But I LIKE the "gearless" shifting of a CVT.

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joeekaitis

joeekaitis

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A common theme emerging from reviews of the 2015 Subaru Legacy and Impreza is an emphasis on the reprogramming of the Lineartronic continuously variable transmission (CVT) that makes it mimic the shifting of a 6-speed automatic. I sent an email to Subaru asking if that feature can be turned off for those of us who aren’t creeped out by a transmission that doesn’t have perceptible shifts from one gear to the next. I haven’t heard back yet, but given the choice, I’d say “turn it off.”

If you drive a car with a CVT, how do you feel about the way it shifts? And if you’re shopping for one, is a “more familiar driving experience,” i.e.: fake gear shifting, going to be the deciding factor one way or another? Since I’m 60 and the Impreza in the driveway is a 2013 bought in early 2014 and built before the retuning of the CVT, I might not be in the market for a new car any time soon, but If I am, it’ll still be a Subaru. I just hope by then they’ll let the buyer decide.

And you, world?
 
I had a 2011 Jeep Patriot equipped with a CVT and I loved it.  Never missed the "feel" of a transmission changing gears.

 

I also had (once upon a time) a 1961 Buick Invicta Custom 4-door hardtop equipped with a two-speed turbine drive transmission (automatic) and I would challenge ANYONE to be able to tell when the transmission shifted gear; absolutely totally smooth driving.

 

lawrence
 
 
2014 Ford Fusion Hybrid.  Never paid any mind to the shifting, or lack thereof.  Don't often any more consciously notice when it changes between electric drive and gasoline engine.  I push the accelerator and brake, it does what's necessary in response.  Happy (thus far).
 
2011 Nissan Cube w/CVT. I love how smooth it is. Much nicer than a regular automatic. I'll stay with a CVT until/unless I find myself living in a rural area, then I'll go back to a stick.

Last I heard car companies spent years working to make their automatic transmissions shift more smoothly. Now they're essentially doing the opposite? I know my brain is wired differently, but to me there's something inherently contradictory about fake gear shifting... sort of like gay men who don't like to be naked.

Jim
 
I'm skeptical of CVTs as most rely upon constant friction. Well so do 'regular' automatics but only for fractions of a second. A CVT that relied entirely on friction would be a Maytag 06 or slant Westy spin pulley. I love both of those.

But when friction wears the belt out, you just tilt the thing back and put a new one. Whaddyu do when your CAR wears out its CVT friction element? Lifetime warranty? OK, but if not, then not.

Far as the slight 'glunk' a regular multiplate gearbox makes, I'd notice its absence but I wouldn't go so far as to engineer a 'glunk' into a transmission that didn't have one.

Only 3 automatics I didn't like. 2-speed Ford and Chevy that had no startup torque. 61/62 midline Pontiacs that had a hydraulic coupler in 2nd that bypassed the converter and bogged the engine. And in 2009 I drove 3 Chrysler vans with the electronic/intelligent 5 or 6 speed: No matter how you drove it, it never did what you wanted. Can't have been a single-unit flaw as all 3 did exactly the same things.

You know the rules. WAS 'if it's good it sells'. IS 'if it sells it's good'. That's what salesmen are for. Of course they never mention-- if they even know-- the engineering liabilities. That's for the emptor to caveat and few are capable of doing it other than 'the hard way'.
 
2006 Audi Cabriolet

<span style="font-family: verdana,geneva;">I had one of these transmissions in a car I had a few cars ago.  In my experience the car was OK to drive and I didn't miss the shifting of the gears at all.   But in my case the transmission started making some funny noises at about 51,000 miles.  I was not happy that this happened so soon after the warranty ran out.  I started doing research and found that this particular transmission had all kinds of issues and Many, Many people were having the same issue I did.  Audi wanted $6,500 to replace the transmission.</span>

 

<span style="font-family: verdana,geneva;">So, I did an after warranty claim which I didn't know was possible (thank you to the sales guy who kind of whispered this in my ear so to speak).  Since I had always had the car there for all its maintenance and since I was a repeat buyer they offered to pay all parts and I only had to pay the labor which was about $800.  That seemed reasonable to me so I did it.  I really didn't have much choice because I couldn't sell the car in that condition and really get anything for it.  Other than the transmission it was in perfect, spotless condition.</span>
 
Laurence, just like a CVT, a Dynaflow/twin turbine transmission doesn't shift. If you want it to shift into low gear, you have to do it manually with the gear selector! If you leave it on drive, it starts on the high gear. That's why many thought these transmissions were poor performers!

 

Do you have pictures of the interior of your car? The 4 door Invicta Custom models still had leather interior trim in 1961.

 

 

Joe,

I have never owned a car with a CVT but those I drove felt a bit odd to me. My father has a 2013 Accord 4 cyl with a CVT and he likes it. He says he gets much better fuel economy with it than he did with his former 2010 Accord 4 cylinder that had a 4 speed automatic and slightly better fuel economy than his previous 2006 Accord 4 cylinder/automatic (that one had better fuel economy than the 2010).

I have driven his 2013 just a few times and it didn't bother me but I noticed it had a CVT when accelerating quicker than normal.   Like your Legacy, it's supposed to be programmed to act like a step ratio transmission in normal driving conditions.  A friend of mine had tired $700 Dodge Caliber with a CVT and this one didn't try to mimic a step ratio transmission! But I was more concerned by the terrible noise the engine made than with the transmission itself! 
 
"I think Ford hybrids are similar."

I have a 2013 Ford C-Max hybrid, recently acquired. Driving home from the dealership, the first two times I pulled away from stoplights I kept waiting for it to shift. By the third light, I stopped noticing. Just the way it works. It is correct that both the Toyota hybrid system and the Ford hybrid system share a common mechanical ancestor someplace.
 
I prefer a 5 or 6spd auto over a CVT but having been driving a CVT now for 5 years I've come to appreciate it a lot in my current car; a 2013 Nissan Altima. Its fantastic in this heavy stop and go traffic area I live in. Some cars with their regular automatics and the way they were tuned would drive me batshit crazy in traffic, or just accelerating in general. But the CVT always does what I want it to and is quick to respond!

They didn't always used to be that way though, before the Altima was an 08 Rogue and it originally came tuned horribly to the point that Nissan in early 2010 issued a voluntary recall and sent letters to owners requesting to come in to have the TCM reprogrammed "based on customer feedback" for "a much improved experience" and boy were they right it was improved! The original programming made accelerating very difficult with basically either "granny" or "FLOOR IT" as your only options, you literally had to floor it to pass someone on the highway because it was so slow to respond, but after they reprogrammed it response became quick and linear.

As far as what everyone's doing with CVT's for 2015 with making them mimic gears I haven't gotten behind the wheel of one of these updated cars yet but I can tell you how I like it will depend on how good of a job they did tuning it. I'm personally happy with my Altima and I really like the way Honda tuned it's CVT, it kinda does "gears" and the CVT thing.
 
Having driven a CVT, in a Mercedes A class I was rather surprised at the smooth changes, I have however learned that they can be very expensive to repair.

One thing to stay clear of is the Volkswagen DSG, it is downright dangerous, it will disengage when it so chooses, shudder dramaticaly when changing gears, does not like to tow, does not engage at and intersection unless you floor it, and deffinately does not like traffic. That was the worst gearbox I have ever driven.

The day that I traded my Toyota Corolla (automatic) in for that VW Passat the owner of the garage (dealer) told me that I will have no more hunting for gears like the Corolla. Well I can tell you this we had to change the dual clutch system two times at 50 000 Kilometers and it started acting up again at 70 000 km, so on average the Clutch system only lasted about 25 000 km.

They (VW) even told me that we drive the car in a wrong way, I asked them how to drive it they said we should drive the car harder, well having a preganant wife and thereafter a baby it was not in the cards for me to drive like a maniac!!

In my experience a regular slush box is much better than then DIRECT SHIFT GEARBOX (DSG), it may be slower but in my life a split second regarding gearchange won't make a difference.

If you like your cvt keep it, Subaru is currently 49% owned by Toyota anyways, so I think our in good hands.

Cheers
 
DSG Gearboxes

I've heard these can be jerky and incredibly unreliable. 

 

Some people feel they are jerky only as they learn your style. Well, if you want to take off quickly, its like riding on the back of a kangaroo, or riding with someone just beginning with stick. If you granny-gas it, no problem. But anything more, nope. Stay away! (Experience based on a 2011 Ford Focus with the Dual-Clutch). 

 

I'd probably lean towards the newest "slushboxes," such as the new 8-spd by ZF being used on the latest BMW's. These are incredibly efficient, and have shifts so quick they are un-noticeable (per marketing claims). And if anyone decides to go anywhere near French-GM transmissions, I'd suggest running away screaming. LOL
 
The Dynaflows..

After 55 were really good, the stator would change pitch when you floored it, and it was about like a downshift, but nothing, and I mean nothing performed like the pre 56 HydraMatics, four speeds and absolutely NO slippage, a Cadillac would bark the tires shifting from 1st to 2nd if held wide open!!I know this from experience because a friend has a 49 !
 
Drove 2 subies with a CVT

1. Boss's Imprezza with the 2.0 boxer. Felt horrible. Lots of noise to get it moving and if you really stomp it, sounds and feels like a 61 Dodge truck with a badly slipping clutch. I think his model is a 2013.

2. Co-workers 2014 Forrester. 2.5 boxer under the hood. Feels a tad better probably due to 2.5 having more twist than the 2.0. Still when you stomp it, tach jumps to over 5500 RPM, motor makes a helacious racket, then the rig catches up. However, driven normally, it fells, well almost normal.

In either case, I would pass and opt for a manual. In fact, I don't see the merit in more than 6 speeds, especially with a 4 banger under the hood and it's rather narrow power band. Now FCA/Chrysler is putting 9 speeds in Jeeps? Really? Is that necessary? How much shifting does that thing do in a normal drive I wonder?

Or has selling cars become such a frustrating and boring process that instead of the horsepower race we're into the "mine has more gears than yours nah nah nah nah" mindset?
 
FCA/Chrysler is putting 9 speeds in Jeeps? Really?

For being in the Motor Coach Industries from the past, more tranny gears reduces higher engine RPM's which equals extream gas savings!

MCI coaches had 7 miles to the gallon of diesle fuel with the common 4-5 speed automatic Allison Transmission, but when Trailways brought Semi-Automatic 10 speed Eaton Trannies, we've got 10 miles to the gallon which is a huge savings!
Those trannies are gone when we pooled our busses with the Hound back in 1995/1996 and we could not afford replacing the clutch every month since the Hound drivers could not drive manuals vehicles like in the 70's and 80's!

ZT's was slowly introduced to the Motor Coach Industries in the early part of 2004 or 2006 and I personally never drove one but I can hear the motor noise which I can tell that it shifts too quick for my likings for an extra smooth ride for an extra large vehicle. Also, they are lighter in weight which help increase mileage in the long run.
I wished I knew the history driving this type of trans and savings!
:-((

When I had the 2011 outback loaner with the CVT, it was smooth until it got toward the 50 mpg mark and then you can feel the shifting a little. I do prefer my 4 speed auto forester, for it really sounds like a manual transmission when engaging the sports mode which is a hoot for me and I do manually down shift going down hills or exiting highways extending brakes life well beyond 30,000 miles (can I say close to 90,000)?!
Control Freak you can call me....., Sexy!
 
When I was in Norway, I'm pretty sure I ended up on a Scania or Volvo bus with some sort of Double-Clutch gearbox... 

 

That was smooth. But each takeoff was like someone learning to drive in terms of speed. Take off, gearshift, which gives you 2-3 (or more) seconds of "hanging time" before acceleration continues. And a clunker-clunker sound from beneath you. A regular automatic would be far more responsive, and as I said, the latest automatics are so great they probably exceed a well-driven manual!
 
I have a new Jeep Cherokee with I think a 8 speed transmission. Really don't feel it shift that much at all. The only issue I have found with this transmission is you need to push the economy shift button off. With it on the shifting is not all that responsive. With it off you are back to normal shifting, response time it much better for passing etc.

Jon
 

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