to drive at least 35 miles to find one.
In the meantime the oldest Sears store I have ever seen (probably built in the 30's) is still open in a rather bad part of town. It's a full line Sears store at that. I wonder how long it'll last.
You hardly ever hear anyone anymore say "I bought it at Sears."
