Calgon powder / expense

[paulg]

OK, I know this has come up before but here we go anyway...
We use Calgon water softener powder to clean our silver. You know... the foil, hot water and Calgon method.
Went to buy Calgon powder online. It is very expensive.
A) Any idea as to why Calgon powder is so expensive?
B) If you also use the Calgon silver-cleaning method - do you have a good substitute?

Thanks much as always!!

 

[aamassther]

Washing soda

The recipe I’ve used, successfully, was washing soda, foil or aluminium plate and very hot water. Hope this helps!

 

[launderess]

Nearly any base substance will do

Baking soda, washing soda, phosphates (TSP or STPP) etc...

http://scifun.chem.wisc.edu/HomeExpts/tarnish.html

Back in the 1940's or so Oakite cleaner (which IIRC was mainly TSP) sold or gave away a "silver cleaning plate" made from aluminum. One used the aluminum plate instead of foil as above. Oakite powder cleaner replaced baking soda.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-CL...-4-OAKITE-SILVER-CLEANING-PLATE-/401247380829

Think one day am going to write a book; Chemistry (organic) for housewives and house cleaning. *LOL*

Just proves what one's high school and university chemistry and other science teachers always maintained; once you know the theory or science behind something substitutions become easy.

 

[launderess]

Calgon Powder Expensive?

Just took a quick peek online, and someone at Amazon.com ought to be shot.

Almost one hundred dollars for two boxes of Calgon powder. One box for forty something dollars! Are they mad!

You can find Calgon powder for about $6 (two boxes) at K-mart or many other local sources.

https://www.kmart.com/calgon-water-softener-powder-40-ounce-pack/p-SPM8866714929

Main ingredient in modern Calgon powder is sodium sesquicarbonate. You can find this in bulk at the Chemistry Store.com and other suppliers for a few dollars for several pounds.

Sodium Sesquicarbonate

chemistrystore.com has the chemical sodium sesquicarbonate at unbeatable wholesale prices. Other names for sodium sesquicarbonate are Carbonic acid, sodium salt, trisodium hydrogendicarbonate.

www.chemistrystore.com

 

[mralex]

Instead of buying Calgon I’m now buying boxes of “Borax substitute” it contains the same thing as Calgon but a lot cheaper. For silver I use Hagerty Silver dip, it’s super fast and everything looks brand new without any effort from my side lol

 

[helicaldrive]

Wright’s Silver Cream

Is what we always used when I was a child, and nothing else seems to work as well to me. It can be difficult to find, esp once the holidays are right around the corner.

 

[rolls_rapide]

Goddard's Long Term Silver Polish

By Appointment to Her Maj...

 

[helicaldrive]

Calgon powder in laundry

For years I used Calgon in my loads of white laundry. Ancient Chinese secret!

And I kept having tub seal failures and rust spots in wash baskets in my Maytag Dependable Care machines. I kept blaming it on Maytag’s lowered quality standards in the 1990s.

Then, as soon as I drifted away from Calgon due to the cost, I never had that problem again. I concluded Calgon must be corrosive. ???

 

[helicaldrive]

And come to think of it

At the same time I was using washing soda and borax too.

Again, once I stopped using those things, tub seal failures and rust spots stopped happening.

 

[launderess]

Much would depend upon when all this Calgon use took place

Cannot recall exact date of change; but by the 1980's Calgon powder had two formulas, one with phosphates and other without. One had to check a code on box to tell which was which. IIRC those with a "Z" had phosphates.

Version without phosphates was as noted above, mainly sodium sesquicarbonate and washing soda.

Thus if you were adding Calgon (without STPP) along with washing soda *and* borax that is quite a lot of alkaline substances, which certainly may played havoc with your washing machine.

Calgon with phosphates alone is fine on its own. Versions without don't need anything else either, especially when one considers how powdered detergents dominated the laundry market until rather recently. Those products already contain washing soda and other alkaline substances.

One of reasons it is strongly not advised to use commercial/industrial laundry detergents/products in domestic washing machines is their chemical make-up. Many contain the same highly caustic chemicals laundries have used for ages; lye, caustic soda, washing soda, etc.. This and or they have high or low pH levels (very base or acidic) which can damage parts of domestic washing machines over time.

Commercial washing machines are designed and built with such harsh chemical use in mind. Hard mount machines for instance lack pumps and other parts that can be harmed by strong chemicals.

 

[earthling177]

Well, at the very least until the late 90's in Massachusetts, Calgon used to be sold in 3 formulas: "P" was full phosphates, "R" was "restricted" phosphates for areas where it was restricted, and "Z" was zeolites for areas where there was a phosphate ban.

Truth be told, I think at that point, MA areas (mostly by counties) were either "banned" or "restricted", but every once in a while one would find out a "P" formula at the supermarket, presumably because someone made a mistake in routing the pallets and someone else would compound the mistake by absent-mindedly putting the boxes on the shelves.

Either way, I used to buy a box or two of powdered Calgon every few months for stuff that needed special treatment (fabric dyeing, for example), it used to be cheap and easy to find anywhere. Then the powdered version disappeared about a couple of years ago (beginning of 2016, if I'm not mistaken) and only the liquid was available, which doesn't work as well for what I need it for. A brief search on the web doesn't seem to locate even a manufacturer for Calgon water softener anymore, unless you are in Europe.

That might explain the outrageous prices.

Meanwhile, I got a few pounds of Sodium Tripolyphosphate from the Chemistry Store in 2017 -- either I didn't order the right thing or they sent me the wrong thing. If I remember right, STPP is supposed to dissolve readily in warm or hot water, and this stuff turns into a hard to dissolve rock as soon as it touches water, even very hot water.

Cheers,
      -- Paulo.

 

[cuffs054]

Learning something here. Are the cleaning solutions (above) safer than "TarnX"? I was told that TarnX was bad for silver.

 

[launderess]

Tarn-X

Is a chemical stripper, and quite possibly one of the worse ways to remove tarnish from silver.

https://www.ewg.org/guides/cleaners/5599-TarnXTarnishRemover

http://www.hermansilver.com/tarn-x.htm

https://hpd.nlm.nih.gov/cgi-bin/household/brands?tbl=brands&id=10006010

Myself stick to the old ways for silver and copper; Wright's or Goddard's polish and plenty of elbow grease. This might explain why one loathes to bring out one's sterling and or copper pans.

Everything was polished years ago and now sits wrapped in several layers of protective cloth to keep tarnish at bay. Am not going through all that work again any time soon.

All that polishing is one reason why copper pans/pots, etc... and sterling silver flatware, tea/coffee sets, trays, napkin rings, etc.. have fallen out of fashion.

My mother, aunts, and other family members all have chests and closets full of sterling silver. None of it has seen light of day in years.

As a kid and teen remember being dragooned into polishing the sterling before major holidays/family events. Usually none of it was touched unless Mother made sure of it by actually using it and seeing to it nothing else was laid out. Finally she got tired of my moaning I suppose (and or was equally fed up), and that was that.

 

[launderess]

Calgon water softener powder formula change

Cannot recall exactly when, but at some point makers of Calgon announced they were ceasing production of all phosphate containing versions, and going with just the one non-phosphate.

Methinks like detergent makers the cost of producing several different versions of powdered detergent (phosphates, limited/restricted phosphates, and totally non-phosphates) was just too much. There would be just the one version made at a central plant rather than several scattered about.

 

[ea56]

I’ve used the aluminum foil and baking soda method for years. It works, its easier by far than using silver polish, its inexpensive and quick.

Just use a piece of foil the size of the bottom of a large pan, I use an enameled roasting pan. Sprinkle some baking soda over the foil, place the silverware on the foil evenly. Pour boiling water over it to cover the silverware and let it sit until the tarnish vanishes. Pour off the water and baking soda and rinse the silverware. Bam, its done. Its almost like magic.

And this works really well if your silver has patterns, as the water/baking soda soluition gets into all the crevices.

Of course, if you like the patina in those crevices, then you may not like this cleaning method. Also, this method is really best for flatware, I’ve never tried it with larger pieces, like a teapot. For something like that I’d use Wright’s Silver Polish.

Eddie[this post was last edited: 8/9/2018-20:45]

 

[launderess]

MSDS For Calgon Powder

2013: https://hpd.nlm.nih.gov/cgi-bin/household/brands?tbl=brands&id=18001539

2001: https://hpd.nlm.nih.gov/cgi-bin/household/brands?tbl=brands&id=18001030

1997: https://hpd.nlm.nih.gov/cgi-bin/household/brands?tbl=brands&id=2001007

2003: https://hpd.nlm.nih.gov/cgi-bin/household/brands?tbl=brands&id=18001158

And 2010: https://hpd.nlm.nih.gov/cgi-bin/household/brands?tbl=brands&id=18001373

As you can see there is quite a range there when it comes to chemical ingredients.

Oddly you can find Calgon powder here: https://www.merriartist.com/calgon-...MImKuYhLHh3AIVlUsNCh3UiAGsEAkYCiABEgJF1_D_BwE

K-Mart's website claims to sell the stuff, but good luck finding a local store with stock. https://www.kmart.com/calgon-water-softener-40-oz-2-lb-8/p-08767840000P

 

[helicaldrive]

Ohhhhh, that’s right

I forgot all about that. I always looked for and picked the boxes with the P code. And, now I remember: that’s why I stopped using Calgon. After the P formula was no longer available, the no phosphate formula didn’t seem to be effective, so I thought this stuff is expensive and I’m just wasting my money.

I don’t think I ever used Calgon, washing soda and Borax together or in combo. I thought about it and figured that’d be way too much stuff to rinse out, especially when whiteness was the goal.

 

[helicaldrive]

And I was probably doing it all wrong

the whole time. I was putting it in the wash water. I’ve gotten the impression from vintage Norge ads that the idea was to put it in the rinse water.

Whatever. The Culligan man came here for a visit 20 years ago and I’d never be without a water softener now.

 

[launderess]

Depending Upon When Your Norge Washer Was Built

Directions for adding Calgon (or any other non-precipitating water softener) was spot on.

When soap was queen of wash day those with anything but soft(est) water were advised to add a packaged water softener (Calgon, White King and other STPP or non-precipitating ingredients were best; soda, borax and other precipitating not so good)to the wash water *before* adding soap. Then if Calgon or whatever NP water softener was used to also add same to rinse water.

This applied to washing by tubs, wringer or fully automatic washing machines....

Idea was that by adding Calgon or whatever first to wash water it bound up minerals so one could use less soap. This also effectively prevented soap scum build up on laundry and washer/tubs. By the same token one added packaged water softener to the rinse water (even with washing machines) to do the same, prevent hard water minerals from combining with soap residue in laundry so things were rinsed free.

Have mentioned this before; many assume that when suds from soap "vanish" with first rinse water that means things are free of the stuff. Not a bit of it; what has happened is hard water minerals introduced with fresh rinse water have bound to soap remaining in laundry.

Have vintage boxes of Calgon and White King that give directions for laundry usage for both wash and rinse cycles.

Some laundry soap makers (mostly powders) "built" their products by adding STPP or other phosphates claiming it removed need for separate product. Consumer Reports tested those claims in 1940's and 1950's and found while such products may have cleaned slightly better in the wash, none of the phosphates hung around in any measureable quanity for rinse. Thus one was still better off using a separate packaged product.

Of course by the 1950's many laundry detergents were heavily built with phosphates so there wasn't a need for "packaged water softeners" even in the rinse. My vintage boxes of All, Dash, and other detergents loaded with the stuff all advise no separate package water softener was needed. If one did have really bad hard water just add more product instead.

Am guessing with the push to get rid of phosphates by the 1970's some detergents (non-phosphate) didn't cut it; so Calgon began pushing the "Ancient Chinese Secret" for those that used detergents as well. Something we here do all the time; replacing the missing "secret ingredient" for whiter and cleaner wash; phosphates.