1950 Plymouth

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Shifting

I had a 1969 Cougar five-speed. I never got tired of shifting, but then I didn't live in L.A., Atlanta, or any other big city where shifting manually becomes labor-intensive. The older cars are a completely different shifting experience, lol!

1950 - what was the cost of gas? $0.10-15/gallon? :-)
 
Rich mentioning the E brake

got me thinking.. Aside from the shifter being stuck, the fact that while the car seamed to be in gear, when I let up on the clutch I felt something was holding the rear wheels. So I paid a visit today to where the Plymouth sits and waits for the mechanic.
I knew the e brake wasn't pulled, but when Rich mentioned the e brake, I had to explore.
First thing I did was to gently pull the brake to see if I felt or heard heard anything. Sure enough something feels off. (Thanks Rich)
I started her up and reached for the gear shift and was surprised to find it wasn't stuck anymore? (possible vibration from the tow ride)
So I backed her up a drove her around the block, I was afraid to use first gear for my test, so just started in second. When I got close to turning into where it was parked at the mechanic, I was brave enough to use flrst, second, and third. Shifting seems slightly off somehow?
Without crawling under the car..I'm convinced that somethings up with the e brake, and the shift linkage.
At any rate at least I know that the clutch and transmission is operating! And I will direct the mechanic to the e brake first, then on to the two shifter arms. One of them may have a pin loose or something.
I'm just to pretty too crawl under greasy old cars anymore!
Good to know about the rope type seal Rich, I have one in a box somewhere.

P.S..you boys may find this funny, but when I called for the tow, I had to spell PLYMOUTH to the person who took the call! LOL

Forgive me Ralph.. What Tree?
 
Had to spell Plymouth, but he would have been unfazed by Hyundai, sigh.

Looks like your're onto something with that wacky driveshaft brake!

About top speeds, keep in mind that cars of this era were pulling wildly low rear axle ratios, like 4.27 to 1 or even 4.54 to 1, so the engines would really be revving even high gear. An overdrive is a useful addition, though I'm not sure if Plymouth offered them from the factory. Chryslers often had them.
 
". . . I had to spell PLYMOUTH . . ."

Gee, it's not like the last Plymouth was produced in 1950.   Plymouth doesn't make smart phones.  If they did, that person would have known how to spell it.

 

I'm glad this is looking like it's not transmission related.  The linkage and E-brake are relatively simple and inexpensive repairs.

 

Stan, it's the tree in the photo of your car above, in the foreground parking strip.  It looks like half the trunk of it (the tree, not the Plymouth) is missing.
 
LOL Ralph

It's Crêpe myrtle tree that's is my nexdoor neighbors. A big truck came down the street one day and pulled a phone line down. Poor tree took the assault.
 
RE Overdrive

Yes, Plymouth as well as Ford Chevrolet and most cars could be had with overdrive then, My 53 Plymouth had Hy Drive, which was a fluid drive setup .I  had a 53 Imperial with Fluid Torque Drive, which was a semi automatic, it was a whole different animal on the road, it had a 331 cubic inch hemi, I drove it on several trips, thirsty, but anything that weighs near 5000 pounds on a 131 inch wheelbase is not going to be economical, about 15 mpg on a trip, 10 or so around town, but it would really travel if you stepped on it, im kind of ashamed to admit I ran a old car that hard, but I had it 105 going down I 85 once...
 
Guess what won...

The first Southern 500 race at Darlington speedway...A stock 1950 Plymouth..LOL Not on speed but tire wear, the Cadillacs, Oldsmobiles and Hudsons used up all their tires, Johnny Mantz who drove the Plymouth was a Indy driver, so he knew what it took to run asphalt, remember, The Southern 500 was on the first big paved track, and the first 500 mile race,. He brought Dodge truck tires and that made the difference, he ran all day at 75 to 80 and ended up winning over cars that were running over 100, remember, a 88 Olds or a Cadillac would run well over 100 in those days.
 
mpg

I think 20 to 21 mpg highway is realistic with a old Plymouth like that. It's heavy but near as much as a old military Power Wagon pickup that also had extremely low gears to make up for no low range and about 80hp or so.
My early one had 4.88 gears and the later bigger 3/4 ton version had 5.86 gears and were even heavier.
The military tech manual for them even runs down all the specs and 9mpg is the official statement in the specs sheet.
They had maybe 8 to 1 or less compression so could run on crappy low octane gas, so anything above 60 octane was fine.
That Plymouth should be pretty much the same so run the cheapest regular you can find and don't let it sit too long as the methanol pulls moisture out of the air and turns to paint thinner in about 30 days.
My Dart has sat mostly un started since 06 and the gas smells like bad paint thinner now and the inside of the Thermoquad was all gummed up. It was amazing it still started and ran to drive 5 miles here in 2012.
Wish I could have driven that 50 Dodge just once. You did have to use the clutch to shift into first or reverse, and pretty sure low to high, but never driven one to see, that is what I was told and have read.
They were supposed to be very durable but really ate up the little power the engine had.
 
Re Fluid Torque

On my 53 Imperial, you had 2 gearshift positions, low range and high range, low was where second would be on a regular column shift, high was where high would be, reverse and neutral were in their normal positions. each range had 2 speeds, for a total of 4 gear ratios, you pushed in the clutch and selected either low or high range, and let out the clutch, then shifting between the 2 speeds , 1 and 2 or 3 and 4 was controlled by letting off the accelerator, with the hemi, you hardly ever needed to use the low unless you were going to race or something, 1st was almost a granny gear, the funny thing was, if you took off in low range and opened it up, it was wound out at about 35....if you held it wide open and barely bumped the clutch, it would power shift into second and bark the tires, I learned this from a guy I worked with with who said his dads Desoto did the same thing, dumb me had to find out, and it really would!!To shift between low range and high range ,you used the clutch in the conventional way, great system and darn near indestructible.
 
Your right

Ralph!
Haven't heard anything.
The shop is around the corner from work, and my brother hangs out there sometimes (we've known these mechanics for years) I asked my brother to let me know if he sees it up on the rack...if that happens, I'll to take a look for myself. This is if I've got time and I've got time to walk over.. If it works out that way, I'll take pics to share
More to come with the old Plymouth (hope it just old worn linkage)
 
Allen

What a nice complement.
Yes that's me. I ware a butch cut now though.
Still no news on the Plymouth! I told them I was in no hurry, so it's fine with me if the babysit it!
 
I did a little research and it appears Plymouth didn't offer overdrive until 1952, for some reason. Chevy didn't have overdrive until 1955, because they used a torque tube drive before then and adding an overdrive unit would have been too complicated, apparently.

How is your 1973 Oldsmobile ragtop, Stan?
 
The Ragtop

Is great John.
However I'm board of it, so I've got it for sale!
Haven't been very ambitious in selling.. just has a FOR SALE sign on it while parked under covered parking LOL.
Was waiting til Spring to set her out.
Getting kinda tired of maintaining old cars.
 
I know what you mean Stan about frigging with old cars. I have a 35 year old Corvette that has been in storage for 12 years because I dont want to mess with replacing brakes and valve cover gaskets to put it back on the road. I would love to sell it and get it over with too. But I am not giving it away with only 49,000 miles. I always thought that he who dies with the most toys is the winner. Naaaa, I am too old to play with these toys any more.
 
John

"Plymouth didn't offer overdrive til 52"
I've read that too, but Chrystler offered it in the 30s on DeSoto?
From what I've read, and seen.. It's possible to add a overdrive to the 50, but seems complicated, or at least takes some imagination.

Tim..have you got pic to share of your Corvette? Are you going to have to do the work so you can sell it?
These old cars can be daunting at times, but I've always figured that I'm just the caretaker of these old girls...at least til it's time to pass them on to the next guy that will keep them alive, or better take them further.
I'm torn! ...I'm glad the Plymouth is with the mechanic, but I'm annoyed at myself for not making more of a effort to fix it myself.
I'd really like to be under it when he's got it up on the hoist with a drop light on it!

Guess I'd bitch if I was hung with a new rope! LOL
 
Retrofitting

It may not be that bad according to this source.

"Overdrive proved popular enough that Plymouth offered it as a complete service package to be installed in the field on P22 and P23 series cars. Net dealer price, which included the overdrive and mainshaft assembly, clutch disc, hand brake drum, wiring harness, and necessary controls was $142.25. First shipments of the kit were not scheduled until mid-May 1952. For owners of earlier Plymouths, the unit was virtually a bolt-in swap for cars dating back to 1940. As early as 1940, Plymouth had used a long tailshaft assembly on their transmissions. Removing this tailshaft allowed the overdrive unit to slip into its place, allowing the original drive shaft to be used."

http://www.allpar.com/history/plymouth/1946-1959/plymouth-1952.html
 
Funny overdrive story

When my Mothers cousin married in 1950, They took her husbands parents new Packard convertible on the honeymoon trip to Niagra Falls, Jan, being somewhat of a lead foot just had to find out how fast the Packard would run with the overdrive engaged.....75 in first, 110 in second and She said it ran past the numbers on the dial in third, I thought she was kidding, so I asked Dick her husband, he said, She is NOT kidding, I told her if She blew up Daddys new Packard he would kill us both, but  it really would FLY!, She is 84 and still has somewhat of a heavy foot!
 
Good Story Stan.  Didn't I say the linkage from the get go?  They failed on all sorts of makes and models due to the nature of usage and being constantly moving while shifting.  It can leave you with the impression (unexplainable) that there is a major issue going on.  

 

Glad you have your car back home and all is well.

 

--Steven
 
Yes

You did Steven! Thank you.
At first, I questioned if it was something that simple. On the side of the road.. Couldn't see the worn bushing, just wanted to get it unstuck!
(I wasn't going to get that to happen)
I have some slight apprehension about the repair that was done.. While driving down the highway, I heard a snap, and found that it jumped out of gear
(into neutral)
Hasn't done it since, but...
 
Snap

That only happened to me once with the GMC while taking the Waldo Grade in the downhill direction, most of the time with my foot off the gas.  The shift lever was seriously vibrating, and then it just popped into neutral on its own.

 

 
 

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