Calling all FLAIR LOVERS

[norgeway]

RE Hallmark...

Our local longtime Hotpoint dealer has a Hallmark in his kitchen he installed when he got married and moved into the house in 67, his Mother had one, his sister...darn near all his family..I agree with John, even though im a Radiantube lover, the ventilation on the Hallmark really is extrordinary .I really considered a Flair for my kitchen, my only issue with them is if the ovens are on you get a ton of radiant heat...right in your face if you are doing anything that requires standing at the stove top...I may try one someday anyhow, I dont think anything compares looks wise.

 

[turquoisedude]

Just for the record,  I am already campaigning to Hubby that when we move out of the apartment in Montreal we are going to be equipping the kitchen with a certain '62 turquoise Flair....  I always loved the Flair ranges, but especially the 30-inch models (like mine!!)

 

[jetcone]

Il Bastardi !!

You didnt mention YOUR range when you were down here last week!!!

 

Nice color by the way.

 

Ooo I think I'm falling in love with that 40" Hallmark, its like the parallel universe version of our Flair!!

 

[philr]

Jon, today I switched the panels from my white DeLuxe range with those of the Harvest Gold Custom Deluxe you got for me. 

 

Before:

 



 



 

After <span style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 11px;">(also note the other "Custom Deluxe" addition above the dishwasher, thanks again for that too!)</span><span style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 11px;">:</span>

 



 



 

 

 

 

 

[rocky2]

Am I

a Flair Lover?

 

[jetcone]

Nice Phil! I love the custom addition to the

countertop too! Can't wait to sit to a meal in your kitchen!! 

 

Phil look whats sunning my back yard today-----all clean and sparkling!

 

 

Rocky those are stunning and they are definitely just what I needed to see today! That 30 inch range is fantastic!!!!!!!

 

I got down to cleaning my CI today. What a MESSSSSSS !!

 

But I have to say its amazing what 1.5 hours of elbow grease and Simple Green & cold water can do to 54 years of CRUD!! See the photographic evidence!

 

[jetcone]

Cleaning today

I found this little tell tale mess, there was so much grease stuck on this bottom plate the burn mark was completely hidden. A result of the poor rewiring inside the cooktop. Can you say 240V bullet hole??

ZAPPPP! No wonder I found burners wired to the other leg. I don't know how this range worked!!

 

[combo52]

Hot Spot On Sub-Pan

That burned spot was caused by using a warped pan on high heat, it had Nothing to do with the poor wiring repairs.

 

[jetcone]

Now tell me John

how is a hot pan gonna burn a whole thru steel 4 inches BELOW it??

 

 

[combo52]

Hot Spot On Sub-Pan

The pan did not directly cause the burned paint, [ the heat comes from the element ], but running the element with a warped pan for extended periods of time causes this type of damage, We see this all the time.

Better question might be how an overheated wire connection could cause an 8" burned spot, LOL.

 

[jetcone]

Ahh look closer Darling - then comment

There is a shorted hole drilled right through the metal just like the one I drilled through grabbing a copper plate that was jammed between the plug and wall outlet on my JennAire. 30 amp drill!

 

 

 

[combo52]

Hole? or Burned Hot Spot On Sub-Pan

The hole is not the focal point in your picture , the large heat discolored area is, you should use those little high lighter arrows in the future.

Ducks and Runs

 

[jetcone]

Good boy

Good good boy!

 

[kb0nes]

Jon,

Looks like a rust hole to me from that photo, need I send you a good lens so we can see what YOU are seeing?

Surely it is possible that 240v would EDM its way through sheet metal, but two things: How do you get 240v AC to chassis which is presumably grounded? Secondly why wouldn't the discoloration be centered about the perforation if it were caused by an arc?

From the size of the discoloration I'd say it was burner induced too. I can't say want caused the hole from the photo though.

Great restoration, neat to see the old girl cleaning up and coming back to a second life!

 

[jetcone]

Well Phil

to answer your questions:

 The range was rewired by NOT an electrician. See the second picture on this thread:  The wire used to wire the burners was melted, corroded, exposed, and oxidized.  The insulation melted off two sets of wiring. The burners were not connected due to the fact the repair had been done with low temperature blade connectors which had also melted off the burner contacts so that the wiring had fallen down onto this sheet steel below. I have seen  many holes punched this way, when 240V wiring contacts grounded sheet steel.

In fact I can show you the burn hole in the solid copper plate that was jammed behind my stove.

 

 I can't speak to the burn pattern, that would have to do with the angle of contact , prevailing winds, and day of the week it occurred on. Western patterns on Tuesdays, eastern patterns on Wednesdays.

 

 You are right it will polish up to be an acceptable range once I work all the bugs out. And there are A LOT of bugs in this range.

 

 

 

[combo52]

Arced Hole In Steel Sub-Top

Since the range is grounded the damage was actually done by 120 volts shorting to the grounded metal panel which is very easy to due when you consider that a range like this is fused to either 40 or 50 amps, just like in welding its the amps not voltage that melts the metal.

The terminal connections that failed where connected to the element was likely caused again by BAD-warped cookware, even when Frigidaire built these ranges they used ordinary brass terminals on both the switch end and the element end of the wiring. This is not to say that Hi-Temp terminals are not a good idea, but they are certainly not necessary either.

 

[jetcone]

LOL!

you and your warped elements - saints preserve me!!

 

 

[philr]

I recently learned what can happen when you connect switches incorrectly on a US range with no fuses!

I did replace a regular King Seeley (which was working fine) with a NOS correct type hydraulic-type Robertshaw Heat-Minder switch and rewired it. I took care to connect the same wires L1 and L2 terminals and everything seemed fine. The Heat Minder 8" and the other burners worked perfectly as I tested the Heat Minder and then the 3 other burners simultaneously. 

 

<span style="font-size: 10pt;">Then I <span style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">switched the Harvest Gold panels with white panels, </span><span style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">installed the range at home. The next day, I was using the Heat Minder and then turned on the front 6" burner I heard "POW"! The 40 amps breaker had tripped in the basement...</span></span>

<span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span>

<span style="font-size: 10pt;"><span style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;"> After checking a few things, I did reset the breaker and I noticed that the infinite switch for the small burner had gone bad but at least, my NOS Heat-Minder switch seemed fine! </span></span>

<span style="font-size: 10pt;"><span style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">I looked at the wiring again as I suspected that I might have pinched a wire somewhere when I changed the range's color panels but everything seemed fine. I looked at the wires at the switches to be sure the L1 and L2 on each switch was on the same circuit and they were. So I looked at my parts inventory, had a NOS 6" burner infinite switch with the same part number, so</span><span style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;"> I installed it</span><span style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">...</span></span>

<span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span>

<span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span>

Then I quickly reassembled the thing to finally cook my meal, turned the Heat Minder on and then the front 6" again and another "POW"!  This time, both the new Heat Minder and the new infinite switch went bad!

 

So I looked a bit further, dismantled the Robertshaw Heat Minder switch that went bad as well as the King Seeley Infinite switches and I noticed that the pilot light circuit was wired to the L1 on the KS switch and on L2 on the Robertshaw!

 

But then, I had to find replacement switches and I I didn't have other new spares... I was able to find a another 6" switch that works with a different part number (but it's a correct replacement according to my parts interchange book) and I took parts from a much older, used Canadian-made Robertshaw Heat Minder switch from a damaged 1964 cook top that I had (which was assembled with Robertson type screws rather than flat screws) and I was able to save the damaged switch. 

 

I ate a bit late that night but at least, everything has been fine since! Now, I can use the 4 burners simultaneously (unless the oven is locked for cleaning, then the rear 6" is switched off).

 

[combo52]

Blown Infinite Switches

Sorry to hear about your loss of two orignal Frigidaire switches Phil, this unfortunately is a lesson that most appliance techs have learned the hard way [ including me ]. I am still careful to check for 240 volts across the pilot light terminals from the new switch to one of the old switches every time I replace an Inf Sw, unless the replacement Sw is Identical to the bad one.

 

[philr]

Be sure that I'll check that in the future!

At least, I wasn't stuck with non-working parts while searching for hard-to-find spares as I managed to repair everything that evening!   The longest part was to recalibrate the reassembled Heat-Minder switch so it would start to boil at the right temperature but I think I got it right! There is an adjustment screw that's sealed but I didn't bother using it, instead, I carefully bent the tabs so the contact points would close and open in the correct temperature range.