The Cool Wash Temperature
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chetlaham
What about colored sturdy cottons? I think warm ATC would make more sense.
What about colored sturdy cottons? I think warm ATC would make more sense.
Nonsense
William, just have a look at Launderess's link. And when you factor in other variables, water can easily drop to 40*F under worse case scenarios. Not sure where this zeal comes from to prove me wrong when most everything I say can be verified by a few mouse clicks.
Not my pic, but it proves my point and my lived experience-
Just because 40*F isn't the mean or median average across the nation doesn't mean it doesn't happen in some parts of the country. For the sake of discussion these consumers would benefit the most from hot tempering.
William, just have a look at Launderess's link. And when you factor in other variables, water can easily drop to 40*F under worse case scenarios. Not sure where this zeal comes from to prove me wrong when most everything I say can be verified by a few mouse clicks.
Not my pic, but it proves my point and my lived experience-
Just because 40*F isn't the mean or median average across the nation doesn't mean it doesn't happen in some parts of the country. For the sake of discussion these consumers would benefit the most from hot tempering.
Jerome, forget ATC. William and the 3 upvoters who agree with him are saying tap water can't reach 40*F. I am now opening some science books for the first time in my life while denouncing all my past memories. Oh, how could I have let myself be deprived of this beautiful knowledge for so long?
With a 50-60 inlet temps and a 40/60 mixing I think you'd have much need for ATC. The goal of Whirlpool's ATC on the warm setting was to achieve 100*F tub temps by cycling the cold valve on and off. This would compensate for very cold inlet temps or low water heater settings or a combination of both. Warm rinse was targeted at 75*F.
[this post was last edited: 3/5/2025-15:06]
With a 50-60 inlet temps and a 40/60 mixing I think you'd have much need for ATC. The goal of Whirlpool's ATC on the warm setting was to achieve 100*F tub temps by cycling the cold valve on and off. This would compensate for very cold inlet temps or low water heater settings or a combination of both. Warm rinse was targeted at 75*F.
[this post was last edited: 3/5/2025-15:06]
And you think pipes are always buried at a perfect 6-8 feet? You can also draw from water towers, wells, pipes buried on private property. Other variables come into play.
Read the comments as others are experiencing the same thing. I know I have in the past.
40*F is not in the realm of impossible.
Read the comments as others are experiencing the same thing. I know I have in the past.
40*F is not in the realm of impossible.
Right. Now factor in water being delivered from open lakes and reservoirs out in the open, 100,000 gallon unheated water storage tanks, exposed piping at regulating and pumping stations, unheated manholes, ect. The frost line is only part of the equation.
As long as the water keeps flowing it won't freeze.
Nobody is going to waste energy heating millions of gallons of water per day to match temperatures at 30 feet below grade.
As long as the water keeps flowing it won't freeze.
Nobody is going to waste energy heating millions of gallons of water per day to match temperatures at 30 feet below grade.
Water Towers Often Contain Ice
Water towers themselves rely primarily on water movement and are only heated just barely enough so they don't freeze 100% through. Water towers can and do contain solid ice in cold climates. As long as the tower does not become 100% ice, its common, acceptable and economical to have solid chunks of ice in addition to liquid water inside a water tower. Water being added, removed and re-circulated is what prevents the ice from becoming to thick. But it is still present in appreciable amounts chilling newly added water.
Water tower levels rise during periods of low demand, and then fall as demand peaks.
With many people drawing water at once during peak periods water doesn't have enough time to sit around in underground pipes to reach equilibrium with the surrounding earth temperature. So instead water has a tendency to take the temperature of the chilled tower and its exposed piping.
Again, its not economical to heat this water to 50*F or remove all ice where it forms.
science.howstuffworks.com
Water towers themselves rely primarily on water movement and are only heated just barely enough so they don't freeze 100% through. Water towers can and do contain solid ice in cold climates. As long as the tower does not become 100% ice, its common, acceptable and economical to have solid chunks of ice in addition to liquid water inside a water tower. Water being added, removed and re-circulated is what prevents the ice from becoming to thick. But it is still present in appreciable amounts chilling newly added water.
Water tower levels rise during periods of low demand, and then fall as demand peaks.
With many people drawing water at once during peak periods water doesn't have enough time to sit around in underground pipes to reach equilibrium with the surrounding earth temperature. So instead water has a tendency to take the temperature of the chilled tower and its exposed piping.
Again, its not economical to heat this water to 50*F or remove all ice where it forms.
Why don't water towers freeze solid in the winter?
Water towers can be found in just about every town and city in America. Have you ever wondered if they freeze in the winter?
science.howstuffworks.com
Color me surprised and shocked but yes I agree with Chet on this one. And Laundress.
My own tap water will fluctuate from the mid 60s in the summer, to damn near 50F in winter. Sometimes colder when we get our January deep freezes. My own tap water pipe is only 5ft under ground. That’s where it comes in at the basement level.
I’ll use Cold for darks and delicates but yes it’s ATC Cold. And my Electrolux washer will definitely add warm water to a Cold cycle in the winter.
My own tap water will fluctuate from the mid 60s in the summer, to damn near 50F in winter. Sometimes colder when we get our January deep freezes. My own tap water pipe is only 5ft under ground. That’s where it comes in at the basement level.
I’ll use Cold for darks and delicates but yes it’s ATC Cold. And my Electrolux washer will definitely add warm water to a Cold cycle in the winter.
frigidareu
Well-known member
I live just outside of Cleveland Ohio. I just tested my cold tap water. It's 43 degrees F.
chetlaham
I've had to wash sturdy cotton colors on the warm setting during winter because water would be cold nearly freezing. When I use the warm temp at the time, it feels like what cold would be during the summer time.
I've had to wash sturdy cotton colors on the warm setting during winter because water would be cold nearly freezing. When I use the warm temp at the time, it feels like what cold would be during the summer time.
Jerome, I know what you mean! I've had the same experience. Cold is freezing in winter, and with a 30/70 mixing valve and a water heater setting around 140*F, warm is on the cool side during winter. In the summer, warm is near very warm.
That is why I wish I had warm/warm and hot/warm options on my machine. Cold water is to cold in the winter to rinse, while being ideal in the summer months.
Warm in the winter feels like tap cold in the summer.
That is why I wish I had warm/warm and hot/warm options on my machine. Cold water is to cold in the winter to rinse, while being ideal in the summer months.
Warm in the winter feels like tap cold in the summer.
Wash water temperatures at our house
I can’t recall ever setting the temperature control on any washing machine I have for anything but hot, my gas water heater said it about 130° or so, when you run that into a high efficiency front load washer, you get a nice warm wash Works beautifully. The only machine I’ve ever set cooler is the whirlpool resource saver which gives you a maximum temperature of 100°F on the normal cycle when I run this machine with a load of colored things the water is dumped into the 74 lady Kenmore next to it And a load of very dark colored things is washed again in the same water. These are the only two top loading machines I use on a regular basis.
The thing I do love about winter and the cold water. I’m sure it gets down in the low 40s here is how wonderfully it rinses and the clothing comes out smelling so fresh I do find on the front load machine when it gets thoroughly warmed up with the hot water that even the final rinse water isn’t ice cold because the hangover heat, I guess.
If it didn’t cost so much money, I’d probably put in a refrigeration unit to cool the water for rinsing in the summertime. The cold water just breaks down any suds very quickly and rinses it away very effectively.
John L
I can’t recall ever setting the temperature control on any washing machine I have for anything but hot, my gas water heater said it about 130° or so, when you run that into a high efficiency front load washer, you get a nice warm wash Works beautifully. The only machine I’ve ever set cooler is the whirlpool resource saver which gives you a maximum temperature of 100°F on the normal cycle when I run this machine with a load of colored things the water is dumped into the 74 lady Kenmore next to it And a load of very dark colored things is washed again in the same water. These are the only two top loading machines I use on a regular basis.
The thing I do love about winter and the cold water. I’m sure it gets down in the low 40s here is how wonderfully it rinses and the clothing comes out smelling so fresh I do find on the front load machine when it gets thoroughly warmed up with the hot water that even the final rinse water isn’t ice cold because the hangover heat, I guess.
If it didn’t cost so much money, I’d probably put in a refrigeration unit to cool the water for rinsing in the summertime. The cold water just breaks down any suds very quickly and rinses it away very effectively.
John L
niclonnic
Well-known member
At my house...
My old Frigidaire TL had both cold and cool temperature settings, in addition to the standard warm and hot. Whereas the "cold" setting simply added cold water from the tap without any heat, the "cool" option added in a small amount of warm water. Presumably, the latter setting is intended to activate the detergent (pods in particular) and improve the washing performance. However, I generally avoid using cold water for laundry, except when washing delicate items or those with dog urine stains.
My tankless water heater is set to 120°F, which is the highest it can legitimately go. The big downside is that this heater takes as long as a full minute to heat up water, no matter where I am in the house. This was not a big deal with the TL, since it filled continuously. However, this poses a problem with my new GE FL. Since that washer uses significantly less water than the old one, it logically means that hot water is unable to reach the machine in time. And having the laundry room upstairs exacerbates the problem.
To counteract this, I have devised a workaround by running hot water from any faucet until it gets hot enough, such as from my bathroom faucet. Doing this purges the pipes of cold water, thereby allowing hot water to get into the washer much quicker.
In general, I use the following temperatures for my laundry routine:
- Everyday laundry (darks, colors and jeans): Warm
- Bedding (sheets, pillowcases and blankets): Warm
- Towels and whites: Hot
- Heavily soiled items contaminated with bacteria and/or allergens: Extra Hot (I use the Sanitize + Allergen cycle judiciously)
My old Frigidaire TL had both cold and cool temperature settings, in addition to the standard warm and hot. Whereas the "cold" setting simply added cold water from the tap without any heat, the "cool" option added in a small amount of warm water. Presumably, the latter setting is intended to activate the detergent (pods in particular) and improve the washing performance. However, I generally avoid using cold water for laundry, except when washing delicate items or those with dog urine stains.
My tankless water heater is set to 120°F, which is the highest it can legitimately go. The big downside is that this heater takes as long as a full minute to heat up water, no matter where I am in the house. This was not a big deal with the TL, since it filled continuously. However, this poses a problem with my new GE FL. Since that washer uses significantly less water than the old one, it logically means that hot water is unable to reach the machine in time. And having the laundry room upstairs exacerbates the problem.
To counteract this, I have devised a workaround by running hot water from any faucet until it gets hot enough, such as from my bathroom faucet. Doing this purges the pipes of cold water, thereby allowing hot water to get into the washer much quicker.
In general, I use the following temperatures for my laundry routine:
- Everyday laundry (darks, colors and jeans): Warm
- Bedding (sheets, pillowcases and blankets): Warm
- Towels and whites: Hot
- Heavily soiled items contaminated with bacteria and/or allergens: Extra Hot (I use the Sanitize + Allergen cycle judiciously)
Proper wash temps
Reply number 33, hi Nick I would try using the hot setting for everything in that washer and yes, it’s a great idea to run a hot water at a nearby faucet before you start the washer.
I will be surprised if you get much above 100° in the machine on hot in this situation which is plenty hot enough for good cleaning But I wouldn’t bother with the warm setting or the cool setting on that washer and I can’t imagine that even 100° water will be bad for getting dog urine out of clothing. It’s not hot enough to really set things.
John
Reply number 33, hi Nick I would try using the hot setting for everything in that washer and yes, it’s a great idea to run a hot water at a nearby faucet before you start the washer.
I will be surprised if you get much above 100° in the machine on hot in this situation which is plenty hot enough for good cleaning But I wouldn’t bother with the warm setting or the cool setting on that washer and I can’t imagine that even 100° water will be bad for getting dog urine out of clothing. It’s not hot enough to really set things.
John
Hot Fills
I like the way you think! Hot fill are wonderful in front loads, giving a nice warm wash.
I personally prefer a warm rinse in the winter. I think the reason you're getting less suds on winter cold is because the fabric isn't relaxed enough to release the extra carry over water from the wash. Though, in theory, that might be less of an issue because the resource saver forces water through the clothes while allowing them to absorb and then release water each spray cycle.
I wouldn't mind having such a washer, or at least one that used a series of spray rinses instead of a deep rinse. The final two sprays could be warm to make the fabric more comfortable out of the wash and to speed up drying. Spray rinsing would simplify top load washers a good deal and save a lot of energy in relation to warm rinsing.
I like the way you think! Hot fill are wonderful in front loads, giving a nice warm wash.
I personally prefer a warm rinse in the winter. I think the reason you're getting less suds on winter cold is because the fabric isn't relaxed enough to release the extra carry over water from the wash. Though, in theory, that might be less of an issue because the resource saver forces water through the clothes while allowing them to absorb and then release water each spray cycle.
I wouldn't mind having such a washer, or at least one that used a series of spray rinses instead of a deep rinse. The final two sprays could be warm to make the fabric more comfortable out of the wash and to speed up drying. Spray rinsing would simplify top load washers a good deal and save a lot of energy in relation to warm rinsing.
panasonicvac
Well-known member
I'm sure I've said this before but I mainly use warm wash for colors (hot if it's really dirty) and hot for whites, I rarely use cool or cold wash. The only times I'd use cold wash is whenever I'd wash out vacuum bags or filters, I've actually noticed a difference and concluded that cold wash is better for that situation. My Kenmore has a cold and warm rinse setting, I can't notice the difference between the two so I just stick with cold rinse.
I’ll just note that depending on the model, when Hot is selected for front loaders, it’s not uncommon to get a cold or warm fill at first. And then its internal heater takes it the rest of the way. Often higher than 100F. Just fyi.
My tap water comes from Lake Michigan which is currently around 34F. My tap water is in the 40s. I don't know why some folks need to be so mean...
