Dishwashers losing popularity in US Homes???

Automatic Washer - The world's coolest Washing Machines, Dryers and Dishwashers

Help Support :

I was just thinking about this the other day before I saw the thread. I would have a harder time buying a brand new dishwasher. Not only I've seen some unimpressive results but also hearing quite a bit of problems the new machines have been getting. Despite that, I still don't think I could live in a home without one. I definitely don't love doing dishes as much as laundry, I'm just a person that would rather do a quick few seconds of rinsing dishes out and loading them in the dishwasher that gets used about twice a week or so. But whenever I do run it, I'd rather do it at night so that the next day when I unload, the dishes would already be dry to put away. No need to spend the extra time scrubbing and drying by hand. And I don't care how long the cycles go for or how much water they use just as long as they get them clean and last for quite a while. It just seems that my options nowadays are limited, I actually may as well look into the used market for a nice old one especially at killer deals.
 
I told you, quiet dishwashers are a scam. They use puny pumps and tiny sprays. They're weak.

And more expensive.

The Whirlpool Power Clean Filter Module was not only the best cleaning and most energy efficient dishwasher ever created, but it was also amongst the cheapest often being available in the low hundreds toward the last decade of production. A low end electronic power clean cost the same as a high end dura wash.




1756501596562.png

And a heck of a lot cheaper than the pretend-to-clean tall tubs they were pushing:

1756502213629.png



If Whirlpool ditched the electronic control and failure prone membrane that price would have dipped even lower in comparison to the TOL dura wash. An absolute BOL Power Clean with no rinse aid dispenser, open detergent cup, long timed main wash, vinyl coated racks, single dial and heated dry rocker switch would have been competing with GE price wise and still out-cleaned the majority of machines ever made.

Which takes me to the point. There is no profit in that which does its job to perfection. The idea is offering goods that keep looking better, that keep feeling better, that offer a solution to an imagined or created problem but never actually addresses original intent head on in full. Leave the customer feel partially disappointed so they keep coming back for that which looks ever more satisfying but will never fulfill the original need. It is all by design to keep people buying and spending.

The Whirlpool Power Clean Filter Module is so perfected it is a timeless classic. There is little that could make it any better With time the Power Clean would only get cheaper. And with a slight seal and motor bearing improvement coupled with a metal timer a Power Clean could last 30 years.
 
And more expensive.

The Whirlpool Power Clean Filter Module was not only the best cleaning and most energy efficient dishwasher ever created, but it was also amongst the cheapest often being available in the low hundreds toward the last decade of production. A low end electronic power clean cost the same as a high end dura wash.




View attachment 318468

And a heck of a lot cheaper than the pretend-to-clean tall tubs they were pushing:

View attachment 318469



If Whirlpool ditched the electronic control and failure prone membrane that price would have dipped even lower in comparison to the TOL dura wash. An absolute BOL Power Clean with no rinse aid dispenser, open detergent cup, long timed main wash, vinyl coated racks, single dial and heated dry rocker switch would have been competing with GE price wise and still out-cleaned the majority of machines ever made.

Which takes me to the point. There is no profit in that which does its job to perfection. The idea is offering goods that keep looking better, that keep feeling better, that offer a solution to an imagined or created problem but never actually addresses original intent head on in full. Leave the customer feel partially disappointed so they keep coming back for that which looks ever more satisfying but will never fulfill the original need. It is all by design to keep people buying and spending.
And as I've always believed, Superficiality is a human trait and a weakness as well.
It's been drummed into society's heads for ages.
Pretty and sexy sells, boring doesn't.
 
Because their married to their cellphones and virtual reality. 😦

A little bit of that exists but there's sort of a gender war going on at the moment. A lot of men are fed up with the current crop of selfish demanding females and don't want to get shafted in a divorce (or with child support) so they're following the MGTOW trend. As far as having kids, most are barely getting by financially with high rent, high mortages and the high cost of living due to inflation. Affording kids is out of the question.
 
A little bit of that exists but there's sort of a gender war going on at the moment. A lot of men are fed up with the current crop of selfish demanding females and don't want to get shafted in a divorce (or with child support) so they're following the MGTOW trend. As far as having kids, most are barely getting by financially with high rent, high mortages and the high cost of living due to inflation. Affording kids is out of the question.
I'll agree to that!
You can blame it on the conditioning and manipulation of society by the elites.
They like to be disruptive and watch the masses struggle.
It gives them something to talk about over drinks and their fabulous dinner parties.
 
...or how much water they use just as long as they get them clean and last for quite a while. It just seems that my options nowadays are limited, I actually may as well look into the used market for a nice old one especially at killer deals.


I think many people feel the same way on this. The issue wasn't the old dishwashers used 13.5 gallons of water, it was that many of them simply did not clean one reason or another, forcing pre-rinsing. Pre-rinsing is what wastes water and energy. To the point that whether or not a dishwasher uses 1.5 gallons or 13.5 gallons of water becomes irrelevant.

That changed with the Power Clean Filter Module, various Maytag Jet-Cleans and latter model Kitchen-Aids. These machines are what saved monumental amounts of water and energy because they let the user load without any pre-rinsing and little pre-treating and limited pre-scrubbing.


All was well with these 3 machines, until energy regs targeted the symptoms and not the actual problem. Energy regs instead of looking at performance and forcing improvements to existing designs like GE adding a fine filter to its BOL machines, energy regulations targeted water usage which essentially required all dishwashers to be engineered with shallow sumps, small pumps, complex electronics and low volume water distribution. This absolutely wrecked any ability to engineer realistic soil removal, soil handling, and soil flush away. Further the lack of water itself hinders grease / muck carry away and impairs detergent rinsing.

The reduced cleaning performance now forces various levels of pre-rinsing in all new dishwashers completely doing away with any water and energy savings that once existed.
 
It take a few moments for me to pre-rinse some stuck-on bits from the dishes.
I use the hot water for that, and when I start the DW, it get its hot water faster, meaning less heating element time.
 
A little bit of that exists but there's sort of a gender war going on at the moment. A lot of men are fed up with the current crop of selfish demanding females and don't want to get shafted in a divorce (or with child support) so they're following the MGTOW trend. As far as having kids, most are barely getting by financially with high rent, high mortages and the high cost of living due to inflation. Affording kids is out of the question.

Personally I think the education system plays a massive role in this and society's ills in general. Public education is based on two very antiquated dogmas: 1) A one size fits all standard. 2) reward and punishment based motivational compliance. Worsened by the fact no child has the option of opting out or changing schools that hold a different philosophy.

Nature is very different however. Every kid matures at a different rate, and girls especially on average mature two years faster than boys. Maturity dictates success or failure wherever the bar is set. The end result is that girls are as a whole are predominantly rewarded for their maturity, while boys as a whole are predominantly punished for their immaturity. Perpetual rewarding of easily accomplished expectations leads to an elevated sense of self worth, while perpetually punishing expectations without the learned skills or maturity to execute them successfully leads to low self esteem, depression, anger, defiance and resentment.


The outcome these two misguided dogmas has documented evidence everywhere. The majority of bad grades, suspensions, punitive measures, special education services, ect in schools are boys. The incarceration rates, life expectancy, mental illness statistics, poor social views, ect are worse for men.


This does not mean boy are inferior to girls, rather that boys hit their cognitive maturity two years latter and nothing more or less than that. And that schools are punishing human nature at no fault of their own.


Children are very innocent minds. They can not comprehend that the entire system is nothing more than a random bet at quantifying human behavior based on a man who rigged rat studies to say what ever he wanted them to say so he could come to terms with his own unhappy upbringing. So children and latter adults come up with the conclusion that there is a conspiracy, an agenda deliberately targeting boys. The end results MGTOW, MRA, civil war movements, ect which appeal to and vindicate the injustices that dogma and ignorance has brought to men and other people.

There will come a day when radical behaviorism and the people and institutions that employed it will be seen as one the worst and inhuman harms done to human race.
 
It take a few moments for me to pre-rinse some stuck-on bits from the dishes.
I use the hot water for that, and when I start the DW, it get its hot water faster, meaning less heating element time.

You're still heating water in both scenarios. In your case you are heating more water because more water is being used in the first place.

A good, realistic dishwasher should heat its own water. There is either a thermal hold or a long enough main wash with a strong enough heater to boost the temperature to at least 140*F.
 
Anyone else flashing back to the headlines about cell phone users of all generations giving up their smartphones for flip-phones and "candy bar" cell phones?

When was the last time you saw someone using either? 1980s movies don't count.
 
You're still heating water in both scenarios. In your case you are heating more water because more water is being used in the first place.

A good, realistic dishwasher should heat its own water. There is either a thermal hold or a long enough main wash with a strong enough heater to boost the temperature to at least 140*F.
It take a while for the hot water at the sink, and the DW, To get hot, from the downstairs hot water heater.
I'm merely bringing it up to the kitchen by rinsing, so that it's hotter for the DW to use.
I've noticed a shorter "heat up time" for the DW heating element, because once its thermo-sensor says "yes, it's hot now" the motor kicks into washing.
 
It take a while for the hot water at the sink, and the DW, To get hot, from the downstairs hot water heater.
I'm merely bringing it up to the kitchen by rinsing, so that it's hotter for the DW to use.
I've noticed a shorter "heat up time" for the DW heating element, because once its thermo-sensor says "yes, it's hot now" the motor kicks into washing.


The dishwasher usually heat while washing. Unless you have an old Kitchen-Aid. Those were good machines minus the lack of upper spray arm on some models and the short main wash.
 
Anyone else flashing back to the headlines about cell phone users of all generations giving up their smartphones for flip-phones and "candy bar" cell phones?

When was the last time you saw someone using either? 1980s movies don't count.
This is the phone I used for 18 years until Verizon stopped 3G service.
It cost me $109, and service of $10/month.
Mainly used for work, now retired just like me.

Untitled.jpg
 
The dishwasher usually heat while washing. Unless you have an old Kitchen-Aid. Those were good machines minus the lack of upper spray arm on some models and the short main wash.
My KD-19 fills first, pauses, then heats prior to starting the first wash (prewash) with the SaniHeat light on.
I can hear it sizzling in the water for about 10 minutes, then SWOOSH! the pump starts.
The SaniHeat also starts at the final rinse too.
 
This is the phone I used for 18 years until Verizon stopped 3G service.
It cost me $109, and service of $10/month.
Mainly used for work, now retired just like me.

View attachment 318479
My first cellphone was a Kyocera (on Verizon), bought about 2005. I really liked it, and even named it Kyo. I rarely used it at home, as I had a landline, but was nice when I was out somewhere, and needed to make a call.
 
My first cellphone was a Kyocera (on Verizon), bought about 2005. I really liked it, and even named it Kyo. I rarely used it at home, as I had a landline, but was nice when I was out somewhere, and needed to make a call.
Same here! - I've always kept my home landline.
The cellphone came in handy when traveling too, but other than that, I didn't become addicted like so many are today.
 
My KD-19 fills first, pauses, then heats prior to starting the first wash (prewash) with the SaniHeat light on.
I can hear it sizzling in the water for about 10 minutes, then SWOOSH! the pump starts.
The SaniHeat also starts at the final rinse too.


Ok, that makes sense now. You've got a Kitchen-Aid. Those were the most durable residential dishwashers ever built. Maytag DC washer and KitchenAid dishwasher- you've got impeccable taste my friend!


I'd love to have the KD-19 frame but with a Whirlpool Power Clean Filter Module inside the sump. If everyone was like me that would be a reality.
 
Ok, that makes sense now. You've got a Kitchen-Aid. Those were the most durable residential dishwashers ever built. Maytag DC washer and KitchenAid dishwasher- you've got impeccable taste my friend!


I'd love to have the KD-19 frame but with a Whirlpool Power Clean Filter Module inside the sump. If everyone was like me that would be a reality.
Ah, but no need to praise me Chet.
These machines were already in the house when I bought the place.
I'm just lucky that the previous owners picked the right appliances. ;)
 
Ah, but no need to praise me Chet.
These machines were already in the house when I bought the place.
I'm just lucky that the previous owners picked the right appliances. ;)


They picked the right ones indeed!

All my homes came with cheap builder grade GE appliances :cry:😭😱👺😤 :sick:🤮

What about the rest of the appliances? Stove, fridge, garbage disposal, furnace, water heater?
 
They picked the right ones indeed!

All my homes came with cheap builder grade GE appliances :cry:😭😱👺😤 :sick:🤮

What about the rest of the appliances? Stove, fridge, garbage disposal, furnace, water heater?
I moved in early 2005.
Well, I replaced the 33 year old AO Smith hot water heater (started leaking) in 2020 with a new AO Smith model from Lowes. Its amazingly efficient too.
The house furnace, a Crown boiler, (Crown in Philly) was installed in 2002, and it's great at keeping the house radiators toasty in winter. - quite efficent too.
The Insinkerator was put in around 2002 as well, works just fine.
The stove, a Tappan Series 110 was purchased in 1993, and is just fine.
The GE top freezer fridge is from 1985, and works great too.

I keep a check on those, but don't expect to do service on any of that stuff any time soon.
 
Good stuff, not bad. I also have an AO smith gas fired power vent water heater that was installed about two years ago. Its working great. Furnace is a Heil ICP. Its awful and soon to be replaced. I miss all those direct vent gas appliances.


My favorite are milli volt heating systems. Gas pilot light generates the power, thermostat completes the circuit, has valve opens and heats the boiler. Works in a power outage. Sadly, those days are no longer.
 
Good stuff, not bad. I also have an AO smith gas fired power vent water heater that was installed about two years ago. Its working great. Furnace is a Heil ICP. Its awful and soon to be replaced. I miss all those direct vent gas appliances.


My favorite are milli volt heating systems. Gas pilot light generates the power, thermostat completes the circuit, has valve opens and heats the boiler. Works in a power outage. Sadly, those days are no longer.
Well Chet, my Crown had the "standing pilot" when I moved in, but in 2008 I modified it with a Honeywell electronic conversion package, which saves gas since there's no longer a need for that older pilot system.
If the system needs heat.... it fires up the pilot, when that's satisfied, it turns on the main gas burner.
It's part of my frugal nature to save on things.
 
Well Chet, my Crown had the "standing pilot" when I moved in, but in 2008 I modified it with a Honeywell electronic conversion package, which saves gas since there's no longer a need for that older pilot system.
If the system needs heat.... it fires up the pilot, when that's satisfied, it turns on the main gas burner.
It's part of my frugal nature to save on things.


I'd agree with you only if the prior system needed power to fire. I like the idea of having back-ups when the power goes out.
 
Sorry for the black-outs, but lucky they weren't in the winter. Winter is the worst. I don't see most utility power services being reliable enough for total electrification.
Well, those blackouts only lasted for at most, 45 minutes.
PECO electric here is usually pretty quick at fixing the problem.
Heck, if it was winter, I'd use a BBQ lighter and fire up the stove burners for heat.
 
Well, those blackouts only lasted for at most, 45 minutes.
PECO electric here is usually pretty quick at fixing the problem.
Heck, if it was winter, I'd use a BBQ lighter and fire up the stove burners for heat.

Most likely 45 minutes to do the all the switching to sectionalize and isolate the faulted section of feeder and re-feed the healthy segments. The repair itself for a pole thats totally down is typically 12-16 hours, longer for local customers if there is/are transformers that feed them as those need to be re-hung after the pole is up and set.


Big storms are what sucks when every section of every circuit has some type of damage to it. Days to weeks long outages.
 
Back
Top