Skeletons in my Closet!

[eronie]

This is getting VERY interesting !! The new varible speed controlers come in handy for a lot of projects I use them on my lathe an drill press no more belt changing!!

 

[tolivac]

Does that GE combo washer-dryer have a blower or fan of some type for the drtyer-Did that run from a separate motor?Does your IEC motor need 380-400V 3 Ph to work?Like how you were able to figure out in mounting the new motor.This project is interesting-like the details on its progress.Your motor reminds me of some of the face mount motors in our European transmitters for the water pumps.there are a couple of Face mount motors for some of the blowers.These cools things like tuning caps and the base sockets for the power tubes.the filament connectors and filament rings on the tubes get VERY hot.They have to be kept cool so the Ceramic to metal seals on the tubes don't fail.

 

[tolivac]

Other motors at workplaces-In the Wash DC plant-they had some very large 3Ph motors for the building HVAC system.sometimes had to help out with this-on the old Carrier Water chillers they had Crocker-Wheeler 700Hp wound rotor and syncronous motors to run the chillers.Base speeds of the motors was 1800RPM(Syncronous)-1750RPM for the Wound rotor.These ran from a 3Ph 2500V supply.The wound rotors had rotor load resisotrs for starting and speed control.The syncronous ones aran at fixed speed.You had to adjust the DC feild supply for unity reading on a PF meter on the motor controller.On the later renovation of the system--the Carrier chillers were replaced with Trane ones.1200 ton and 600ton.The old Carrier were 600ton.And the Carrier had TWICE the motor HP as the new ones.The Trane chillers have hermetic induction motors that run at 3450RPM.They have a reduced voltage starter via an autotransforemr that is switched by the starter.the condersor pumps are fixed speed Relaince "Iron Horse" 100 HP.The evaporator pumps are again 100Hp-but controlled by Grahm VFD's running from 480V The VFD motors are Balder.Used to have to start one of the chillers to provide cooling for the shop and other areas where I worked.Just one start button and the chiller auto startsa dn loads-same with its pumps.Neat to watch.The old chillers have to be started and loaded manually.the idea was to control that buildings HVAC systems remotely.That was being worked on at the time I was there.Probably got that going by now.And that place had 4 rotary screw 60hp air compressors-two in use-two as backup-and could switch automatically or manually.Had to repair one compressors Load-unload valve relay.Otherwise the compressor wouldn't start-just trips its breaker.when the unloading fixed-was fine.The 60 hp motor drove the compressor and oil pump directly-3450RPM 60Hp 480V.1 blower motor cooled the compressor and oil,air coolers.Don't know what its HP was.And I was there to work on studio equipmenbt-and had to know how to switch to the main or backup studio cooling chillers.And for that building they have blowers for air circulation in the building-and they are run by Crocker Wheeler motors-some at least 70Yrs old-still going strong.Guess Crocker Wheeler made a good motor-in various HP.208-230V 3Ph 3-25HP.

 

[combo52]

GE COMBO CONVERISON

We are all watching this and are excited to see how it will work. 

 

The original motor is just one speed 1725 RPMs and it is a very rugged motor save it for someone. The pump cupping is the same as the GE TL washers, as is the water pump [ this pump was used on the BOL non FF models].

 

[tomturbomatic]

Looks like you have set out to drain the swamp

The first time I ever saw one of the GE pump couplers, I was reminded of the Japanese lanterns we made in Kindergarten.

While the motor is just one speed, it was two directional as reversing motors were used in many laundry and dishwasher applications; one way for wash and the other direction for drain and spin where applicable. With the original set up, the machine tumbles in one direction for washing and rinsing and in reverse direction for draining to make the pump work. Since the pump has to work all during the drying phase, it tumbles counterclockwise during dry which is why the heating elements are placed where they are on the opposite side of the machine from the dispensers which are part of the pathetic condensation system.

While the original speed changing mechanism was primitive, it helped add weight to the machine, as did the big motor, to help stabalize it during the spin periods. The undercounter/builtin model was held to the floor by the plate fastened to the floor which had channels for the machine's feet. The free-standing model just sat on the floor. As a safety measure, they had a speed control feed back mechanism in the left front foot (as you are looking at the machine). The machine rocked up and down on this foot during the spin periods which made a ticking sound and if it rocked beyond a certain amount, it dropped the machine out of spin into a rebalance tumble, losing valuable spin time since it did not interrupt current to the timer motor. I don't know of a single combo that sophisticated. I remember riding the front corner of one of these to keep the spin speed up to the rip-roaring speed of 225 or 250 rpm; sorry I don't remember exactly now. I would love to try using one of these with a SPIN-X or even my W1918 Miele to compare drying speeds between what the combo extracted and the same load extracted at 1600 rpm.

 

[mickeyd]

"We are all watching this and are excited to see how it

 

 

Glad to see you back, Melvin, and to hear you, too. Just watched your video. Interesting and soothing. I like it when people talk in their vids.

It feels like you know them a little better. Always get a kick out of your mods. Can't wait to see what you do with the lights, remembering the sapphire and how your "matted" a slot near the inlet for the tub light, if memory is working right.

[this post was last edited: 11/14/2011-13:04]

 

[supremewhirlpol]

qualin:
Don't apologize, if you have a question just ask it. We will go through it and get a solution! The pumps are harder to find too, so it has to go along with the motor. I will be using a pump powered by a shaded pole motor. The older bigger ones from the early post FF GE/Hotpiont machines look very attractive to me for this project. I've looked at the motor pulley and it seems to be made for the bigger belts with the teeth. The pulley that I will be using will be smaller, due to several factors to which I will later today, when I post updates to mounting the motor, the pulley, and wiring the motor. The original motor is actually one speed 1725 RPM 1/3 HP, Thanks John(combo52) for correcting me. When a typed the above post I was thinking about a motor that looked very similar to it an it's specs stuck in my head->sorry. The VFD module is an industrial unit. Most industrial units have a number of parameters that can be changed. Its not just a case of connect up the VFD to power and a 3 phase motor and boom the motor works. There are parameters such as ramp acceleration time, ramp deceleration time, Braking voltage, switching frequency, motor load type. Every VFD is different. There are input and output terminals on the VFD that can be programmed to have the VFD do specific things. For example: The Telemanque VFD on the Primusw-10x^2 project has several modes that you can program in to it for the terminal inputs and outputs. Some of the inputs you can program the motor to operate at different speeds or change direction. When I get to programming the VFD, I think you will understand better once you see a few diagrams and commands.

Eronie:
Yes they are very handy, but are expensive, and do not stand up to extreme voltage fluctuations.

Rex:
I don't think the combo machines have blowers in them for drying. There are elements in the drum though. The Leeson motor can operate on both the 380-400V and the 230V 3 phase. It's just a change in the wiring configuration. 700HP motor is big. Does it have heaters? Are the Crocker Wheeler motors as big and heavy as the vintage Repulsion-Start motors?

Mickeyd:
The camera I'm using doesn't do justice to the real sound of my voice. I do have updates to the blue Whirlpool, that I need to post some time.

 

[combo52]

ELECTRIC DRAIN PUMPS

Hi Melvin it looks like you are really moving ahead. One thing to keep in mind most electric drain pumps on newer washers are only intermittent duty [ including the GE pump you mentioned ] so it may not make it very long into the dry cycle.

 

[tolivac]

Melvin: the protection circuits for motors or other devices running from medium voltages rely on current sensing transformers in series with the power supply lines going into the motor or other device.Relays are connected to the secondaries of the current sense transformers-generally one transformer per phase.If an overcurrent condition is detected-the motor starter contactors are opened.-and a warning alarm is sounded or displayed for the operator.Medium voltage circuit breakers work the same way-if the breaker is termed "utility" grade-it has a 3 shot reset function-its like you are at your home and get a power failure-if after the third shot--get out your candles and flashlights-the utilities breaker will have to be manually reset by the lineman after he has located and corrected the problem,Barnes&Powell makes such circuit breakers.GE,westinghouse USED to make them.Barnes&Powell electric bought up the GE med voltage breaker division,Seimens bought up Westinghouse breaker,transformer divisions.
the Crocker Wheeler motors were indeeed heavy-they had cast iron end bells and a large core.Most that I saw at that building ran at 1325 RPM-and some at 1725RPM.the 700 HP models were beautiful peices of engineering--too bad they suffered the fate of the "hot Wrench"-cutting torch.The old chillers and motors suffered that fate-so they could be removed from the building and sent to the scrap yard-oh the Indignity!and on those old Centrifical chillers-the 700Hp motor turned a transmission-a "speed increase" gear-stepped up the 1800RPM motor speed to 8,000 RPM for the compressor impellor-two stage.The newer Trane compressors had no speed increase gear-the 3450 RPM hermetic motor drove a multistage centrifical compressor.

 

[supremewhirlpol]

Everything about the motor is in metric units, so any pulley I use will have to be modified accordingly. Shaft diameter is ~.55in. pulley inner diameter is .5in. Pulley has been machined to fit the shaft.

 

[supremewhirlpol]

Pulley fits on shaft snug.(key removed)

 

[supremewhirlpol]

Here is the wiring configuration. The motor is currently configured for the higher voltage (440V 3ph).

 

[supremewhirlpol]

Using special conduit

 

[supremewhirlpol]

Here is the original motor configuration.(440v 3ph) Each wire is marked with a number. Motor is wye wound configuration.

 

[supremewhirlpol]

Motor configuration should be for the lower voltage.(220V 3ph) Your configuration should be similar to post 556755 for low voltage. U2:T4,T5,T6 L1:T1,T7 L2:T2,T8 L3:T3,T9. Motor wiring configurations can vary per motor. FOLLOW YOUR DIAGRAM!!

 

[supremewhirlpol]

Motor wired, just needs to be installed.

 

[supremewhirlpol]

I use size M6 metric bolts with locking nuts, they are stainless steel. Some washers here and there for elevating motor to account for the flange.

 

[supremewhirlpol]

Motor nameplate.

 

[supremewhirlpol]

Motor is mounted, time to test it.

 

[supremewhirlpol]

Test: no load, no VFD 220VAC 3ph