$250 Fine for Smoking

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I don't think that putting the health of the employees and patrons of an establishment ahead of people who are poisoning themselves and everyone around them is government intrusion. Nor do I think them hypocrites. I would call it looking at the facts and making a change to protect the health of people who have chosen not to smoke. Nothing ever gave smokers the right to smoke wherever they wished, it was just an accommodation to a large number of people who became addicted when smoking was promoted as harmless and even endorsed by doctors. In the first decade of the 20th century, lung cancer was among the rarest of cancers. Lots of people weed out smokers as potential people they wish to spend time with. And, with all that is known about smoking today, young people who decide to start smoking cannot be considered to have very good judgement by prospective employers, especially when the manufacturers have been caught manipulating nicotine levels to keep people hooked. When you consider that nicotine is used as an insecticide, a poison, there is no way that it cannot be harmful. Years ago a comedy group had a song titled, "Tobacco, The Red Man's Revenge." It certainly is a curse when you consider all of the money spent on smoking, the billions of dollars the government has paid out in subsidies to tobacco farmers and the costs, many borne by the government, of the illnesses its use causes. About the only financial plus is that smokers usually have shorter life spans than non-smokers so they do their part to keep the Social Security System solvent a little longer. That sounds crude and awful and I don't say it to be hurtful, but it is crude and awful to watch loved ones die from the effects of smoking. It is heartbreaking to see wonderful, beautiful, brilliant, creative, but addicted people whom you cherish, smoking, knowing that they are taking their own lives, puff by puff. And later, it is agonizing to see them trying to inhale a good breath of air when their lungs have been almost destroyed by Chronic Obstructive Pulmonary Disease and this is while they have the cannula under their nostrils delivering oxygen from the tank they pull behind them on a little cart. I have been through this so what I have written is from the heart and gut, not just flippant remarks off the top of my head.
 
Yeah but what about....

BEDBUGS! I am more concerned about those than a smoke room. (And..and yes I smoke so :-P~)

Did anyone see the news where that woman woke up with over 100 bites on her?

Brettsomers...what does the industry do to control those evil pests!?
 
Housekeeper is to blame She or He should be fired!

Maid need to be made to change the sheets ... Director should check and be sure all beds are changed this is a very smiple thing to do all she or he has to do is make the laundry count the sheets and the end of the day the count should match with the total number of rented rooms..
 
I guess there's nothing more relevant or pressing for some people to concern themselves with.

I used to be the epitome of the polite smoker, always asking, is it okay to smoke?, and so on....

Now... if some little trollop walks out of the office building and plants a puss on her face or launches the false-coughing-hacking routine, I've no problem blowing the smoke in their direction....also I light up ON the subway steps, rather until waiting till I hit the street....

Not illegal, folks. My streets, my public space, my right to smoke.
 
Yes! No smoking! I hate inhaling second hand smoke, it makes me want to throw up. This last summer, I stayed at The Soaring Eagle Casino & Hotel. We got a free dinner at the restaurant. They didn't have any more non-smoking tables, so we had to settle for a smoking table, even though nobody in my family smokes. The food was GREAT, but we had to step out every 20 minutes because the smell became so bad, and the clothes I was wearing smelled like smoke. I hope every hotel chain will adopt this new rule, so we can all breathe a little easier.
 
You have to be careful...

very careful, and I agree with the consideration of another layer of laws.

Let me first say that I hate smoking, I have asthma too and I hate "smoking rooms" in a hotel. That said, I always think, what next?

As you know, politicians love to create new laws, I don't care what side of the aisle you are on. For some, its a measurement of "progress" and something they can put on their website in terms of accomplishment.

Remember, every time you gain a law, you lose a freedom.

Personally, I don't want to be around smoking anywhere. But the problem I have is someone who wishes to have a smoking restaurant or bar. YOU have a choice not to go there. YOU have a choice to visit a hotel with non smoking rooms. Therefore, I don't think the government has any right to restrict such things for those who wish to have them or not have them.

The government was not founded as a mechanism to control all behaviors. Control your own behavior! Provide security, basic law enforcement, access to roads, power, etc, these are the things that the government, both local and federal, should focus on. Making it illegal to smoke in PRIVATELY OWNED BUSINESSES that is OPEN TO THE PUBLIC oversteps all types of boundries. If you could go back in time, I bet our founding fathers would choke on the whole idea.

I particularly bristle at "for your own good" laws. I can certaintly understand other writers here not wanting to deal with other people's smoke, I don't want to either. But how is some private bar, open to the public, allowing smoking, HURTING ME? I don't have to go there, I don't have to work there.

If it's all about risks, well, how about people involved in skiing, snowboarding, skidiving, auto racing, and other sports? Should we consider laws prohibiting such acts "only in certain areas or conditions" and then, maybe making them illegal, because of the risks? Sure the argument would be that skiing does not affect your neighbor, BUT NEITHER DOES SMOKING IN A PRIVATE BAR.

I don't like it one bit, it smacks of nanny state. As I have said in the past, the last thing we need is more laws. People think more laws are great when it governs activities they don't like.

If we accept this kind of thing, one day laws may impact something WE like...I don't know, like maybe owning or operating appliances that are made before a certain year.

How would such laws happen? Well, it can start when your insurance company denies claims for water or fire damage if they trace it to an older appliance. Since that becomes a norm, it is pretty easy down the slippery slope to making it a law. See how easy it is?

Don't think it can't happen.
 
My right to breathe

Even thought the law was passed in the uk for a ban on smoking in bars and resturants, I would welcome a TOTAL SMOKING BAN IN PUBLIC. To me this would mean and out right ban, I have the right to breath clean air as I my self have asthma. A smoker should not have the right to polute a non smokers to breath clean air, smoking is unsexy its dirty it makes you stink AND IT MAKES YOU LOOK STUPID AND UGLY. I dont smoke so please why the hell should I breath in your crap.
 
smoking ban

I would welcome a complete public smoking ban. I don't feel that any bans are "infringements" on anyone's so-called "right to smoke". Smoke in your home or your car, but not around me. What smokers need to realize is that the exhaled smoke is just as dangerous, if not more dangerous than what they inhale themselves. I hate to be around it, and I grew up in a family of smokers. Many Christmas pictures have a blue haze evident in them, and I can remember going to the floor to have some clean air to breathe. Won't even mention the long car trips with the window rolled up tight. Amazingly, as each of the older members of my family died of lung or throat cancer, it was always "something they had worked around" or the "chemicals in the air", smoking was never blamed. You asked for my opinion, now you have it, and if I stepped on any nicotine addict's (and that is what it is...a worse addiciton than heroin) toes, so be it....
 
Intersting thread!!

Kevinpreston8 says "If it's all about risks, well, how about people involved in skiing, snowboarding, skidiving, auto racing, and other sports?". I think that your post is very interesting and well thought out (not that anyone elses isn't) but I have to reply to the quote. I agree that there are risks, in life, and I would expect that if I were to stand in the middle of a race-way I would be risking getting run over. Same goes with being in the middle of a ski slope...you get the picture. I don't NEED to be standing in any of these areas BUT I do, on occasion, need to be in public places such as stores, hotels, eating establishments, etc...so why should I have to be subjected to the health damaging ADDICTIONS of others. Not to mention the collateral damages such as burnt clothing and the like. Let's not put into the equation taxing the heath care system with the effects of using such a well known carcinogen.

Do I have feelings about smoking???? Hell yeah! Many years ago I worked for a vey large hotel chain and witnessed the removal of a dead child due to a careless smoker in a hotel room. I saw the blaze and saw the "clean-up". The smoker didn't NEED to smoke but the child HAD to be there. This was totaly senseless and will remain with me for the rest of my life. Not to mention that I held my best friend while she took her last breath due to a three pack a day habit. That best friend was my grandmother!

SO... In reply to oxydolfan1. You seem very angry BUT please remember, in your own words, it's "My streets, my public space" too. Please respect that! I am addicted to sweets. Perhaps the next time I binge in public, you will be forgiving when I barf all over you. Remember...there is no law against puking in public! Just a by-product of a bad habit :-)

Sorry to be so graphic and silly BUT....."Now... if some little trollop walks out of the office building and plants a puss on her face or launches the false-coughing-hacking routine, I've no problem blowing the smoke in their direction....also I light up ON the subway steps, rather until waiting till I hit the street...." This is just rude and bordering ignorant.

Sorry, in advance, if I've offended anyone. I respect opinions but not the act of being intentionally mean-spirited.

Rich

Rich
 
I agree with kevinpreston8 - it's the "nanny" laws that bother me. I'm an unrepentant smoker but I hope I'm one of the considerate ones - I don't smoke around non-smokers, I don't smoke in my house when I have guests, etc. etc. I do however have a problem with the never ending laws that are to "protect" us. Here in Vancouver, where smoking has been banned for a number of years in bars and restaurants, most of them built patios for the smokers. Now of course, the next law is coming down to ban smoking on the patios. C'mon. You want house insurance? Sorry, that knob and tube wiring has to go plus that stove isn't CSA approved (my friend just had to tear out their 1920's wood burner or no insurance)and oh yeah, it's illegal to sell a house now that has an oil tank in the basement, even though they were installed that way for years. The best one of late though is in the new year, it will be illegal here to idle your car for over 3 minutes. And so we go....
 
The issue with Marriott does not appear to be a law at all, it is a policy set up by a company as part of the terms of doing business with them, nothing more.

Here in Midland and Odessa, TX. the law states that restaurants, bars, etc. must either:
Allow smoking anywhere in the establishment
or forbid it altogether.

I think this is a fair law: those places who have a mostly smoking clientele have allowed it and most places have totally forbad it. "No Smoking" sections in restaurants never stopped the smell from getting to me and I'm glad they don't have that anymore.
 
No, perc, I'm not angry...

I'm just going to continue to do what I want to do.

The streets belong to me, just as much as any non-smoker.

The whole "second-hand smoke" canard has already been thoroughly debunked by a host of experts, and that whole excuse for infringing on my personal freedoms flies straight out the window (or, rather, down the street) when you stop to consider that there is wind and air movement pulsating all around us, on that street.

I've experienced a host of health problems over the course of my life (none due to smoking, I might add), and I've managed to work at managing my symptoms and triggers without haranguing anyone else around me for setting them off, to a point where virtually no one ever had any idea I had problems in the first place!

That's called independence. That's called self-reliance.

That's called tolerance.

My philosophy in regards to people in my personal life, and why I don't suffer tobacco fascists for long, is this: if this is how you respond to something that I do, that has such trivial, if any, consequences for you, well, how will you respond when a real-life emergency or drama pops up? Is this how?

This is the way I have to think of it. If I choose to smoke cigarettes, drink alcohol, wear leather/fur/etc., eat meat, whatever....what gives you the authority to even comment upon it, unless I give you such authority first? If you don't know how to behave and exhibit yourself in a polite and civilized manner, shouldn't YOU clean up your backyard, before launching into stormtrooper mode in regards to my alleged transgressions?

In short, my guess is that public smoking is something you'll have to learn to come to terms with. Essentially, I really have no problem.
 
Right to smoke...

If you have a "right" to blow a hazardous, noxious irritant in my face on a public sidewalk, then I should have a "right" to do the same to you. Now where did I put my can of mace? ;)
 
Hey, go for it, baby.

I can hear you screaming from Rikers already, lol....

Frankly, the Eisenhower carrier is only five days from reaching the coast of Iran....

My guess is that our energies are better spent worrying over more pressing issues on this planet.
 
oxydolfan1 writes, "Now... if some little trollop walks out of the office building and plants a puss on her face or launches the false-coughing-hacking routine, I've no problem blowing the smoke in their direction....also I light up ON the subway steps, rather until waiting till I hit the street.... "

That's just ignorant and arrogant. Period. You do have the right to do whatever you want, whenever you want, as long as it doesn't affect my health and well-being.

As for debunking the theory of second-hand smoke, as you've said so many experts have done, everyone who looks at the big picture knows that each study can be skewed to suit the people paying for the study. Without even looking, I think I can safely guarantee you that there are many more studies showing ill effects from second-hand smoke than debunking the theory. But, they may be skewed as well.

I can tell you that when I, a former smoker but non-soapbox lecturer on smoking, encounter second-hand smoke, it not only stinks, but envokes coughing, choking or gagging depending on the concentration. I, too, might give a little signal, like a cough, if you were non-deliberately blowing smoke my way. That would be a subtle, courteous way to tell you you've done it. If you persisted, and I thought you might not have caught the hint, I might ask you to please blow it the other way. If you deliberately blew smoke in my face, I'd be inclined to infringe upon your right to remain upright. I would hope my sensibility would prevail, and I'd like to think I could have you arrested for personal endangerment, citing all those studies proving second-hand smoke as dangerous and deadly. If you want to go ahead and kill yourself smoking, that's your choice and I RESPECT THAT. What I won't tolerate is you affecting my health when I have no choice in the matter.

I also wouldn't have a problem with you or anyone else smoking, if it didn't cost me money. Millions of health care dollars are spent every year on smoking-related illness, driving healthcare costs up and up.

If you deliberately set fire to your house, knowing it will damage it, you don't get insurance money. It's called arson. It should be the same for smoking. It's well documented and commonly known to cause health problems. If you experience health problems DIRECTLY related to smoking, you shouldn't receive health care (i.e. insurance) benefits. It's called stupidity.

But, it's your choice to smoke and accept the risks, just the same as it's your choice to set your house on fire and get an arson charge. That's OK!!! Just don't let it affect me by giving me health problems and costing me more money through higher insurance premiums.

And, yes, I too have lost best friends due to smoking. My grandmother in her 70's and my mother, barely past 50.

This is the Chuck half of perc-o-prince, and not Rich.
 
If we are standing out in the street, you have one acceptable choice: to move yourself to another, presumably more "alpine-fresh" area. I don't smoke in queues and I haven't been known to loiter (lately), so there's absolutely no reason for you to stand on top of me while I go about my business. There's also no need to eye me up and down like a restaurant menu, go into spasmodic performance art to advise me as to your comfort level, or otherwise express your distress. It's called personal space, and, frankly, if you can't handle the smoke from a passer-by's cigarette, you really aren't in any position to be waltzing around the streets where you may have to come in contact with (gasp!) a BUS, or (just to keep it all seasonal) a roasted chestnut cart.

Again, the streets belong to the people. I am a people. And my right to LEGALLY do what I wish to do is in no way going to be relinquish to a stranger's whims and desires?

My insurance? Do you intend to cover my premiums and co-payments for any length of time? How do you know that I do not pay through the nose for a smokers' premium rate, just so I have such bases covered? Are you a field underwriter, or a medical biller for my carrier, who determines what charges shall be paid, and what will not? Didn't think so. Trust me, I've got it covered, and if we need you, we WILL be in touch..

Stop blaming myself and other smokers for your health afflictions, infirmities, and deficiencies. We didn't cause them.

And I'm quite tired of having our nightlife and well-established, safe, well-run nightspots being run out of business, over sheer foolishness and failure to assume responsibility.

I'm a smoker, and I assure you, I'm not going anywhere.
 
just as I read.....

.....somewhere in the comic strips (can't remember which one), but it was WWWWAAAAAAAAYYYYYY back in the '80's...predicting the Nicotine Wars of the '90's, except it is about a decade late.....I, too, have no problem with others smoking, as long as I don't have to breathe their noxious fumes. Some say it is their right....maybe so, but would these same people have the "right" to shred asbestos into the air??? Seems to me that tobacco smoke is about the same.....
 

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