Here is one where Launderess' highly-esteemed expertise is requested...
Sodiun Percarborate in your laundry
- Thread starter toggleswitch
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BTW
8oz = 1cup = 230ml. after that do the math!
8oz = 1cup = 230ml. after that do the math!
Toggs,
What is your question?
Sodium percarbonate is the active ingredient in Oxyclean. It's an oxygen bleach that is more active at lower temperatures than the traditional oxygen bleach, sodium perborate. It is also less stable in water as noted in the web page you linked.
What is your question?
Sodium percarbonate is the active ingredient in Oxyclean. It's an oxygen bleach that is more active at lower temperatures than the traditional oxygen bleach, sodium perborate. It is also less stable in water as noted in the web page you linked.
Nuittin' beign asked. Just thought I'd reference some info, and with any luck have Launderess tell us some more good stuff.
Heard often enough (eventually) I'll retain it. LOL
Heard often enough (eventually) I'll retain it. LOL
Not much more to add:
Both sodium percarbonate and sodium perborate are oxygen bleaches, that is they give up hydrogen peroxide in water which is what does the actual bleaching.
Sodium perborate has been the standard for oxygen bleaching on both sides of the pond for ages. It is inexpensive, stable in formulations, and has a few other properties due to it's being derived from borax. However sodium perborate is called the "hot water" oxygen bleach, because it requires temps >120F to really get going, with >140 preferred. However this problem was solved by adding bleach activators (TAED and NBOS are the most common), which allows "boil wash" bleaching results in water temps of 140F to 100F. Both P&G and Henkel Germany have numerous patents on activated oxygen bleaching systems, and are part of their top shelf detergents such as Tide and Persil.
Because sodium perborate is not that active of a bleach in warm or cold water (though like all oxygen bleaches it will work, it just takes a very long contact time), it is frequently used as a "colour safe" oxygen bleach. This is because at the water temperatures colours are normally laundered, there is less risk of damage. Rule to remember is that for about every 10 degree temperature increase, there is an 18% increase in bleaching action. So what is safe at 100F may bleach out colour at 140F or 160F.
Sodium Percarbonate is the "cold water" oxygen bleach, in that it is active in warm and cool water without the requirement for bleaching activators. Uncoated sodium percarbonate is rather unstable, and looses power over time, which lead to the development of coated versions to produce more stable versions to give longer shelf life, especially when combined with detergents.
Though not necessary, some commercial detergents do combine a bleaching activator with sodium percarbonte both to enhance cooler water bleaching,and stain removal, but for another reason as well.
When both sodium perborate and sodium percarbonate are combined with bleaching activators they produce a chemcial compound called peracids. Peracids not only powerful bleaches, but very effective disenfectants as well. Brewers who do not use chlorine bleach to disenfect their equipment (for obvious reasons), do use peracid based cleaners. There are even commercial laundry detergents/oxygen bleaches sold in Europe that are certified to disenfect laundry with proper dosage of chemical and water temps of 140F held for a certian period of time.
Because of the bleaching activators, some oxygen bleach containing detergents such as Tide or Persil have been said to cause fading of darks and some colours, even when using warm and cool water. Hence the reason Persil has "Persil for Colours" and P&G sells Cheer.
In Europe, detergents with oxygen bleaches serve many other purposes as well, including helping to control the growth of germs and mould inside the washing machine. Indeed many European washer repair persons blame the recent outbreak of mould, slime and foul odours in front loaders on a mix of several factors, including use of mainly warm to cold water for washing, and using less to none bleaches (in Europe bleaches most always refers to oxygen bleach, LCB is called various things such as eau de Javel and is rarely used for laundry).
Both sodium percarbonate and sodium perborate are oxygen bleaches, that is they give up hydrogen peroxide in water which is what does the actual bleaching.
Sodium perborate has been the standard for oxygen bleaching on both sides of the pond for ages. It is inexpensive, stable in formulations, and has a few other properties due to it's being derived from borax. However sodium perborate is called the "hot water" oxygen bleach, because it requires temps >120F to really get going, with >140 preferred. However this problem was solved by adding bleach activators (TAED and NBOS are the most common), which allows "boil wash" bleaching results in water temps of 140F to 100F. Both P&G and Henkel Germany have numerous patents on activated oxygen bleaching systems, and are part of their top shelf detergents such as Tide and Persil.
Because sodium perborate is not that active of a bleach in warm or cold water (though like all oxygen bleaches it will work, it just takes a very long contact time), it is frequently used as a "colour safe" oxygen bleach. This is because at the water temperatures colours are normally laundered, there is less risk of damage. Rule to remember is that for about every 10 degree temperature increase, there is an 18% increase in bleaching action. So what is safe at 100F may bleach out colour at 140F or 160F.
Sodium Percarbonate is the "cold water" oxygen bleach, in that it is active in warm and cool water without the requirement for bleaching activators. Uncoated sodium percarbonate is rather unstable, and looses power over time, which lead to the development of coated versions to produce more stable versions to give longer shelf life, especially when combined with detergents.
Though not necessary, some commercial detergents do combine a bleaching activator with sodium percarbonte both to enhance cooler water bleaching,and stain removal, but for another reason as well.
When both sodium perborate and sodium percarbonate are combined with bleaching activators they produce a chemcial compound called peracids. Peracids not only powerful bleaches, but very effective disenfectants as well. Brewers who do not use chlorine bleach to disenfect their equipment (for obvious reasons), do use peracid based cleaners. There are even commercial laundry detergents/oxygen bleaches sold in Europe that are certified to disenfect laundry with proper dosage of chemical and water temps of 140F held for a certian period of time.
Because of the bleaching activators, some oxygen bleach containing detergents such as Tide or Persil have been said to cause fading of darks and some colours, even when using warm and cool water. Hence the reason Persil has "Persil for Colours" and P&G sells Cheer.
In Europe, detergents with oxygen bleaches serve many other purposes as well, including helping to control the growth of germs and mould inside the washing machine. Indeed many European washer repair persons blame the recent outbreak of mould, slime and foul odours in front loaders on a mix of several factors, including use of mainly warm to cold water for washing, and using less to none bleaches (in Europe bleaches most always refers to oxygen bleach, LCB is called various things such as eau de Javel and is rarely used for laundry).
Got it- the additional "C" in the name of the chemical is for "COLD".
Le voila.
Le voila.
I'm Sorry?
"Per" merely means "of" or some such in latin.
Per-Carbonate ='s Of or from (sodium)carbonate (washing powder)
Per=borate ='s Of or from borates (borax).
Sodium percarbonate is made by treating washing soda with hydrogen peroxide. Sodium perborate is made the same way but with borates (borax). Well there is more to it than that, but that is the simple break down.
"Per" merely means "of" or some such in latin.
Per-Carbonate ='s Of or from (sodium)carbonate (washing powder)
Per=borate ='s Of or from borates (borax).
Sodium percarbonate is made by treating washing soda with hydrogen peroxide. Sodium perborate is made the same way but with borates (borax). Well there is more to it than that, but that is the simple break down.
It's me, there is no need to over-think it.....
I now remember which chemical is for colder water by way of....
My own little mnemonic device.
I now remember which chemical is for colder water by way of....
My own little mnemonic device.
As Edith Bunker Would Say
Ohhhhhhhhhh!
Ohhhhhhhhhh!
over thinking...
Oh, my paws and whiskers, Steve...no, no, no.
I will not, I shall not, a thousand times no...
But gosh, that line was a-w-f-u-ll-y tempting.
I wish we could get Laundress to educate us more often. Such knowledge, more importantly, such ability to communicate clearly and simply.
Oh, my paws and whiskers, Steve...no, no, no.
I will not, I shall not, a thousand times no...
But gosh, that line was a-w-f-u-ll-y tempting.
I wish we could get Laundress to educate us more often. Such knowledge, more importantly, such ability to communicate clearly and simply.
Personally, when using cool water for laundering say a delicate item, and or do not wish to bother with all the rinsing required with powdered oxygen bleaches, just add 1/4 cup of 3% hydrogen peroxide (the same found in brown bottles at chemists, or sold by Ecover or Seventh Generation).
Pure hydrogen peroxide can also be used to bleach white wool that has yellowed or stained, and is useful for pre-treated fresh blood stains on laundry.
Unlike both percarbonate and perborate bleaches, pure hydrogen peroxide is near neutral, while the others are alkaline. Hydrogen peroxide also requires less rinsing because it breaks down quickly into pretty much water and a few traces of other chemicals. Sodium perborate often requires lots of rinsing, but percarbonate less so. Both must be well rinsed from textiles to avoid long term damage.
L.
Pure hydrogen peroxide can also be used to bleach white wool that has yellowed or stained, and is useful for pre-treated fresh blood stains on laundry.
Unlike both percarbonate and perborate bleaches, pure hydrogen peroxide is near neutral, while the others are alkaline. Hydrogen peroxide also requires less rinsing because it breaks down quickly into pretty much water and a few traces of other chemicals. Sodium perborate often requires lots of rinsing, but percarbonate less so. Both must be well rinsed from textiles to avoid long term damage.
L.
~But gosh, that line was a-w-f-u-ll-y tempting.
Well you'll have to e-mail me if you choose not to embarass me publicly. *LOL*
~I wish we could get Laundress (sic) to educate us more often.
All I did was ask nicely and she came to our rescue........
~pure hydrogen peroxide is near neutral, while the others are alkaline.
So would a "sour" (acidic) rinse with lemon juice or vinegar be of any benefit or otherwise desirous?
Well you'll have to e-mail me if you choose not to embarass me publicly. *LOL*
~I wish we could get Laundress (sic) to educate us more often.
All I did was ask nicely and she came to our rescue........
~pure hydrogen peroxide is near neutral, while the others are alkaline.
So would a "sour" (acidic) rinse with lemon juice or vinegar be of any benefit or otherwise desirous?
Normally I don't bother, as my Miele does four or five very deep rinses, but yes, one could add a small amount of white vinegar to the second to last rinse.
Problem with using any acidic substance on cotton or linen, is any residue can damage the fibers over the long run, especially if the laundry is going to be ironed or dried in a very hot dryer. Some commercial sours advise adding the sour to a third rinse with one or two more following, or adding a final rinse after the sour rinse.
OTHO white vinegar is a very dilute acid already, so as long as one is not overly lavish, things should be fine.
L.
Problem with using any acidic substance on cotton or linen, is any residue can damage the fibers over the long run, especially if the laundry is going to be ironed or dried in a very hot dryer. Some commercial sours advise adding the sour to a third rinse with one or two more following, or adding a final rinse after the sour rinse.
OTHO white vinegar is a very dilute acid already, so as long as one is not overly lavish, things should be fine.
L.
"Not much more to add..."?
Wouldn't want to lift the heavy tome you'd write when you have a lot to add, lol...
Good info.
Wouldn't want to lift the heavy tome you'd write when you have a lot to add, lol...
Good info.
Oh Suds
You know I love you more than my luggage!
*LOL*
You know I love you more than my luggage!
*LOL*
Is it Louis Vitton?
I couldn't picture you with lesser baggage...
;-)
I couldn't picture you with lesser baggage...
;-)
Oh I Don't Know
Have been seen with a few lesser old "bags" in my time.
*LOL*
Have been seen with a few lesser old "bags" in my time.
*LOL*
And one must ask, do you love anyone more than your Miele?
There Are Only A Few Things One Can Truly Love
Things that have wonderful longstanding and lasting qualties which appreciate with time. Pondering the acclumination and compounding such things will gather over the years brings one an immense sense of comfort.
*LOL*
Things that have wonderful longstanding and lasting qualties which appreciate with time. Pondering the acclumination and compounding such things will gather over the years brings one an immense sense of comfort.
*LOL*
