Todays Euro 60°C is a joke

[mrboilwash]

Whenever I touched the glass of a vintage Euro FL running a 60°C programe, I burnt my fingers.
Unfortunately that is not the case anymore thanks to the fact that 60° with extended washtime is the standard for our energy label and I suspect just decreasing water levels must have reached possible limits a long time ago. So I think manufactures had to drop the temperature to get the desired A-rated label.
When I touch the glass of my newer Miele or any other new machine it only feels like about 50°C but I don`t have a thermometer so I can only guess.
I also wonder why there is a need for those new 60°C Hygiene programes If the standard programes really were the temperatures they pretend to be.
Could someone with a thermometer please measure and post the results ?

 

[askomiele]

My washer still heats up at the correct temperature... and I'm not really convinced that euromachines should trick with their temperatures. Even if they should it's illegal. Because then their monitoringsystem is wrong controlled and the law of International Systems of Units (here in Belgium very strong controlled) says than with every thermostatic controll system should measure exactly the same as any other thermometer used within it.

 

[dj-gabriele]

Yes, if a machine gives a different temperature than the one advertised or shown that would be fraud, they can only vary within a certain tolerance that usually is around plus or minus 2°C.
If we were going to have hot/warm/cold, well... things would have gone as you said. Maybe that's just because of better insulating glass.

 

[mrboilwash]

I could see that the setpoint is exactly at 37°C for the 40°C programes, when I had a service man check the machine because of an other issue. A difference of 3°C is still kind of acceptable to me but again I don`t think modern A-rated machines even reach 57°C.

 

[vivalalavatrice]

oh... what a strange...

If the temperature is electronic controlled (by a bidirectional controlknob i.e. or by a display) you wouldn't be never able to check at how many degrees your machine is working, apart from putting a thermometer touching the water...but how?

Otherwise in a mechanical controlled machine (so monorirectional controlknob for temperatures settting) the setable temperature is set by putting the dial onto the desired dgrees... if you turn back and forth again the knob until the 'tic' there it is led the temperature your machine's working...

If you suspect of a different temperature from that one you set then it maybe some tricks with the thermostate...which generally is represented by a bulb applied onto the outertub or directly onto the heating element to be controlled.

 

[rolls_rapide]

Aha! You may be on to something...

Didn't the Hoover 'New Wave' wash at 82 degrees Celsius (or similar), despite the fact the Whites label on the machine read 95 deg ? Hoover maintained that advances in detergents allowed the lower temperature.

Similarly, I thought some of the Hotpoints had 90 degree Whites programmes, rather than the usual 95 deg.

 

[newwave1]

Rolls,
Both the older hotpoints which i've had, & The newwave operated at 85degrees on whites 95. You could reset the newwave to 95 by going through the temperatures with the economy button back to 95!

On the later hotpoint aquarius models the low energy models, washed at 10degrees less on every programme unless you pressed "heavy soil!" which made it wash at standard temperatures.

Awesome machines!

Darren

 

[MrX]

60C is not hot enough to burn your hand if you touch the glass on the door. It's as hot as a medium radiator. It's not hot enough to burn you.

If your old machine was that hot when set at 60C, there was something wrong with its thermostat!

 

[MrX]

Also, the majority of machines have 2 layers on the door thesedays. The door itself is glass, but there's a clear plastic window on the other side of that. This prevents kids from being burnt when the machine's running a 75-95C wash and also reduces noise.

Oddly enough Miele was one of the few machines not to have this.

 

[mrboilwash]

Perhaps "burn" is the wrong word but I think 60°C should be at least too hot to touch for a longer time.
Can`t believe all vintage washers I know of had broken thermostats.
For instance the new Miele W4446 WPS which is sold in the UK uses 1,02 kWh for a 6kg EN 60456 test programe (at 60°C)
but it uses 1,40 kWh for a 6 kg 60°C "Cotton Hygiene" programe.
Quite a difference, isnt`t it ? I doubt this is only due to the longer temperature holding time.
But again I can only guess and suppose because I don`t have a thermometer to check.

 

[askomiele]

Longer kept on temp

Well that's one of the reasons. But the waterlevel is also increased, so more water to heat up, and that combined with a longer 'pure' washtime (so with the water on temperature, just keeping water on temperature), makes the energy consumption increasing.