waterwitch
Well-known member
Is there a following for swamp coolers? It's getting harder and harder to spot the earlier ones it seems. My neighbor and I refurbished one that I got from my Grandmother. It works like a champ.
Swamp/Evaporative Coolers
- Thread starter waterwitch
- Start date
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Well, this might be the place to post a photo of one.
I got rid of my plastic evaporative cooler some time ago. It was a small model, about two feet by two feet. Never did seem to cool things down much, and I thought it added too much moisture to the interior of the house. I've been on the lookout for a heat exchanger type, one that would separate the water cooling passages from the air cooling passages, so that interior moisture levels would not be affected. But I've yet to find a small window-mounted or portable model that can do this.
I got rid of my plastic evaporative cooler some time ago. It was a small model, about two feet by two feet. Never did seem to cool things down much, and I thought it added too much moisture to the interior of the house. I've been on the lookout for a heat exchanger type, one that would separate the water cooling passages from the air cooling passages, so that interior moisture levels would not be affected. But I've yet to find a small window-mounted or portable model that can do this.
Sorry to be off topic, but when I saw this, I had to say something...
When it comes to cooling your house, these things are generally rubbish.
They are VERY common in Australia, but as the climate changes, they are starting to lose effectiveness. In Perth, we had one (fully ducted), but it was always wet and horrid inside, and generally the best cooling came from being under the air vent.
It got freezing inside at night, but only due to cooler summer nights. I'd NEVER have one again - they use far too much water to be economical with today's water rates rising like volcano smoke - and I tell you some units water leak like old British cars do oil or the bleed valves are set up incorrectly (not sure how tho), so tonnes of water is dribbling thru the drain.
Then there is the fact that they are useless in humid weather! Then, the are just as good as having dinner under the sprinklers...
Besides, having in this country we either have central heating or individual heaters. If you have ducted swamp coolers, then you might have a COMPLETELY SEPARATE ducted gas heater... What is the sense there?
So, reverse cycle ducted system are becoming far more prevalent now, as you don't need separate systems to do different jobs - far smarter in my opinion!
When it comes to cooling your house, these things are generally rubbish.
They are VERY common in Australia, but as the climate changes, they are starting to lose effectiveness. In Perth, we had one (fully ducted), but it was always wet and horrid inside, and generally the best cooling came from being under the air vent.
It got freezing inside at night, but only due to cooler summer nights. I'd NEVER have one again - they use far too much water to be economical with today's water rates rising like volcano smoke - and I tell you some units water leak like old British cars do oil or the bleed valves are set up incorrectly (not sure how tho), so tonnes of water is dribbling thru the drain.
Then there is the fact that they are useless in humid weather! Then, the are just as good as having dinner under the sprinklers...
Besides, having in this country we either have central heating or individual heaters. If you have ducted swamp coolers, then you might have a COMPLETELY SEPARATE ducted gas heater... What is the sense there?
So, reverse cycle ducted system are becoming far more prevalent now, as you don't need separate systems to do different jobs - far smarter in my opinion!
What is a swamp cooler?
Gary
Gary
Those type of coolers are made for much drier areas with little to no humidity. They use cold water to cool the hot, dry air instead of a refrigeration unit. Up where I am we get alot of humidity, especially in the summer so an a/c is the only thing to be comfortable and many people use dehumidifiers in their basements or it creates mold without them.
Swamp coolers use filter pads saturated with water (i thinks its a straw material), and pass air thru them to cool the air. I'm sure you'll know of how when a breeze blows (and you are sweating), you'll feel relief. That is evaporative cooling at work!
But its only designed for dryer areas, so not the deep south of the US, or Queensland, Northern Territory etc in Australia.
They also only cool the air down around 10*C relative to the O/D temp, so if it's 38C out, then the coldest air will be around 28C... So in super hot areas, they are also ineffective. If you A/C a house with one, the furniture always feels moist, so its probably also a way of creating mould AND making your refrigerators work harder in the defrost cycle...
Thank god we moved out of our old house that had one! Standard systems are so much better!
But its only designed for dryer areas, so not the deep south of the US, or Queensland, Northern Territory etc in Australia.
They also only cool the air down around 10*C relative to the O/D temp, so if it's 38C out, then the coldest air will be around 28C... So in super hot areas, they are also ineffective. If you A/C a house with one, the furniture always feels moist, so its probably also a way of creating mould AND making your refrigerators work harder in the defrost cycle...
Thank god we moved out of our old house that had one! Standard systems are so much better!
Gary, they're those evaporative coolers. You see them sometimes in stores near the a/c and fans... fill with water and the fan blows air thru the media wick supposedly cooling the air,, basically a humidifier which you definitely don't want to use here in the summer.
waterwitch
Well-known member
@washer111;
I will admit, they are ineffective in humid weather. But in a dry heat, they reign king. Water consumption is minuscule, as well as the power needed in comparison to that of a "Refrigerant" type unit. The design of these machines are very simple, should something go wrong such as leaking, well it's just due to poor maintenance I'm afraid. I'm sorry to hear your experience with these types of coolers have been less than pleasant.
I will admit, they are ineffective in humid weather. But in a dry heat, they reign king. Water consumption is minuscule, as well as the power needed in comparison to that of a "Refrigerant" type unit. The design of these machines are very simple, should something go wrong such as leaking, well it's just due to poor maintenance I'm afraid. I'm sorry to hear your experience with these types of coolers have been less than pleasant.
cfz2882
Well-known member
they aren't real popular in my area,but in arid areas i have lived in they have
been common-especially for larger mobile homes.These mobile home units have a
large squirrel cage blower belt driven from a split phase motor of around 1/2HP,
evaporative pads on 3 or four sides kept wet by a circulation pump in the lower
pan-waterlevel in the pan kept up by a float valve connected to water supply.
One complaint with these coolers is they can blow white mineral dust through the
home if mineral-laden water used.30+ years ago i had a '50s era"thermador"small
tabletop "swamp cooler";had a 3-blade fan of around 12"diameter a disc on the back
of the horizontal motor drove a wheel on the vertical pump shaft-IIRC the pump
could be disengaged by a lever moving the pump wheel out of contact with the disc
on the motor.
been common-especially for larger mobile homes.These mobile home units have a
large squirrel cage blower belt driven from a split phase motor of around 1/2HP,
evaporative pads on 3 or four sides kept wet by a circulation pump in the lower
pan-waterlevel in the pan kept up by a float valve connected to water supply.
One complaint with these coolers is they can blow white mineral dust through the
home if mineral-laden water used.30+ years ago i had a '50s era"thermador"small
tabletop "swamp cooler";had a 3-blade fan of around 12"diameter a disc on the back
of the horizontal motor drove a wheel on the vertical pump shaft-IIRC the pump
could be disengaged by a lever moving the pump wheel out of contact with the disc
on the motor.
arbilab
Well-known member
I have been 3 places where swamp coolers were dominant. Colorado, southern California high desert (Palmdale), and San Jose. They get so cold you have to turn them off. They cost next to nothing to run. Here in central Texas they would be useless.
What determines how well they work is dewpoint. The actual amount of water in the air. Remotely related to what gets reported, relative humidity, which gets jacked around by temperature (that's what it's "relative" to). Those "3 places" above have chronically low dewpoints.
Swamp cooler air is within 10F of dewpoint. If dewpoint is 40F like it is in Colorado or Palmdale, swamp cooler air is 50F, the best temp you can get out of a refrigeration system.
What determines how well they work is dewpoint. The actual amount of water in the air. Remotely related to what gets reported, relative humidity, which gets jacked around by temperature (that's what it's "relative" to). Those "3 places" above have chronically low dewpoints.
Swamp cooler air is within 10F of dewpoint. If dewpoint is 40F like it is in Colorado or Palmdale, swamp cooler air is 50F, the best temp you can get out of a refrigeration system.
Up here in Calgary, we have extremely dry weather, so swamp coolers work like a hot damn. The problem is, they are about as expensive as air conditioners to purchase (Which I don't really understand why) and they are somewhat rare here.
The biggest reason is mainly due to the fact that we have about 3 months of warm weather per year and that's about it.
I own one myself but find that a proper compressor driven A/C unit cools everything down much faster and much more effectively. However, a swamp cooler is better if one wants to leave the windows open to let the wind blow through the house, while keeping cool.
I would buy another one if I could find one!
The biggest reason is mainly due to the fact that we have about 3 months of warm weather per year and that's about it.
I own one myself but find that a proper compressor driven A/C unit cools everything down much faster and much more effectively. However, a swamp cooler is better if one wants to leave the windows open to let the wind blow through the house, while keeping cool.
I would buy another one if I could find one!
Swamp/Evaporative coolers just don't work in Perth, Australia. The weather gets too humid sometimes. Only bigger industrial/commericial systems seemed to be useful in that weather.
Our installer recommend just running Fan mode in humid weather, as the humidity would supposedly do the cooling...
Our particular unit had 2-3 repairs in the 6 years we had it, mainly the fan or filter pads. But you are right, they are cheap to run (generally). I knew friends whose systems had poor bleed arrangements, leading ago around 5-10L (or more) per hour of wastage, in Perth, that wasn't good (water restrictions etc).
But today with people wanting both heating and cooling, they are probably losing popularity in regards to reverse cycle systems, which can heat, cool, dehumidify, fan and automate the temperature - who wants to separate costly installations (ours cost around $6000 for around 12 vents - imagine doing that with ducted gas heating AND the Cooler - you could buy a complete reverse cycle system for around $2K less today!)
Our installer recommend just running Fan mode in humid weather, as the humidity would supposedly do the cooling...
Our particular unit had 2-3 repairs in the 6 years we had it, mainly the fan or filter pads. But you are right, they are cheap to run (generally). I knew friends whose systems had poor bleed arrangements, leading ago around 5-10L (or more) per hour of wastage, in Perth, that wasn't good (water restrictions etc).
But today with people wanting both heating and cooling, they are probably losing popularity in regards to reverse cycle systems, which can heat, cool, dehumidify, fan and automate the temperature - who wants to separate costly installations (ours cost around $6000 for around 12 vents - imagine doing that with ducted gas heating AND the Cooler - you could buy a complete reverse cycle system for around $2K less today!)
whirlcool
Well-known member
My grandmother had a portable one of those in the 60's in Chicago. I think it cooled the air 5 degrees or something like that. Plus when you entered the room where it was running you'd instantly get sweaty. It wasn't a comfortable feeling. She eventually got air conditioning. I think it didn't work well because Chicago can be very humid in the summertime.
I remember when the little models hit the dime stores in the early 60s. Because the store was air conditioned and had a fairly low relative humidity, the air coming out of these did feel cooler. Then we saw one in a gasoline station in the humid south and it was moldy and dirty and doing noting for comfort. Friends had a big swamp cooler for their orchid greenhouse and it did what it was supposed to do, increase humidity and provide nice air circulation with a bit of cooling.
Along Route 66
Remember seeing these on my trips out west. Lots of them starting in far west Oklahoma, Texas panhandle, New Mexico, Arizona and S. California.
Remember seeing these on my trips out west. Lots of them starting in far west Oklahoma, Texas panhandle, New Mexico, Arizona and S. California.
You're right Tom...
I remember seeing those coolers at Woolworth's in the late '70's. They looked like window air conditioners and looked cheap. My cousin who worked in Woolworth's told me they finally stopped selling them because customers kept bringing them back.
I remember seeing those coolers at Woolworth's in the late '70's. They looked like window air conditioners and looked cheap. My cousin who worked in Woolworth's told me they finally stopped selling them because customers kept bringing them back.
nurdlinger
Well-known member
Tucson AZ
Evaporative coolers were predominant here for decades. Now I do not believe new houses even offer them as options. My house was built in 1978 and had an evaporative cooler for cooling and a mobile-home type resistive heating device for our mild winters. The water comes from nearby wells, and is quite hard. The first year I lived in the house, I had all that trouble people mentioned with mineral crud clogging the pads in the cooler, and the dust blowing all around the house. I got a whole-house softener before the second summer, and that solved that problem. However the typical painted-metal cooler enclosure needed a LOT of maintenance. Everything rusted. The water sat in the box bottom, which was sealed with a tar-like coating. Every year that needed to be touched up and it was a miserable task. The squirrel cage fan rusted to the point where it flung off blades and I had to replace that. By about 1985 I was frustrated with the amount of work required to maintain the thing. I replaced the original cooler with a stainless-steel model. There was a significant cost differential ($450 vs. $350 for the same-size painted model) but the durability obtained was worth it. That box is still on the roof today. It never leaks, and does not require the tar lining to achieve it. Maintenance was still required, new pads every year, belt replacement every so often, etc. Plus after more than 20 years some of the plastic water distribution tubing inside needed to be replaced. Finally in 2010 the guy who maintained it (after I got too old & fat to climb up on the roof) told me the fan housing and pump brackets were too rusted to be repaired. I haven't used it since. In 1990 I bought a heat pump to replace the trailer heater, and that cools as well. I have a barometric damper in the ducting so I can use either the heat pump or the cooler without changing baffles, so I really don't have to do anything else. The stainless steel cooler box is as good as new, and if someone refit it with a new fan and supporting brackets, it could run forever.
In the middle of summer here, the evaporative cooler does not work well. In June & July, it's too hot. Then the rainy season starts and it's too humid. But for spring and fall, the cooler is just the thing. I said for years that the day in spring when the cooler got new pads and started up was the best day of the year.
Evaporative coolers were predominant here for decades. Now I do not believe new houses even offer them as options. My house was built in 1978 and had an evaporative cooler for cooling and a mobile-home type resistive heating device for our mild winters. The water comes from nearby wells, and is quite hard. The first year I lived in the house, I had all that trouble people mentioned with mineral crud clogging the pads in the cooler, and the dust blowing all around the house. I got a whole-house softener before the second summer, and that solved that problem. However the typical painted-metal cooler enclosure needed a LOT of maintenance. Everything rusted. The water sat in the box bottom, which was sealed with a tar-like coating. Every year that needed to be touched up and it was a miserable task. The squirrel cage fan rusted to the point where it flung off blades and I had to replace that. By about 1985 I was frustrated with the amount of work required to maintain the thing. I replaced the original cooler with a stainless-steel model. There was a significant cost differential ($450 vs. $350 for the same-size painted model) but the durability obtained was worth it. That box is still on the roof today. It never leaks, and does not require the tar lining to achieve it. Maintenance was still required, new pads every year, belt replacement every so often, etc. Plus after more than 20 years some of the plastic water distribution tubing inside needed to be replaced. Finally in 2010 the guy who maintained it (after I got too old & fat to climb up on the roof) told me the fan housing and pump brackets were too rusted to be repaired. I haven't used it since. In 1990 I bought a heat pump to replace the trailer heater, and that cools as well. I have a barometric damper in the ducting so I can use either the heat pump or the cooler without changing baffles, so I really don't have to do anything else. The stainless steel cooler box is as good as new, and if someone refit it with a new fan and supporting brackets, it could run forever.
In the middle of summer here, the evaporative cooler does not work well. In June & July, it's too hot. Then the rainy season starts and it's too humid. But for spring and fall, the cooler is just the thing. I said for years that the day in spring when the cooler got new pads and started up was the best day of the year.
strongenough78
Well-known member
2 houses I lived in when I was a kid had very nice swamp coolers. The second house had a huge one, and the fan sat in there sideways. Even on days when it would hit 105 or hotter, it would keep the house very cool, and sometimes downright cold. I've been in other houses where on humid days it wasn't as effective, but this one, humid or dry hot days worked great. I personally love swamp coolers, I do love a/c also, but there's something about a swamp cooler that just feels really good on a hot day compared to a/c. It's hard to explain, but I think a few of you might understand what I'm talking about.
westingman123
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jun 24, 2009
- Messages
- 1,541
It's a fresh thing!
I know what you mean, Vern. I think the difference to me is a/c always seems stale, while a swamp cooled house (or business) feels fresh.
Swamp coolers aren't terribly effective here in high summer, we have humidity like a SOB. The exception, I think, is the Fox theater. It has an enormous swamp-cooled system. The thing looks to be as big as a swimming pool. Even in the dog days of summer, I freeze in that theater.
I'm not a fan of a/c, much prefer to use the attic fan at home.
I know what you mean, Vern. I think the difference to me is a/c always seems stale, while a swamp cooled house (or business) feels fresh.
Swamp coolers aren't terribly effective here in high summer, we have humidity like a SOB. The exception, I think, is the Fox theater. It has an enormous swamp-cooled system. The thing looks to be as big as a swimming pool. Even in the dog days of summer, I freeze in that theater.
I'm not a fan of a/c, much prefer to use the attic fan at home.
