You're so close! Keep fighting the good fight and you'll be triumphant. That is one pretty Lady!
A long-awaited washer test
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bendixmark
Well-known member
water level
That is one of my favorite kenmores I sold a few of them back in the day dont know why I didnt have the sense to keep one.I have a 68 kenmore 800 which is similar and has the rotoflex.I take it you had no trouble removing the agitator,mine is stuck.From your video the low level looks about right believe it or not.Your scrubber is in the same shape as mine so at least I know I am not alone.To think at one time I had a whole box of those ,DOOOHHHH!!Is this the washer you got in New Hampshire?Right in my back yard practically .I hope to find one of those.Yesterday I came across a 72 800 but it was a mess so I robbed the agitator and some other parts.Great machine would love to see more video.
That is one of my favorite kenmores I sold a few of them back in the day dont know why I didnt have the sense to keep one.I have a 68 kenmore 800 which is similar and has the rotoflex.I take it you had no trouble removing the agitator,mine is stuck.From your video the low level looks about right believe it or not.Your scrubber is in the same shape as mine so at least I know I am not alone.To think at one time I had a whole box of those ,DOOOHHHH!!Is this the washer you got in New Hampshire?Right in my back yard practically .I hope to find one of those.Yesterday I came across a 72 800 but it was a mess so I robbed the agitator and some other parts.Great machine would love to see more video.
Just uploaded a longer video of the LK first wash test - No splashing at low water level (yet) but a definite distinct demo of the three (yep, count 'em - three) wash speeds!
Can't wait to try this machine with some clothes in it soon!
Can't wait to try this machine with some clothes in it soon!
Very Nice Paul!
Cute video and you really can see the different speeds.
The spin looks and sounds great too.
Patrick
Cute video and you really can see the different speeds.
The spin looks and sounds great too.
Patrick
autowasherfreak
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jul 28, 2008
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That Extra Slow is really slow. Nice looking machine!
3 Speed Lady Kenmore Demonstration
Thanks for posting Paul, the Roto-Flex agitator has long been my favorite agitator for standard tub BD WP built washers. WP started a trend in more gentile agitation in TL washers in 1964 with the introduction of the 1964 LKM and then the 1965 introduction of the 3Sp WP Imperial Mark 12 washer. Almost all other large washer manufactures followed suit in the next few years except MT in the quest to build more gentile washers.
Thanks for posting Paul, the Roto-Flex agitator has long been my favorite agitator for standard tub BD WP built washers. WP started a trend in more gentile agitation in TL washers in 1964 with the introduction of the 1964 LKM and then the 1965 introduction of the 3Sp WP Imperial Mark 12 washer. Almost all other large washer manufactures followed suit in the next few years except MT in the quest to build more gentile washers.
Paul -
I noticed something fascinating in a recent Kenmore ephemera document which may interest you - it advises the service field of changes to late 60s models which were about to be introduced, and in one or two paragraphs it mentions alterations to water levels, specifically the Low level, in Roto-Flex and Vari-Flex equipped machines. The low previously to this on Roto-Flexes had been 8 inches of water (which seems like a lot in a standard machine as compared to Roto-Swirls). If that's where your machine is filling to on Low, it may be fine!
Incidentally, the low on Vari-Flexes was one inch higher. I had no idea that Kenmore/WP tailored water levels to blend with specific agitators!! I do not think this continued into the later 70s or 80s as many models used common pressure switches but different agitators.
Gordon
I noticed something fascinating in a recent Kenmore ephemera document which may interest you - it advises the service field of changes to late 60s models which were about to be introduced, and in one or two paragraphs it mentions alterations to water levels, specifically the Low level, in Roto-Flex and Vari-Flex equipped machines. The low previously to this on Roto-Flexes had been 8 inches of water (which seems like a lot in a standard machine as compared to Roto-Swirls). If that's where your machine is filling to on Low, it may be fine!
Incidentally, the low on Vari-Flexes was one inch higher. I had no idea that Kenmore/WP tailored water levels to blend with specific agitators!! I do not think this continued into the later 70s or 80s as many models used common pressure switches but different agitators.
Gordon
mickeyd
Well-known member
Ohhhh Paul.....
Only the fins of the minimalist Rotoflex could disappear in the ever so slow spinning Kenmore.
Appreciate how your elegant graphics imitate the genteel effect of the panel, and I agree with Fred: This may be the most beautiful Lady K. of all.
Only the fins of the minimalist Rotoflex could disappear in the ever so slow spinning Kenmore.
Appreciate how your elegant graphics imitate the genteel effect of the panel, and I agree with Fred: This may be the most beautiful Lady K. of all.
ovrphil
Well-known member
More video too
Good job to getting it back up and running.... great looking/operating machine.
Roto-flex sounds like a plumber's tool to ream out the drains :^P . But, the roto-flex yellow/gold colour is also echoed in the gold starburst pattern, surrounding the dial. The design, lights, operations...nice example of mid-century at its best, I think. Any idea - was this console design with the alpha keys only seen in 1965 - it sure was unique!
Thanks for posting your work and I'd enjoy seeing more videos of the machine in operation, especially the panel lights for the different operations. I like that video you posted - nicely done!
Good job to getting it back up and running.... great looking/operating machine.
Roto-flex sounds like a plumber's tool to ream out the drains :^P . But, the roto-flex yellow/gold colour is also echoed in the gold starburst pattern, surrounding the dial. The design, lights, operations...nice example of mid-century at its best, I think. Any idea - was this console design with the alpha keys only seen in 1965 - it sure was unique!
Thanks for posting your work and I'd enjoy seeing more videos of the machine in operation, especially the panel lights for the different operations. I like that video you posted - nicely done!
was this console design with the alpha keys only seen in 196
Yes, and no, depends on how you look at it...
This specific console was used only for the 1965 Lady K. Previous and later year model Ladies K, such as the 1964 and 1966 were completely different in appearance and styling, though 1963 and 1964 were chrome laden like the 1965 and of similar functionality overall.
The console architecture (framework and overall shape, position of the flourescent light, etc) was also used in the 1965 800 model, however it lacked the clear buttons, the filtering light, etc. This occurred in 1962, 1963, and 1964 also, where the basic design shape and theme of the console was used in other models as well, going up the line the models gained glitzy/fancy features, chrome, lights, etc.
The 1966 version debuted the 'piano key' design of selector buttons, which saw the Lady K into the mid 1970s when cost cutting and a greatly reduced emphasis on fancy redesigned the console for the rest of the belt-drive era.
Gordon[this post was last edited: 9/26/2012-14:00]
Yes, and no, depends on how you look at it...
This specific console was used only for the 1965 Lady K. Previous and later year model Ladies K, such as the 1964 and 1966 were completely different in appearance and styling, though 1963 and 1964 were chrome laden like the 1965 and of similar functionality overall.
The console architecture (framework and overall shape, position of the flourescent light, etc) was also used in the 1965 800 model, however it lacked the clear buttons, the filtering light, etc. This occurred in 1962, 1963, and 1964 also, where the basic design shape and theme of the console was used in other models as well, going up the line the models gained glitzy/fancy features, chrome, lights, etc.
The 1966 version debuted the 'piano key' design of selector buttons, which saw the Lady K into the mid 1970s when cost cutting and a greatly reduced emphasis on fancy redesigned the console for the rest of the belt-drive era.
Gordon[this post was last edited: 9/26/2012-14:00]
mickeyd
Well-known member
The 65 was the only model with the fine clear tabs detached at the top, a real stunner, and unique; some have theorized that this set-up may have been too delicate, that maybe it would not stand up to heavy use, but I don't think we've actually heard of any breakages. John and Gordon will know.
Although the 65 is the most beautiful, the Keyboards are more versatile, offering more options.
Here's the chromed 62 Gordon was talking about, not nearly as pretty. Indeed "Filtering" but too glaring to see the orange/red glow.
Although the 65 is the most beautiful, the Keyboards are more versatile, offering more options.
Here's the chromed 62 Gordon was talking about, not nearly as pretty. Indeed "Filtering" but too glaring to see the orange/red glow.
MickeyD,
Your Turq. machine is a 1963 model. It may have been made in late '62 possibly, but is definitely a 1963. The '62 800, though similar in mechanical functionality to the '63 with four bottons on either side of the timer dial, was styled in console shape identical to the 1962 Kenmore 70 and the 1961 rapid advance Lady K. Instead of black buttons with brushed chrome inserts, the 62's had white buttons with color coded printing that matched the cycle colors on the dial. It had a big rectangular flourescent light like the '63 does, etc. From what I can see, the 63 was just a restyled 62 800.
Beauty of a certain machine is clearly up to each individual. In my view, the '65 is nowhere near as attractive as the 63s or 64s, nowhere... Even though I have three sets of Ladies in Coppertone, a 63 set, a 64, and a 65, I think the '65s are my least favorite. That is clearly tempered by the fact that I saw numerous 63s in service as a kid, and I think they are extraordinary, and never saw a 65 until I got one when doing machine rebuilding in the 90s.
As to the tabs, I've seem a few clear ones missing on machines, in fact I believe there was a thread inquiry here from someone some time ago looking for spare buttons, possibly the speed selector. I've seen missing buttons on 63s and 64s though too - I think it depends on how much use they got and how much force was used to depress them.
Gordon
Your Turq. machine is a 1963 model. It may have been made in late '62 possibly, but is definitely a 1963. The '62 800, though similar in mechanical functionality to the '63 with four bottons on either side of the timer dial, was styled in console shape identical to the 1962 Kenmore 70 and the 1961 rapid advance Lady K. Instead of black buttons with brushed chrome inserts, the 62's had white buttons with color coded printing that matched the cycle colors on the dial. It had a big rectangular flourescent light like the '63 does, etc. From what I can see, the 63 was just a restyled 62 800.
Beauty of a certain machine is clearly up to each individual. In my view, the '65 is nowhere near as attractive as the 63s or 64s, nowhere... Even though I have three sets of Ladies in Coppertone, a 63 set, a 64, and a 65, I think the '65s are my least favorite. That is clearly tempered by the fact that I saw numerous 63s in service as a kid, and I think they are extraordinary, and never saw a 65 until I got one when doing machine rebuilding in the 90s.
As to the tabs, I've seem a few clear ones missing on machines, in fact I believe there was a thread inquiry here from someone some time ago looking for spare buttons, possibly the speed selector. I've seen missing buttons on 63s and 64s though too - I think it depends on how much use they got and how much force was used to depress them.
Gordon
mickeyd
Well-known member
Wait a second, G-man ;'D
I'm a kid in a candy store, and those fine finger nail- like tabs get me every time. And I think all the Lady K's are beautiful, but now that I think more critically and comprehensively, hasn't Darren posted a Lady even more beautiful than Paul's. Is that a 63? I don't have them all mastered yet. You should show the '3 & '4 if you have pix at the ready. But I think you're right about the '63 being drop dead gorgeous. Or is it the 64............LOL. Get the pix up, Old Friend.
Of course beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Hell, I think the Rotoflex Agitator is beautiful.
I'm a kid in a candy store, and those fine finger nail- like tabs get me every time. And I think all the Lady K's are beautiful, but now that I think more critically and comprehensively, hasn't Darren posted a Lady even more beautiful than Paul's. Is that a 63? I don't have them all mastered yet. You should show the '3 & '4 if you have pix at the ready. But I think you're right about the '63 being drop dead gorgeous. Or is it the 64............LOL. Get the pix up, Old Friend.
Of course beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Hell, I think the Rotoflex Agitator is beautiful.
ovrphil
Well-known member
"...did you ever have to make up your mind, say yes to o
1962-64 LK's? I want to have trouble making up my mind - already beginning to get twisted, from seeing some of the old machines bought and revived here.
Gordon, are you prefering the 62-64 LK's from both looks and mechanicals, or just appearances? I have some ideas to translate into photos. Other than what you guys here occasional have ...(is it called a "Wash-In") where does one see all these cool LK"s? There's the Maytag museum, but is there a Kenmore museum?
1962-64 LK's? I want to have trouble making up my mind - already beginning to get twisted, from seeing some of the old machines bought and revived here.
Gordon, are you prefering the 62-64 LK's from both looks and mechanicals, or just appearances? I have some ideas to translate into photos. Other than what you guys here occasional have ...(is it called a "Wash-In") where does one see all these cool LK"s? There's the Maytag museum, but is there a Kenmore museum?
Phil -
In its basics, the belt-drive mechanicals are essentially the same, later 1950s to 1987. There wouldn't be good reason to judge a 1965 differently than the 1963 for much other than appearance as mechanically they are the same.
These machines are indeed viewed on a 'to each his own' premise, however there's a small twist as to why I like the '63s best. Remember the glee and excitement felt as a kid during a birthday party, a holiday, or similar that you've noticed that as an adult you just can't duplicate? Well, I was fascinated by the '63s, and was exposed to probably five or six during my childhood in various places, white, turquoise, and coppertone, in varying conditions from mint to well used. My grandmother had the dryer in coppertone. Today, those machines, when I'm not preoccupied or busy, can transport me back temporarily, and I remember the wide-eyed 8-year old's glee over these machines, whereas the 65 doesn't.
I guess that's the best explanation I can give you...
Gordon
In its basics, the belt-drive mechanicals are essentially the same, later 1950s to 1987. There wouldn't be good reason to judge a 1965 differently than the 1963 for much other than appearance as mechanically they are the same.
These machines are indeed viewed on a 'to each his own' premise, however there's a small twist as to why I like the '63s best. Remember the glee and excitement felt as a kid during a birthday party, a holiday, or similar that you've noticed that as an adult you just can't duplicate? Well, I was fascinated by the '63s, and was exposed to probably five or six during my childhood in various places, white, turquoise, and coppertone, in varying conditions from mint to well used. My grandmother had the dryer in coppertone. Today, those machines, when I'm not preoccupied or busy, can transport me back temporarily, and I remember the wide-eyed 8-year old's glee over these machines, whereas the 65 doesn't.
I guess that's the best explanation I can give you...
Gordon
philr
Well-known member
The fabric chart on the control panel of your washer remind me the trim colors of my 1963 Frigidaire fridge.
ovrphil
Well-known member
Beauty and the Beast(sameness)
Gordon: No problem with beauty being so individualistic. I worry about the seemingly increased sameness in design, that lines the appliance floors( Not that you can't find differences). If the machines were mechanically pretty much the same, it's interesting that for so long, they only needed to vary the color, console design and option features, to keep going. Good memories and thanks for sharing.
Gordon: No problem with beauty being so individualistic. I worry about the seemingly increased sameness in design, that lines the appliance floors( Not that you can't find differences). If the machines were mechanically pretty much the same, it's interesting that for so long, they only needed to vary the color, console design and option features, to keep going. Good memories and thanks for sharing.
All Time Favorite Lady Kenmores
My all time Favorite LKM washer-dryer consoles are the 1959 first all push button pair where the washer and dryer matched perfectly, then the great looking 1964s with all that great looking chrome and three speeds, then the 1965s these had to be one of the best styled LKMs ever, from there my next favorite are the 1968s where they have the flat keyboard panels floating above the surface of the die-cast panel and my final favorite was the 1975 super-capacity LKMs with the fold down cover. After this we went through the depressing period of the terrible black faced control panel machines [ this was as bad as the 1980s Montgomery Wards inspired Maytag washers and dryers ]. When Sears came out with black face LKMs around 1977 it reminded me of GM putting the Cadillac name on a Chevy Cavalier.
They came out of this terrible styling period somewhat with the introduction of the LKM Limited Edition electronic pair around 1984 and after this time they built a number of pretty good looking DD washers and matching dryers, but nothing compared to the styling of before.
My all time Favorite LKM washer-dryer consoles are the 1959 first all push button pair where the washer and dryer matched perfectly, then the great looking 1964s with all that great looking chrome and three speeds, then the 1965s these had to be one of the best styled LKMs ever, from there my next favorite are the 1968s where they have the flat keyboard panels floating above the surface of the die-cast panel and my final favorite was the 1975 super-capacity LKMs with the fold down cover. After this we went through the depressing period of the terrible black faced control panel machines [ this was as bad as the 1980s Montgomery Wards inspired Maytag washers and dryers ]. When Sears came out with black face LKMs around 1977 it reminded me of GM putting the Cadillac name on a Chevy Cavalier.
They came out of this terrible styling period somewhat with the introduction of the LKM Limited Edition electronic pair around 1984 and after this time they built a number of pretty good looking DD washers and matching dryers, but nothing compared to the styling of before.
I agree with most everything John says above - surely, whatever fave you have if it involves a 1960s Lady Kenmore, it may be due to unique and inspired styling, and an un-matched zeal for glamour and product acceptance from Kenmore's designers.
That said, I agree yet at the same time disagree with the synopsis of the black panel machines and even of Maytag's 1980s models. Right in the middle of the black panel tenure, Sears (according to several of their catalogs) outsold WP, GE, and Maytag combined. We don't have to like these machines for whatever reason, but the buying public sure did, and in enormous and increasing numbers, so what we think today ultimately really doesn't matter. Sears clearly had what buyers wanted at the time, and by the late 70s, there were many other choices besides Sears.
There have been a lot of articles written discussing how Cadillac made a monumental marketing blunder with the Cimarron (the Cavalier clone) but never have I read that Kenmore or Maytag made any sort of foo-pas with their later 1970s or 1980s consoles.
Appliances were becoming unitary non-emotional purchases in a mature market by the mid 1970s, bought on price and reputation. They were not the joyous, high-gloss purchases that they had been when the market was developing in the 1950s and 1960s. We AW.ORGers see all laundry appliances from a much different perspective than does the general consumer/buying public.
There is NO doubt that the 1976 black panel Lady Kenmore was a far cry from the imaginative, sometimes whimsical (and costly) styling that Kenmore employed ten years earlier. Considering that the 1974 Lady K was a styling carry-over from the late 60s, the dramatic and permanent switch from fancy to not-so-much happened with exactly one model. Boom, done...the Lady K was rather homogenized from that point forward until gone a little more than a decade later.
Many people could not look at a 1976 Lady Kenmore in their neighbor's laundry and know that they had a top-end unit. This was not the case in the 1960s. There was not much to distinguish the 1976 Lady Kenmore from the rest of the line either, other than an automatic soak advance (big deal!) and a second rinse. I suspect a lot of customers wrote those features off as stuff they didn't need or have to have, and it stayed that way for many years.
I think that is why we see FAR FEWER of these, relatively speaking, as a percentage of the total line sales, than we did in the 1960s. The time had come and gone for glitzy washers -- they were just too expensive to make and sell profitably.
I guess for us washer collectors, that just gives us reason to collect and save the 60s models, unless you like the newer stuff for many varied other reasons!
G
That said, I agree yet at the same time disagree with the synopsis of the black panel machines and even of Maytag's 1980s models. Right in the middle of the black panel tenure, Sears (according to several of their catalogs) outsold WP, GE, and Maytag combined. We don't have to like these machines for whatever reason, but the buying public sure did, and in enormous and increasing numbers, so what we think today ultimately really doesn't matter. Sears clearly had what buyers wanted at the time, and by the late 70s, there were many other choices besides Sears.
There have been a lot of articles written discussing how Cadillac made a monumental marketing blunder with the Cimarron (the Cavalier clone) but never have I read that Kenmore or Maytag made any sort of foo-pas with their later 1970s or 1980s consoles.
Appliances were becoming unitary non-emotional purchases in a mature market by the mid 1970s, bought on price and reputation. They were not the joyous, high-gloss purchases that they had been when the market was developing in the 1950s and 1960s. We AW.ORGers see all laundry appliances from a much different perspective than does the general consumer/buying public.
There is NO doubt that the 1976 black panel Lady Kenmore was a far cry from the imaginative, sometimes whimsical (and costly) styling that Kenmore employed ten years earlier. Considering that the 1974 Lady K was a styling carry-over from the late 60s, the dramatic and permanent switch from fancy to not-so-much happened with exactly one model. Boom, done...the Lady K was rather homogenized from that point forward until gone a little more than a decade later.
Many people could not look at a 1976 Lady Kenmore in their neighbor's laundry and know that they had a top-end unit. This was not the case in the 1960s. There was not much to distinguish the 1976 Lady Kenmore from the rest of the line either, other than an automatic soak advance (big deal!) and a second rinse. I suspect a lot of customers wrote those features off as stuff they didn't need or have to have, and it stayed that way for many years.
I think that is why we see FAR FEWER of these, relatively speaking, as a percentage of the total line sales, than we did in the 1960s. The time had come and gone for glitzy washers -- they were just too expensive to make and sell profitably.
I guess for us washer collectors, that just gives us reason to collect and save the 60s models, unless you like the newer stuff for many varied other reasons!
G
New Washer and Dryer Styling for the Late70s- 1980s
As always lots of good incite and information Gordon about this interesting time in washer history. And while Sears new styling probably did not hurt sales much and may have actually helped by allowing them to build a more competitive product cost wise during this time period was when WP built laundry products really took over as the largest maker. Like the Sears models WP by the early 80s had their greatest sales success ever and by the time the DD washers were going in force by the mid 1980s no other three makers combined ever got close to their sales totals.
This of coerce was a time when the US laundry had lost several major brands, so WP, KM, GE and MT all added sales in spite of the Regan rescission that gripped the country in the early 1980s.
I do think in the case of MTs new styling for the 80s it was a serious mistake and while MT laundry continued to sell very well in the 1980s the new styling caused MT to lose over 20 years of brand recognition when it came to styling. MT started using the center dial control panel with a horizontal break with the selector buttons below in 1956 and further refined this great and immediately distinctive look through 1979. [ This would have been like Mercedes Benz losing their distinctive grille and hood ornament ] For a high end company they had completely lost their brands styling reconnection overnight, Ironically even WP stylists had the good sense to bring back the center dial look when they took over the Maytag laundry name.
As always lots of good incite and information Gordon about this interesting time in washer history. And while Sears new styling probably did not hurt sales much and may have actually helped by allowing them to build a more competitive product cost wise during this time period was when WP built laundry products really took over as the largest maker. Like the Sears models WP by the early 80s had their greatest sales success ever and by the time the DD washers were going in force by the mid 1980s no other three makers combined ever got close to their sales totals.
This of coerce was a time when the US laundry had lost several major brands, so WP, KM, GE and MT all added sales in spite of the Regan rescission that gripped the country in the early 1980s.
I do think in the case of MTs new styling for the 80s it was a serious mistake and while MT laundry continued to sell very well in the 1980s the new styling caused MT to lose over 20 years of brand recognition when it came to styling. MT started using the center dial control panel with a horizontal break with the selector buttons below in 1956 and further refined this great and immediately distinctive look through 1979. [ This would have been like Mercedes Benz losing their distinctive grille and hood ornament ] For a high end company they had completely lost their brands styling reconnection overnight, Ironically even WP stylists had the good sense to bring back the center dial look when they took over the Maytag laundry name.
