Browning/toasting flour

[mattl]

Wondering if anyone here browns flour and what method you use. I was standing out on my patio tonight browning flour on my induction hot plate. Growing up my dad did it on the stove and the house had an unpleasant smell as he did it too hot. Looked on google and see suggestions to put the flour in the oven at 400 degrees for an hour and a half stirring every 15 minutes until it's peanut butter colored.

I use it in the sauerkraut and sausage I make as a thickener.

 

[mrboilwash]

Can`t help you with the flour, but had a good laugh reading about a thickener used in sauerkraut.
Guess every nation has their own ways of preparing food, Germans for example might add a bit of oil to pasta to keep it from boiling over or rinse with cold water after boiling to prevent stickiness.
I heard Italians would never ever do this because it ruins the noodles.

 

[foraloysius]

If you want to brown flour in a skillet, never use a teflon one. And if you do it on an induction burner, use one with a very thick bottom because the heat from an induction burner is not always even. Best is to do it on an electric burner in an iron skillet if you have those.

The oven method seems a better method, but stirring only every 15 minutes may not be enough if you want good results. The oven must not be too hot, otherwise you can't control the whole process.

Personally I would never use browned flour in a dish with sauerkraut. I'd prefer to reduce the liquid. When it really needed thickening I would use potato starch. But that's not brown ofcourse.

 

[foraloysius]

subject drift

Well, using oil in pasta water is good for a laugh too. The oil stays floating on top of the water, it does nothing for the pasta.

Besides that, pasta should stick to begin with so the marriage with the sauce is better. Rinsing pasta is only good for making pasta salads and for people who serve the sauce on top of the pasta. But that is one of the biggest sins in the Italian kitchen ofcourse. ;-)

 

[mrboilwash]

You could brown some onions in lard (for an authentic taste) or vegetable oil before adding the sauerkraut and water or broth if it is just about the color.

Louis, the oil is indeed useful as an anti foam agent but of course Italians just laugh at us when they hear about it

 

[mattl]

The browned flour sauerkraut recipe has become a staple for both sides of my family.  I've had old neighbors call from across the country call and ask for the recipe, all my cousins use "Uncle Mac's" recipe.  I know people get passionate about their sausage and sauerkraut recipe.

 

Our version is quite simple.  Slice or chunk cut a pound of smoked sausage and place in a deep pot and add enough water to well cover it,  Bring to a boil, reduce heat to a simmer, cook for 20 to 40 minutes. Squeeze out the liquid from 2 jars of sauerkraut, reserving some liquid in the event the finished dish is not sour enough. add to the cooked sausage simmer for a while. Mix the browned flour with water in a jar like for gravy and slowly add to the simmering cabbage, thicken as preferred - some like it drier, others more soupy.  The browned flour gives it a richer taste that we all like. This has been a staple in our families for generations.

 

[turquoisedude]

I make browned flour for a couple of good Cajun dishes I learned how to make in 'Nowlins...  I used to use a cast-iron skillet over very low heat to do this, but any heavy pan or skillet will do.  Had iffy results with the Revere Ware pans but my old Club Aluminum ones did a fine job!

 

 

[ea56]

Matt,

I’d make a brown roux instead for this purpose.

 

 Just mix equal parts of flour and either oil or melted butter (I prefer butter for the flavor) in a frying pan (cast iron if you have one) and stir continuously over med heat until the roux reaches the desired shade of brown.  

 

Watch it CAREFULLY, it can burn very quickly! Then immediately remove the roux from the pan so it doesn’t burn.  Then use this as the thickener for your sauerkraut dish.

 

 It’s easy to do and will taste just as good or better than using the browned flour mixed with the sauerkraut juice.

 

A browned roux like this is also excellent for making gravies or anything else that calls for thickening with flour and it gives a rich flavor to whatever its used in.

 

HTH

Eddie

 

[ea56]

Oil in the Water

for boiling pasta is a mistake if you plan and serving it with any kind of sauce.  You want the starch to REMAIN on the pasta, this helps the sauce adhere to the pasta and prevents the serving plate from having a pool of watery sauce on it.  

 

Also, whenever making a pasta dish, remove about a cup of the pasta water from the pan just before draining and reserve.  Then when tossing the cooked pasta with the hot sauce use some of the reserved pasta water to loosen it up.  The starch in the pasta water helps to incorporate the sauce and distribute it thoroughly into the dish, while not making it “watery” the starch in the water acts as an emulsifier.

 

And NEVER rinse cooked pasta if serving in it with a sauce, even if you plan on serving the sauce on top of the cooked pasta, you’ll end up with water on the plate, not appetizing.  As stated in a previous post, only rinse cooked pasta if you plan on using it in a salad.

 

To keep the water from boiling over, first, don’t cover the pot, and lower the heat to maintain a steady, controlled boil, not a vigorous rolling boil, which isn’t necessary.  On my electric coil top stove I set the control between 6-7 and this maintains the proper boil and it never boils over.

 

Eddie

 

[mattl]

Eddie, I do make a royal roux for the dried mushroom soup I make for the holidays.The extra oil/butter would change the character of the sauerkraut, might give it a try sometime but it would add more calories. As it stands it's a relatively lowish fat meal.

 

[ea56]

Matt,

if your sauerkraut dish recipe makes say 8 servings, and you use 1/4 cup butter and 1/4 cup flour to make the roux this would add approx. 50 additional calories per serving.  

 

But I do understand wanting to keep meals low fat and also maintaining the traditional recipe of just using the browned flour slurry to thicken the dish.

 

Eddie

 

[perc-o-prince]

The oil stays floating on top of the water

I snicker when people add oil to supposedly keep the pasta from sticking together for this very reason... it floats and probably 95% of it slides off the top when you dump the pasta into a colander! If you use tongs to lift the pasta out of the water and into the pan with the sauce, a little oil may stick, but how much do you think?

 

I only do it as an extra measure to help stop boil-over. Yes, I could use a larger pan, and yes, I could decrease the temp of the burner, but....  Maybe I'll try to change!!!

 

By all means save pasta water! My life "marrying" sauces to pasta and/or making them smooth dramatically changed once I started doing this, not to mention the pasta/sauce tasted better!

 

Chuck

 

[gizmo]

oil in pasta water

Funny thing is, I first heard of adding oil to pasta water on a radio segment that was "making pasta the Italian way." The Italian home cook said she always adds a little oil to the water BEFORE adding the pasta, the pasta gets a slight coating as it goes IN to the water. Pasta water should be boiling, if the oil sits on top, the water isn't boiling hard enough.

I use gluten-free pasta, and I always add a little good olive oil to the water. It does nothing to stop the sauce coating the pasta. GF pasta can be a bugger, I use Buontempo which is a mix of rice and corn flours. Sorry if any purists say that is "wrong," but I make delicious pasta dishes that way. Snicker away...

 

 

[ea56]

Lidia Bastianich is one of the most renowned Italian chefs on TV and this is where I learned to not put oil into the boiling water for pasta, and also about saving some of the pasta water for adding to the pasta and sauce latter on before serving.

 

  I have found this advice made all my pasta dishes much better.  She explains that you want the starch adhering to the pasta and oil, even if the oil appears to be floating on the top still manages to coat the pasta and prevents the sauce from getting a good hold on the cooked pasta.  

 

Before I started following her advice I used to often find that when I served spaghetti there would be a bit of water on the plate, since I stopped putting oil in the water this never happens.

 

The oil in the water is a trick that American home cooks started using in the 50’s, its not an Italian thing as far as I know.  And since I heard this advice from Lidia years ago I’ve noticed that every cooking show makes the same recommendation when they are boiling pasta.

 

Eddie

 

 https://www.today.com/food/how-cook-perfect-pasta-every-time-lidia-bastianich-shares-her-t104781

 

[this post was last edited: 2/2/2021-19:03]

The Real Reason You Should Never Add Oil To Your Pasta Water - Mashed

Old habits die hard, and perhaps that's the reason that so many people still put olive oil in their pasta water. Although the oil may indeed help with the water boiling over, there's a better way to control this, as well as keeping the pieces of pasta from sticking — use a bigger pot!

www.mashed.com

 

[warmsecondrinse]

#12

Gluten Free pasta:

I've come across A LOT of Italian food that doesn't fit the American idea of 'Italian' ...

pasta & potatoes

rabbit liver & kidney stuffing made with egg yolks - weighs a ton on a spoon, lol

fried jellyfish

peas & diced potatoes in marinara sauce with eggs poached on top of the sauce

olive oil used in sweet baked goods

green grape and 'black' grape juice each boiled down to syrups to use as a sweetener instead of sugar

ceci/chick peas/garbanzos used in damn near everything for damn near everything INCLUDING chocolate filling for pasteries

I would not be at all surprised if there're places that traditionally make pasta from ingredients that happen to be gluten free. Artichoke comes to mind.

 

[tomturbomatic]

Roux

Justin Wilson, "First you make a roux."

 

[askolover]

I haven't tried this method yet but next time I make gumbo I think I will. (oven toasted flour)

 

[mattl]

Greg, thanks-  Never made gumbo but now it's on my to do list. i will use the oven method next time I make S&S.  Not sure the oven browned method could replace the butter/flour roux in my mushroom soup, the butter adds a lot of richness to the flavor, and yes it is a long 45 + minutes stirring to get there.