bradfordwhite
Well-known member
Drought is real.
60s-70s Laudromat with FL washers and Closed TL Maytags
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With carbon free nuclear, water desalination becomes feasible and with that the use of top load washers.
I'd also challenge the blanket assumption that front loads always clean better when it comes to soiled diapers, shop rags and exceptionally muddy/greasy work clothes.
I'd also challenge the blanket assumption that front loads always clean better when it comes to soiled diapers, shop rags and exceptionally muddy/greasy work clothes.
Drought is real.
The drought is manufactured. Only 10 percent of water usage is used by the public. 40% is used in agriculture and the other 50% percent is used for "environmental" purposes aka flushed out into the ocean. We haven't even began discussing Nestle or antiquated and wasteful flood irrigation. And that is just a start.
The drought is manufactured. Only 10 percent of water usage is used by the public. 40% is used in agriculture and the other 50% percent is used for "environmental" purposes aka flushed out into the ocean. We haven't even began discussing Nestle or antiquated and wasteful flood irrigation. And that is just a start.
rinso
Well-known member
It looks like some of the coin-op laundry equipment shown here, may need a visit from Mister Repairman.
ryner1988
Well-known member
bradfordwhite
Well-known member
When one considers that roughly 80% of the water in California is used on agriculture that feeds the entire country it really puts in to perspective that used in the home.
"I'd also challenge the blanket assumption that front loads always clean better when it comes to soiled diapers, shop rags and exceptionally muddy/greasy work clothes."
Challenge all you like, but it's a proven fact that h-axis washing machines will get all sorts of soiled laundry cleaner using less water per pound, and with causing less stress/damage than top loaders with central beaters.
Industrial/commercial laundries long have used h-axis washers to process everything from hospital linen to diaper services, and results are spot on.
Now what is achievable with a truly industrial washer that has far more changes of water than most domestic front loaders, is built to withstand use of stronger chemicals, has access to or can produce hot water at temps 140F to 180F, and is allowed to used enough water per pound to get job done, well that is another matter.
Average domestic front loader is being nobbled by same laws/rules on energy conservation applied to top loaders, which is silly. H-axis washers already use less water per pound than top loaders so across board standards are stupid.
Here is standard diaper service wash formula from 1950's
(1) Five-minute cold rinse;
(2) 10-minute soak in hot suds;
(3) 10-minute soak in hot suds;
(4) 10-minute soak in hot suds, with bleach;
(5) five hot rinses with live steam;
(6) six cold rinses, and a germicide solution is used in the third cold rinse;
(7) water is extracted;
(8) dried in tumblers under 125 pounds of live steam;
(9) ready for folding and packing.
Here are some standard modern wash formulas:
http://www.uschemical.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/L000241_Laundry_Formulas.pdf
What industrial laundries have over domestic washers is ability to do far more changes of water (especially flush, wash and bleach cycles), which is what carries away muck.
Back in day as part of "Normal" cycles front loaders always did a pre-wash. That's gone by wayside in most part though some machines have "Heavy soil" programs which incorporate a pre-wash. But in industrial setting even that pre-wash (or first wash cycle) would be proceeded by a "flush" cycle regardless.
"We Don't Wash In Dirty Water" is the maxim for laundresses, laundries and and anyone else doing the job going back ages. No laundry will ever be cleaner than the water it has come out of, so if you don't flush or otherwise remove gross muck (via many changes of water for example), you're not going to get good results.
Modern commercial laundries (including those that process diapers) deal with heavily soiled loads all the time. When it comes to diapers everything goes into machines as it comes out of bags, including solid waste.
post was last edited: 7/17/2022-17:43]
Challenge all you like, but it's a proven fact that h-axis washing machines will get all sorts of soiled laundry cleaner using less water per pound, and with causing less stress/damage than top loaders with central beaters.
Industrial/commercial laundries long have used h-axis washers to process everything from hospital linen to diaper services, and results are spot on.
Now what is achievable with a truly industrial washer that has far more changes of water than most domestic front loaders, is built to withstand use of stronger chemicals, has access to or can produce hot water at temps 140F to 180F, and is allowed to used enough water per pound to get job done, well that is another matter.
Average domestic front loader is being nobbled by same laws/rules on energy conservation applied to top loaders, which is silly. H-axis washers already use less water per pound than top loaders so across board standards are stupid.
Here is standard diaper service wash formula from 1950's
(1) Five-minute cold rinse;
(2) 10-minute soak in hot suds;
(3) 10-minute soak in hot suds;
(4) 10-minute soak in hot suds, with bleach;
(5) five hot rinses with live steam;
(6) six cold rinses, and a germicide solution is used in the third cold rinse;
(7) water is extracted;
(8) dried in tumblers under 125 pounds of live steam;
(9) ready for folding and packing.
Here are some standard modern wash formulas:
http://www.uschemical.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/L000241_Laundry_Formulas.pdf
What industrial laundries have over domestic washers is ability to do far more changes of water (especially flush, wash and bleach cycles), which is what carries away muck.
Back in day as part of "Normal" cycles front loaders always did a pre-wash. That's gone by wayside in most part though some machines have "Heavy soil" programs which incorporate a pre-wash. But in industrial setting even that pre-wash (or first wash cycle) would be proceeded by a "flush" cycle regardless.
"We Don't Wash In Dirty Water" is the maxim for laundresses, laundries and and anyone else doing the job going back ages. No laundry will ever be cleaner than the water it has come out of, so if you don't flush or otherwise remove gross muck (via many changes of water for example), you're not going to get good results.
Modern commercial laundries (including those that process diapers) deal with heavily soiled loads all the time. When it comes to diapers everything goes into machines as it comes out of bags, including solid waste.
post was last edited: 7/17/2022-17:43]
Another thing
True commercial/industrial H-axis washers will not only do all of the above, but have cycle times < 40 minutes on average. My modern AEG-Lavamat washers allot nearly one hour for rinsing and final extraction alone.
Westinghouse knew and proved H-axis washers could cope with and remove heavy muck, soil and sand far better than top loaders. This was back in 1950's!
True commercial/industrial H-axis washers will not only do all of the above, but have cycle times < 40 minutes on average. My modern AEG-Lavamat washers allot nearly one hour for rinsing and final extraction alone.
Westinghouse knew and proved H-axis washers could cope with and remove heavy muck, soil and sand far better than top loaders. This was back in 1950's!
Sluice wash or sluice washer to handle loads heavy with ... muck.
In our area when water restrictions are in place (thank god not for some time now), supposedly inspectors visit laundromats to observe water level via glass door (front loaders). If it is above a certain point that can mean fines.
Quite honestly don't understand why any laundromat still would have top loaders. Unless owner has very cheap water and sewer rates it just doesn't make sense. As have said several times in past haven't seen top loaders in laundromats around here in one or more decades now. Even multi-family housing such as apartment buildings and dorms are getting rid of top loaders in favor of front.
Quite honestly don't understand why any laundromat still would have top loaders. Unless owner has very cheap water and sewer rates it just doesn't make sense. As have said several times in past haven't seen top loaders in laundromats around here in one or more decades now. Even multi-family housing such as apartment buildings and dorms are getting rid of top loaders in favor of front.
How many gallons of water per pound of cloth when washing diapers though? I would imagine 5 hot rinses and 6 cold rinses is more water than 3 rinses in a typical laundry mat or resi front load, approaching top load territory?
There isn't a direct comparison because industrial/commercial laundries don't use top loading washers.
Their standards usually are costs measured in water use per pound of laundry. Usual range is 2.5 to 3.5 gallons of water per pound of laundry.
See: https://www.milnor.com/technical-knowledge-base/washer-extractors/general-information-4/water-usage/
There are ways to get those numbers down that just aren't available to domestic washing machines. Things like water reclamation, using rinse water from final cycles as for prewash or flush cycles.
Batch/tunnel washers take things to a whole other level.
Their standards usually are costs measured in water use per pound of laundry. Usual range is 2.5 to 3.5 gallons of water per pound of laundry.
See: https://www.milnor.com/technical-knowledge-base/washer-extractors/general-information-4/water-usage/
There are ways to get those numbers down that just aren't available to domestic washing machines. Things like water reclamation, using rinse water from final cycles as for prewash or flush cycles.
Batch/tunnel washers take things to a whole other level.
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www.milnor.com
Right, but my thinking (albeit biased toward top loaders) is that those Maytags would do a better job with heavily soiled cloth than those Dexters on the basis there is more water to hold in suspension and then flush muck away. Not that the Dexters couldn't be made to wash heavy soils, but water usage would end up approaching the Maytags IMO.
Miele Sluice programs.
PW6055 (Professional), partial of Sluice High (prerinses, start of main wash 75°C).
PW6065 (Little Giant), full Sluice Low (150°F) program (click Watch on YouTube, video is restricted from embedding off YouTube).
IIRC only Miele professional washers with dump valves (not pumps) have sluice options enabled.
This makes sense as you wouldn't want muck consisting of heavy soil, faeces, and whatever else one wanted removed to sit around in sump to contaminate successive changes of water.
Most industrial/commercial washers don't have pumps anyway, but drain valves. OPL washers such as Miele "Little Giants" can go either way.
In general terms "sluice" simply means to rinse. Those who cloth diaper "sluice" solid waste out (usually but not recommended) by dunking in toilet.
Washer/extractors or just washers marketed also as "sluice" tend to have larger diameter holes in wash tub along with special programmed designed for the job.
Mind you washers or washer/extractors long were used to "sluice" heavily contaminated/soiled linen. Just the operator of washer controlled cycles (or used early programming such as cards) to raise water level for first one or two pre rinse cycles. Machines naturally already had wash tubs with holes of diameter large enough to allow muck to pass.
https://olshs.com.au/index.php?route=product/category&path=7_27_30
Here is manual for Miele PW 6065 speaking about sluice "high" or "low" cycles.
https://www.manualslib.com/manual/810984/Miele-Pw-6065-Plus-Sluice.html?page=24#manual
Note both sluice "high" and "low" cycles max load is about half of normal "Cottons" capacity, about 4.5 kilos.
If anyone likes a good read: https://www.england.nhs.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/Engineering.pdf
This makes sense as you wouldn't want muck consisting of heavy soil, faeces, and whatever else one wanted removed to sit around in sump to contaminate successive changes of water.
Most industrial/commercial washers don't have pumps anyway, but drain valves. OPL washers such as Miele "Little Giants" can go either way.
In general terms "sluice" simply means to rinse. Those who cloth diaper "sluice" solid waste out (usually but not recommended) by dunking in toilet.
Washer/extractors or just washers marketed also as "sluice" tend to have larger diameter holes in wash tub along with special programmed designed for the job.
Mind you washers or washer/extractors long were used to "sluice" heavily contaminated/soiled linen. Just the operator of washer controlled cycles (or used early programming such as cards) to raise water level for first one or two pre rinse cycles. Machines naturally already had wash tubs with holes of diameter large enough to allow muck to pass.
https://olshs.com.au/index.php?route=product/category&path=7_27_30
Here is manual for Miele PW 6065 speaking about sluice "high" or "low" cycles.
https://www.manualslib.com/manual/810984/Miele-Pw-6065-Plus-Sluice.html?page=24#manual
Note both sluice "high" and "low" cycles max load is about half of normal "Cottons" capacity, about 4.5 kilos.
If anyone likes a good read: https://www.england.nhs.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/Engineering.pdf
bradfordwhite
Well-known member
#1
NO on the nuclear garbage. YES on desalination.
Then all Topload washing machine lovers can wash their clothes THREAD BARE...FOREVER! lol
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The Saudis are really making it happen. I can't believe how many plants are already operating: 16,000
NO on the nuclear garbage. YES on desalination.
Then all Topload washing machine lovers can wash their clothes THREAD BARE...FOREVER! lol
-----
The Saudis are really making it happen. I can't believe how many plants are already operating: 16,000
Reply #16
“No more on the nuclear garbage”. You basically are contradicting yourself since you complain about natural gas coal etc when nuclear is clean and proven and has none of the drawbacks of fossil fuels etc. You have to realize the nuclear technology is improving and moving forward each day and they are currently are doing research and development on small modular reactors which basically are a very small nuclear reactor with a 300MW output and are more fail safe than your current nuclear reactor since the control rods are held up with gigantic electro-magnets/solenoids and if the power were to be cut to those solenoids, the control rods would just drop down preventing any meltdowns or disasters which is more fail safe than ANY nuclear reactor built within the last 50 or so years.
“No more on the nuclear garbage”. You basically are contradicting yourself since you complain about natural gas coal etc when nuclear is clean and proven and has none of the drawbacks of fossil fuels etc. You have to realize the nuclear technology is improving and moving forward each day and they are currently are doing research and development on small modular reactors which basically are a very small nuclear reactor with a 300MW output and are more fail safe than your current nuclear reactor since the control rods are held up with gigantic electro-magnets/solenoids and if the power were to be cut to those solenoids, the control rods would just drop down preventing any meltdowns or disasters which is more fail safe than ANY nuclear reactor built within the last 50 or so years.
Everything being said, generations of housewives and mothers washed cloth diapers in semi and fully automatic washing machines. This included everything from wringer washers to twin tubs to front or top loading machines. To best of my knowledge no one died, no major outbreaks of disease occurred, babies grew up into children and healthy adults.
As to what all those mothers washed those diapers with, that's a whole other conversation.
As to what all those mothers washed those diapers with, that's a whole other conversation.
