Thanks Tom, and Baja, I had meant to ask about the roper, for sometime, but I was distrustful of my memory. Odd about how plain jane the caloric was, Their 36" gas ranges had tall lighted backguards, an automatic burner, double ovens, timed outlets, one of my Aunts had one, I always admired it. Thanks again Tom for sharing the history of these 2 odd ducks. alr2903.