classiccaprice
Well-known member
Look at my newest project. I bought it yesterday from a local thrift shop for $1
It's a 1952 Northern Electric 7H6 Gallup Telephone...
It's a 1952 Northern Electric 7H6 Gallup Telephone...
where do I begin? Broken telephone
- Thread starter classiccaprice
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classiccaprice
Well-known member
Here are the problems
Look at this case...
Look at this case...
classiccaprice
Well-known member
the back
classiccaprice
Well-known member
Inside top, note the broken screw mounts
polkanut
Well-known member
I think you should have left that thing on the shelf. Looks like it was dropped from 25 story building.
classiccaprice
Well-known member
I did hook this thing up and with a little jiggling of the cord was able to get a dial tone. I was unable to get the dial to work or the bell to ring. I think I may have to rewire the entire thing. I've never done that before, but there is a first time for everything. Thankfully the wiring diagram was included.... So how do I help this poor broken thing?
What do you recommend for patching the holes/cracks?
What kind of replacement wire is best?
Any advice would be most appreciated!
I also will add my 302 up here, it was my great grandmothers, my father tried to help me restore it about 10 years ago..... he took a dremmil tool to the front... AH! Any suggestions to make that one look better?
What do you recommend for patching the holes/cracks?
What kind of replacement wire is best?
Any advice would be most appreciated!
I also will add my 302 up here, it was my great grandmothers, my father tried to help me restore it about 10 years ago..... he took a dremmil tool to the front... AH! Any suggestions to make that one look better?
classiccaprice
Well-known member
Here's the 302...
This one works well... Those cracks in the front always did bother me. The streaks/gouges were result of the formentioned dremel too, though dad did his best to smooth out his goof, you can still see it. There is no cover on the dial and the bell doesn't work, but the rest is fine.
This one works well... Those cracks in the front always did bother me. The streaks/gouges were result of the formentioned dremel too, though dad did his best to smooth out his goof, you can still see it. There is no cover on the dial and the bell doesn't work, but the rest is fine.
classiccaprice
Well-known member
Takes a lickin, keeps on tickin... well sort of...
I think the guts at least are still salvageable on the N.E., I enjoy a good challenge, and I figure that it is definately a good challenge.
I think the guts at least are still salvageable on the N.E., I enjoy a good challenge, and I figure that it is definately a good challenge.
Epoxy / Bondo?
You can try using some sort of tape applied to the inside so it follows the shape of the body and then some Bondo or 2-part epoxy applied on top of the tape, troweled even with the outer surface of the body. After it dries, you'll have to sand it smooth (when in doubt, use a higher number sand paper). Wet sanding may be good too. When its all done, you can paint the body high-gloss black. I wouldn't worry about damaging the NE body too much. Unless you can patch it up, it would likely be suitable only for parts.
As for your 302, you must do 2 things.
First: NEVER let your dad near old stuff again! He can break all the new stuff from Wal Mart he wants, just leave the old stuff alone!
Second: try wet-sanding the body with progressively higher-number sandpaper BY HAND! By hand is important because the random strokes of your hand will not leave the streaks of a machine. You can also try using automotive rubbing compound then automotive polishing compound, both available at your local autoparts store.
Tackle the Northern Electric phone first. If you are successful in patching and painting it, you might try the same on the WE-302. Just be sure to put some good use on the NE phone first to make sure it sticks. You may need to adhere some nylon window screen material across the back side of the holes and cracks you are patching to give the epoxy material a better surface to which it can stick.
Good luck,
Dave
You can try using some sort of tape applied to the inside so it follows the shape of the body and then some Bondo or 2-part epoxy applied on top of the tape, troweled even with the outer surface of the body. After it dries, you'll have to sand it smooth (when in doubt, use a higher number sand paper). Wet sanding may be good too. When its all done, you can paint the body high-gloss black. I wouldn't worry about damaging the NE body too much. Unless you can patch it up, it would likely be suitable only for parts.
As for your 302, you must do 2 things.
First: NEVER let your dad near old stuff again! He can break all the new stuff from Wal Mart he wants, just leave the old stuff alone!
Second: try wet-sanding the body with progressively higher-number sandpaper BY HAND! By hand is important because the random strokes of your hand will not leave the streaks of a machine. You can also try using automotive rubbing compound then automotive polishing compound, both available at your local autoparts store.
Tackle the Northern Electric phone first. If you are successful in patching and painting it, you might try the same on the WE-302. Just be sure to put some good use on the NE phone first to make sure it sticks. You may need to adhere some nylon window screen material across the back side of the holes and cracks you are patching to give the epoxy material a better surface to which it can stick.
Good luck,
Dave
classiccaprice
Well-known member
Thanks Dave,
I'll keep the board posted on the results of my work. Any other suggestions, from anyone?
I'll keep the board posted on the results of my work. Any other suggestions, from anyone?
If the patching fails on the NE phone I think you can probably find a replacement case on line. If you only paid $1 for it I suspect the price of a replacement case would still keep your costs for this phone well below its value on the collector market.
The dial fingerwheel on your 302 is secured differently from the Western Electric 302's, 202's and 500's I own or have seen, and the fingerstop is located further down than on a WE so I think your "302" phone was not manufactured by WE. Or it has been fitted with a dial mechanism from a different manufacturer, if that's possible. It would be difficult to advise on how to get your 302 to ring since the wiring and network blocks are probably not the same as on a WE 302. If there's no obvious evidence of who the manufacturer is, you might try pulling the receiver and transmitter elements to see if they offer any clues if the handset itself doesn't have the name of the manufacturer embossed in it like the WE handsets have always had. The handset cord also looks different from any of the types I've seen used on WE phones. There are sites out there with old phone information and parts so you might see if there are any pix of your "302" interior posted somewhere and you can compare the wiring.
I had really good luck cleaning up my 500 model's bakelite handset with just plain old cheap toothpaste and was amazed at the results. This will only diminish the superficial problems with the overall finish of your handset and case, and you'll still have the marring from what your dad did, but at least it will shine it up nicely until you pursue more serious restorative measures. Replacement cases for these phones are also probably available on line if necessary. If you decide to try your luck with a handy tube of toothpaste, just rub (somewhat vigorously) the toothpaste in until it takes on a dark cast, wipe off with a damp cloth and then buff with a soft dry cloth. Same method would work with car polish or rubbing compound. I only used toothpaste on my 500's handset, not the case. The cases are generally made from some type of plastic and I was afraid the toothpaste would scratch the case so used Maguire's liquid car polish and it made the finish like new again.
The dial fingerwheel on your 302 is secured differently from the Western Electric 302's, 202's and 500's I own or have seen, and the fingerstop is located further down than on a WE so I think your "302" phone was not manufactured by WE. Or it has been fitted with a dial mechanism from a different manufacturer, if that's possible. It would be difficult to advise on how to get your 302 to ring since the wiring and network blocks are probably not the same as on a WE 302. If there's no obvious evidence of who the manufacturer is, you might try pulling the receiver and transmitter elements to see if they offer any clues if the handset itself doesn't have the name of the manufacturer embossed in it like the WE handsets have always had. The handset cord also looks different from any of the types I've seen used on WE phones. There are sites out there with old phone information and parts so you might see if there are any pix of your "302" interior posted somewhere and you can compare the wiring.
I had really good luck cleaning up my 500 model's bakelite handset with just plain old cheap toothpaste and was amazed at the results. This will only diminish the superficial problems with the overall finish of your handset and case, and you'll still have the marring from what your dad did, but at least it will shine it up nicely until you pursue more serious restorative measures. Replacement cases for these phones are also probably available on line if necessary. If you decide to try your luck with a handy tube of toothpaste, just rub (somewhat vigorously) the toothpaste in until it takes on a dark cast, wipe off with a damp cloth and then buff with a soft dry cloth. Same method would work with car polish or rubbing compound. I only used toothpaste on my 500's handset, not the case. The cases are generally made from some type of plastic and I was afraid the toothpaste would scratch the case so used Maguire's liquid car polish and it made the finish like new again.
Toothpaste polishing.
Toothpaste is a great polish because it contains abrasive material. Rubbing compound (removes scratches) and polishing compound (polishes a smooth surface to a shine) also contain abrasives. I like rubbing and polishing compounds because you can have reasonably good control over what the outcome is, and they don't smell like toothpaste. Toothpaste is great for infrequent use because, although it's pricey, it's always around.
There's more than one way to skin a cat,
Dave
P.S. Please don't skin any cats, they're just too cute to abuse for the sake of a saying.
Toothpaste is a great polish because it contains abrasive material. Rubbing compound (removes scratches) and polishing compound (polishes a smooth surface to a shine) also contain abrasives. I like rubbing and polishing compounds because you can have reasonably good control over what the outcome is, and they don't smell like toothpaste. Toothpaste is great for infrequent use because, although it's pricey, it's always around.
There's more than one way to skin a cat,
Dave
P.S. Please don't skin any cats, they're just too cute to abuse for the sake of a saying.
classiccaprice
Well-known member
The 302?
Ok after reading Ralph's thread, I went back and looked at the 302. The handset says that it is Bell System manufactured by Western Electric Company F1, however I was unable to find any identification on the body (inside or out). Is this a Frankenphone? I'm on the wrong computer the computer, but I'll post a picture of said guts tomorrow, pehraps someone can help me put these wires in the right spot.
The story I was told was that: the phone was rented from the phone company, however when she tried to trade it in during the 70's they said the repairman said that they were trying to get rid of that model, because of it's age. The Bell was disconnected (all wires are in the phone, I just haven't figured out which goes to what screw and I didn't want to put anything in the wrong place) and was put on the line as a secret extention.
Or: there is a Prudential Insurance Company sticker on the bottom of the phone. My grandfather worked for them, pehaps the story was incorrect and it was a company phone that was eliminated.
Or: perhaps something else... hmm... any ideas?
Ok after reading Ralph's thread, I went back and looked at the 302. The handset says that it is Bell System manufactured by Western Electric Company F1, however I was unable to find any identification on the body (inside or out). Is this a Frankenphone? I'm on the wrong computer the computer, but I'll post a picture of said guts tomorrow, pehraps someone can help me put these wires in the right spot.
The story I was told was that: the phone was rented from the phone company, however when she tried to trade it in during the 70's they said the repairman said that they were trying to get rid of that model, because of it's age. The Bell was disconnected (all wires are in the phone, I just haven't figured out which goes to what screw and I didn't want to put anything in the wrong place) and was put on the line as a secret extention.
Or: there is a Prudential Insurance Company sticker on the bottom of the phone. My grandfather worked for them, pehaps the story was incorrect and it was a company phone that was eliminated.
Or: perhaps something else... hmm... any ideas?
classiccaprice
Well-known member
dirty 302? Guts
So if it isn't WE, who is it?
You'll notice the three wires to the bell at the upper right and three screws near the bells. Which goes where?
So if it isn't WE, who is it?
You'll notice the three wires to the bell at the upper right and three screws near the bells. Which goes where?
Will, that looks like a WE 302 to me, but it sure seems to have been messed with. They only had to disconnect one of the ringer wires to keep it from ringing. I'll take one of mine apart when I get a chance to pull one out and see what's up with the ringer wires. I'm pretty sure I have one that was set up to ring. What are the dates on the various components of your phone? I can't make them out from the picture.
Also, I wouldn't be surprised if that phone provides dial tone and rings fine, dirt and all, once you have the wires connected correctly.
Ralph
Also, I wouldn't be surprised if that phone provides dial tone and rings fine, dirt and all, once you have the wires connected correctly.
Ralph
Will, that doesn't look like a WE dial. I checked my WE 302 and the dial is not the same and it has only two leads, a red and a black from the ringer. The red terminates on L1 and the black on the GND. It appears the line cord on your phone is connected to the correct terminals. The red ringer lead should be on the same terminal as the red line cord lead. Your handset cord doesn't appear to be WE. The leads are a heavier gauge on yours and their colors are different. Not sure if you will get a dial tone on your set with the above configuration. That third taped off lead goes somewhere else besides the ringer.
classiccaprice
Well-known member
What can I say... I come from a family of Jerry-riggers...
Thanks Ralph,
If I recall correctly, Dad replaced the phone cord with something from the hardware store.... It was back when the internet was still new and I had no clue where to to get a cloth cord for a telephone. The origional was shot beyond repair. The phone does dial and works just fine. The sound is fine and the conversation is clear on both ends. It just doesn't ring.
The date on the phone is March of 1945.
The dial is a mystery to me. It was done sometime prior to my great-grandmother's death in the mid 80s, mom and dad got the phone then and it sat in the garauge for about 10-13 years, just waiting to be used again. Judging by the wear on it, the dial has been on the phone, or at least in use, for a long time. Does anyone know what it came off of?
I connected the grey wire to the grd. The red is already hooked up, it's the one on L1 that is on the right side of the bell in the photograph. However the bell just doesn't work.
The other two wires are a mystery. I can follow them until they are under the magnitos that ring the bell, however that is where they seem to end. They are connected to something and I don't see any other wires that aren't accounted for.
Any other ideas?
Thanks Ralph,
If I recall correctly, Dad replaced the phone cord with something from the hardware store.... It was back when the internet was still new and I had no clue where to to get a cloth cord for a telephone. The origional was shot beyond repair. The phone does dial and works just fine. The sound is fine and the conversation is clear on both ends. It just doesn't ring.
The date on the phone is March of 1945.
The dial is a mystery to me. It was done sometime prior to my great-grandmother's death in the mid 80s, mom and dad got the phone then and it sat in the garauge for about 10-13 years, just waiting to be used again. Judging by the wear on it, the dial has been on the phone, or at least in use, for a long time. Does anyone know what it came off of?
I connected the grey wire to the grd. The red is already hooked up, it's the one on L1 that is on the right side of the bell in the photograph. However the bell just doesn't work.
The other two wires are a mystery. I can follow them until they are under the magnitos that ring the bell, however that is where they seem to end. They are connected to something and I don't see any other wires that aren't accounted for.
Any other ideas?
Let me take another look at mine. I suspect your problem may have to do with those other leads that are taped off.
And I can relate to jerry-rigging. My dad did plenty of that in his day and it has worn off on me to a certain degree!
Maybe that IS a WE dial. It just looks different from the type I'm used to seeing on the 202 and 302 models.
And I can relate to jerry-rigging. My dad did plenty of that in his day and it has worn off on me to a certain degree!
Maybe that IS a WE dial. It just looks different from the type I'm used to seeing on the 202 and 302 models.
OK, I'm at a loss here. The two-toned and light colored leads that are taped off are a mystery to me. I don't see anything like them on my phone. The only two-tone wire on my phone connects to L1 and to a terminal on the dial, and that appears to be the same on your phone. What the extra taped-off one does I don't know.
You might need to check out some web sites for assistance on this. The "Bell System Memorial" is a good one that has schematics that may help out. Dennis at vintagerotaryphones.com may also be able to suggest an arrangement that will get your phone ringing, but he deals mainly with 500 models.
Sorry I couldn't be of more help. Your best bet is to get your hands on another 302 and match things up, as sometimes a photograph doesn't capture everything that's hidden under the components.
You might need to check out some web sites for assistance on this. The "Bell System Memorial" is a good one that has schematics that may help out. Dennis at vintagerotaryphones.com may also be able to suggest an arrangement that will get your phone ringing, but he deals mainly with 500 models.
Sorry I couldn't be of more help. Your best bet is to get your hands on another 302 and match things up, as sometimes a photograph doesn't capture everything that's hidden under the components.
