What do you know about century-old Ruud water haaters?

[volvoguy87]

Sorry about not having been here much over the past few months, but I've been rather sick.

I've finally achieved a major goal. I now own an antique Ruud Instantaneous Automatic Water Heater. Mine is the No. 4 version and is probably from the 1920s. It was in use until recently.

I will post pics once it is out of my truck.

I plan on hooking this up as a pre-heater feeding my regular water heater (the regular water heater is just a bit too small for my needs). Is this the most sensible thing? No! Am I going to do it anyway? Absolutely! And yes, it is safe. I've been doing my reading and research, but I'd like to know if anyone here has ever had experience with one of these cast iron monsters and might have some helpful advice.

Dave

 

[launderess]

Head Over To One Of The Plumber's Forums

You can easily find them by searching the Internet using keywords that describe your older Rudd unit. Those guys see lots of these things in various states some still in use others hauled out for scrap. Then there are posts from those that have them in their homes and want to keep them working.

Hope you are feeling better and good to see you posting again.

L.

 

[circlew]

Hey Dave,

Best wishes with your new Ruud water heater.

Sorry to hear you haven't been feeling well - hadn't seen you on for a while, but just figured you were busy with your house. Hope you're doing lots better now.

 

[volvoguy87]

A pic.

Pardon the poor quality, but it was 11:00 at night.

 

[volvoguy87]

A shot for scale.

Me with my water heater to establish scale.

 

[rp2813]

A friend of mine had an ancient instantaneous water heater in his house.  I don't know if something needed tweaking or what, but with the tap opened fully, it would put out water that was beyond scalding hot.  It was difficult to get the water regulated just right in order to wash dishes. 

 

His house was around 100 years old and had only a bathtub; no shower, but even if there had been a shower I'd not have been inclined to use it.

 

I think you're wise not to use yours as the primary source for hot water.

 

 

 

[stan]

Never thought

of a water heater being anything to look at, but that almost looks like a work of art!

 

[launderess]

As one understands those Rudd instant water heaters(and one assumes others of the same era) were designed to put out "HOT" water, lots of the stuff. However they also were designed when baths were more popular than showers and when housecleaning or work involved filling buckets and tubs including many early washing machines. That is one fills whatever you need with hot water then add cold to temper. Or adjust hot and cold taps as best one could to get things where they needed.

Dishes would have been done by filling a sink with hot water then adding cold to temper enough not to burn one's hands.

From my bookmarks:

http://www.post-gazette.com/life/ho...per-era-is-still-cooking/stories/200607290093

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/recently-discovered-vintage-water-heaters-reveal-time-honored-quality-and-durability-58722187.html

 

[mattl]

Dishes would have been done by filling a sink with hot water

<a name="start_51701.741266">                 then adding cold to temper enough not to burn one's hands. </a>

 

 

Funny, that is what I do to this day.  I keep my water at about 150, I have a large cast iron kitchen sink and it keeps the water hot for quite a while.  Usually let heavily soiled pots soak for a bit in hot, then temper to wash.

 

Anyway, quite an interesting water heater.  How does it work?  Is there a coil of tubing sitting over the burner?

 

[launderess]

When you consider most house cleaning from laundry to dishes was being done with soap when those Rudd heaters came on the scene, you begin to understand the need for *hot* water, and lots of it.

As for how the Rudd worked, yes basically you had a set of copper coils over a burner. When hot water was called for the burners would send flames shooting up a good part of the coils heating cold water as it passed through. Am guessing the temperature of water could be controlled to an extent by the height of flame.

 

[tolivac]

This looks like an early Demand type water heater!!!NEAT!!That is a beauty to behold-If you should have to replace it-don't scrap it!Leave it for display!.Like the heating coils in the unit!

 

[arbilab]

Grandma had such a device, or nearly so. Hers was a few wider coils. Sorta like the difference between Calrod and Corox. It also had a small tank so 'some' hot water could be stored.

By the time I came along her coal boiler had been modified to natgas with a *gasp* thermostat instead of grandpa getting up an hour early to shovel coal. This was a thoroughly modern house in 1920 Pittsburgh. FOUR--countem--FOUR fuses! PUSHBUTTON light switches! The fridge had a separate motor, compressor, belt and pulleys. I remember evacuating the house the afternoon it caught fire from a small ammonia leak. The whole damn house could have burned down, or asphyxiated the lot of us, but we by gawd had ozone. Those were the days. [googoo eyes]

 

[athanasius80]

That Ruud is a thing of beauty. Enjoy it!

 

[volvoguy87]

Function.

There is a variable gas valve which is controlled by the rate of water flowing into the heater. The faster the flow, the more the gas valve opens. I don't recall the output of a No. 4's burner, but I think it's somewhere between 200,000 and 250,000 BTUs. There is a 6" flue for the exhaust and a standing pilot. I hope the pilot keeps the water in the coils warm.

These were set to 150 degrees from the factory and, from what I have read, really cannot be adjusted much. The mechanically actuated system can have a temperature swing of about 15 degrees on either side of 150, depending on conditions. As I wrote at the top, I plan on using this as a pre-heater, feeding hot water into my conventional tank-style water heater. I hope the tank heater will only fire up to compensate for standby losses, to pick up the slack when the Ruud's capacity is exceeded, and to keep the recirculating loop warm (I am putting in a circulating water loop around the basement so that it will take less time to get hot water to the sinks and showers upstairs). I also want to install a thermostatic mixing valves after the conventional water heater and circulated loop to mix cold water into the flow to temper the hot water down to about 120 degrees. I want the sinks and showers to have a steady 120 to avoid scalding, and I think the thermostatic mixing valve will reduce temperature variations at the faucets. I intend to plumb the whole water heating system so I can operate a few valves and isolate either water heater for maintenance and repair of one but leave the other in service so the house will still have some hot water.

I do intend to install an un-tempered branch coming off of the Ruud to supply liquid fire to my laundry room. When I want to wash in hot, I want to wash in HOT!

The Ruud is tankless, instant, and everything that seems to be the latest craze in water heaters. It's just 90 years old, and I am looking forward to getting better acquainted with it.
Dave

 

[gansky1]

That is super cool, Dave, what a great piece of history. 

 

There is ( or was) one of these in the window of an old plumbing shop downtown, I'll have to look next time I drive by to see if it's still there.  Funny, I've always thought it would be interesting to stop in there and look around, see what other vintage treasures they might still have, but have never done it.  

 

 

 

[vacosaurus]

Thumbs up on your Ruud instantanious. I had a Sands instantanious water heater manufactured here in Cleveland that my fathers family bought new in 1930 and we used it till 2004. I finally had to replace it due to the lack of replacement parts I felt were needed to keep it in safe operating condition. I replaced it with a (new ) 1955 Ruud Monel hot water tank that my now 90 year old aunt bought new and gave me. The 1955 Ruud looks like a conventional modern water heater but the water tank inside is made of Monel metal which is kind of like a stainless steel. She was afraid it was going to leak because of it's age because the neighbors modern glass lined tank sprung a leak. I tried to explain to her the monel tank would probably never leak but she replaced it anyway. I happily took it and put it back to work replacing my Sands instantanious. Anyway regarding your Ruud I do not understand why you would want to use it to pre heat water going into a modern tank. That Ruud will make all the hot water you need intantly if it operates correctly. I would check to see if that is even safe to hook two together like that . I was looking at the diagram of the controls that Launderess posted and the controls look like the ones that were on my Sands heater. The control labeled (automatic water valve) has a piston in it that moves with water pressure when you turn on the hot water which in turns activates the gas valve. The more you open the hot water the more it opens the gas valve. The water tempature should regulate evenly no matter what volume of water is used. I would say if your mechanically inclined to familiarize how all the controls work and sevice all the controls to make sure they operate correctly after all they are almost 100 years old. If it was mine and everything checked out I would use it. The big reason I replaced mine was there was a horseshoe shaped bi - mettalic part that went bad and this part would shut the main gas down if the pilot went out. Good luck Bill,

 

[vacosaurus]

Just wanted to add I seen an instantanious heater when I was a boy I think it was a Ruud real fancy like yours. It had the scrolly designs and cast into the designs it mentioned the St. Louis exposition and a year it might have been 1904. That heater was still being used in the early 1970's. They really don't make em like they used too. Bill

 

[maytagbear]

Don't want to rain on your parade,

but as the owner of a multifamily structure, you would do well to run this past your insurance agent. It is possibly safer than most of today's water heaters, but in the case of an incident, you might not be covered.

It is an interesting object, Dave!

Lawrence/Maytagbear

 

[launderess]

Read somewhere on another website about these Rudd instant water heaters where two were being used in a commercial building to supply a 1,000 gallon hot water tank. So running these units as a sidebar system is not totally out of the question.

As noted one of the main reasons homeowners get shot of these beasts is lack of spare parts and or knowledgeable servicemen. It is interesting even far back as 1901 when these units were being advertised it mentions how sanitary they were. This was because unlike tanked units that were "never empty" thus could (and often did) have all sort of muck festering at the bottom of tank, Rudd's instant hot water units used a continuous flow of clean water.

Rudd units were designed to take 40F water to 140F or 150F (cannot remember).