Cold Water washing

[launderess]

Governments have pretty much done all they can with energy laws pertaining to washing machines, any less water and well be dry cleaning; so to find more savings methinks there will be a push towards more warm and cold water laundry.

Even on many new European washing machines, temps above 180F are becoming rare nowadays, as research shows most washing done on that side of the pond is mainly at 100F or below.

Sanitising by heat is not a very efficient method, some of the best disenfectants such as chlorine bleach and quats work quite well in cool or cold water. With this in mind detergent chemical suppliers can provide detergents which clean quite well and address any concerns about "germs".

Another concern, as more households move towards front loaders, are detergents with excellnet anti-dye transfer/colour bleeding chemicals. This makes it possible to launder certian colours and whites in one load, a boon when dealing with long front loader wash cycles. The European commercial detergent in my stash does wonders in this respect, as does Persil's "FEWA" detergent. Didnt' trust either at first, but have been mixing loads of whites and colours for awhile now, with a 100F wash and no problems. Yes, sometimes there is colour in the wash water, but whites stay white and colours stay unmuddled, so whatever is in these detergents does work. Sometimes I throw one of those Shout colour catcher wipes in just for good measure.

Think the problems many are facing with using warm or cold water washing, especially in front loaders is not using a top quality detergent. Tide with Bleach, Tide HE, Persil and other top shelf detergents clean quite well in low hot, warm and even cold water. Always remember laundry is a mix of time,chemicals,mechanical action, and temp. A decrease in one variable, usually means others must be increased. Thus washing in cool or cold water means using a good amount of detergent. Indeed Tide Coldwater is actually more concentrated than other versions of Tide, including TWB. Thus without knowing it those using TCW are increasing the amount of detergent.

 

[DADoES]

Back in the day when mom used Woolite liquid for "colored clothes" I remember it generated HEAPS of suds but the water never felt slippery like it did with a proper dose of Tide.

 

[westytoploader]

My whites are still washed in HOT water with everyone else's in the '03 Dependable Care, but everything else is washed in the Studio machines. As of now I still have only cold water down there, however, it's not TRUE cold; more lukewarm/warm than anything. I switched to full-time Studio laundry about 8 months ago, and haven't really had too many problems or stains I couldn't get out...if it's really bad I just pre-treat it and throw it in the Unimatic!

 

[hairybruinuk]

not hygienic

Cold water washes are not hygienic to get the bacteria, dirt, germs, and smells out of anything you wash in cold/cool water

love to one and all hairybruinuk

 

[oxydolfan]

I guess I just can't accept that my clothes are all that filthy!

I was so sick and tired of tossing increasingly expensive extended boxer briefs, socks, etc. into the trash because of holes, torn seams, etc. When I'm sick, it's a different story, but, with the advent of these space-age detergents that seem to remove every stain imaginable, I began to ask myself if I wasn't making myself neurotic worrying about germs and bacteria lurking about when, after all, I smoke, I like rich foods, have taken some IMHO very flaky antidepressant drugs, and take the 2 train.

Also, I'm glad to be saving money on energy. It would trouble me more to have to cut back on hot showers, air conditioning and the like. Cold water washing might be something I'm willing to sacrifice, in order to insure that I don't have to skimp on creature comforts.

It means changing around detergents, softeners, etc. that don't work well in cold water, but I'm trying to make sure I get replacements that don't fade darks as well.

It's not just an energy thing, either. I'm really trying to take the best care of my clothing that I possibly can.

 

[frigilux]

I'm not a germophobe, either, but I do use chlorine bleach in my cold water white loads, mainly because I wash all my whites together and some of my dish towels have raw poultry/meat juices on them for a couple of days before they get washed.

My white loads definitely show less wear and tear in cold, even with my continued use of LCB. What I also noticed is the armpit area of my T-shirts no longer get stiff and weird, as they used to when I washed in hot water with bleach. Don't know why, excactly, but they don't. I'm guessing there was some sort of reaction going on between the deodorant, the water temp, the chemicals in the detergent/bleach and the fabric.

I was SO skeptical of washing whites in cold water that I put a hand towel (washed in hot water) in a zip-lock bag and stuck it up on the top shelf of my towel closet in the bathroom---to use as a guide to see if my whites became gray or discolored over time. After 7 months of cold water washes in powdered Tide CW, they are still as blazingly white as ever. And I don't bleach my white bath linen loads--it's strictly the TCW on its own.

 

[launderess]

This thing about cold water and sanitising laundry gets me on several levels.

First in all my years both while at nursing school, and reading various historic accounts of world events; have never heard of a healthy person becoming ill, much less dying from laundry with modern methods. Mind you, there are certian diseases which can be transfered by handling soiled and or infected linen/textiles, smallpox comes to mind, but by and large today's modern health care and sanitiation practices have eliminated such diseases. In the rare case one did come down with a highly infectous disease, one is likely to be in hospital, not like years ago when you would have been nursed and or died at home.

While taking bacteriolgy one of our assignments was to swab and culture various surfaces around the lab/school; an am here to tell you if you saw what was growing on your own hands (even after being washed), computer keyboards, telephones and any of the hundreds of objects one comes into contact daily, you'd never feel safe in your own skin again. Yet, unless one is already ill, you still go on each day despite contact with these said germs.

People still wash dishes/clean counter tops with a grungy sponge that has been used for said tasks longer than it should have been. Touch toilet seats, shower curtains/liners ( a proven huge breeding ground for all sorts of nasty germs, much of which comes from wind passed which sends lots of said germs into the air where they find a nice comfy home in the warm,moist environment. Soaps and dead skin provide the food. And you are standing in that shower naked, NAKED think about all those germs, just waiting to get you! Now you've touched that shower curtain then a towel, now you are drying off with that infected towel! Oh how will you live! Yet you do, don't you.

Bacteria and "germs" are not very hardy creatures, and have been around humans long as there have been humans. Our bodies have developed quite well to respond to germs, and it is only when those systems are compromised that we become ill. Even then a healthy person recovers on their own, and or seeks medical care. There are people doing laundry in bodies of water all over the world where animal and human waste is present, along with god only knows what else. Yet they live. Mind you drinking or bathing in that same water is another story all together, but wearing laundry washed in those bodies of water has not caused an epidemic.

Modern laundry practices do a great job of sanitising laundry, even using cold water. If it didn't there would be legions of reports regarding various skin and or infections, which simply hasn't happened.

All things being equal hot water washing may not provide the level of germ killing one might expect. This is true when the washing machine in question has a high "germ" count to begin with, and laundering takes place at temps not high/long enough to kill off all the said germs. While 160F at 20mins may be good for E Coli, there are yeasts, and other viruses that require 180F or even 200F for longer periods of time to be killed. Yes, a good portion of "germs" are sent floating way with the wash water, but those that survive are on the laundry and in the machine to live and "fight" another day. If you ever really wish to be grossed out, ask washer repair person to show you what grows between washing machine tubs after several years, even with "boil" washes.

L.

 

[oxydolfan]

Yeah, I think you are both right.

It just seems, well, counterintuitive to pour the Clorox into the cool water, but that's probably just years of programming.

 

[launderess]

Actually chlorine bleach kills germs in cold water quite well. However the problem with using chlorine bleach for germ killing is getting the proper ratio of bleach to germs.

Like many other disenfectants, chlorine bleach is deactivated by the presence of large amounts of organic matter/germs. In hospital settings the mantra is "clean first, disenfect second" that is one cleans the surface/item/whatever first to remove most of the organic matter/germs first, then apply disenfectant. If you read the back of chlorine bleach bottles or any EPA certified disenfectant it will say for sanitising/disenfection one should clean the surface first, then apply the disenfection solution, allow it to sit for a period of time then rinse if required. When it comes to hospital and other laundries using chlorine for disenfection, it is added as a separate cycle after the wash water has been drained away, taking much of the germs/organic matter with it. This means less germs for the CB to deal with, thus better results using less CB. CB kills most "germs" and moulds in about 5 minutes or less, with proper dosage. Longer contact time simply leads to textile damage.

Ever notice after heavy rains or potential sewage contamination, tap water reeks more of chlorine than usual? That is because the water supply has uppped the dosage of chlorine in response to an increase or potential increase "germs". We've had so many heavy storms around the water system, our tap water smells like a bottle of Clorox.

Anyone that has been in the military or lived through war/something that disrupted normal water supplies may be familar with the little chlorine pellets one is supposed to add to a container of suspected water before drinking. MASH units or other places with labs will test the water and give a pretty accurate dosage, everyone else must start with a baseline dosage and increase up or down depending upon how dirty the water is.

L.

 

[zipdang]

Actually chlorine bleach kills germs in cold water quite wel

Just consider the temperature of most swimming pools. The water is usually between 78F and 82F, which is hardly warm and toasty. And yet the chlorine works!

What about a tumble dryer's effect on germs? Does 45 minutes in a hot dryer kill any more or less germs than washing in hot water?

 

[westytoploader]

I guess I could wash whites in the GE Combo when it's up and running; I'm sure putting the dryness control on "Charred" will take care of any germs...

 

[frigilux]

You should give it a try, Austin, just for kicks. I'd like to know what your results are. I think Venus mentioned your water is on the hard side, so you may get different results than I do using soft water. I strongly suggest using powdered Tide CW for a real idea of how clean things can get in cold water. If it's not available in your area, just let me know. The liquid version is also pretty good, but the powder is definitely the gold standard.

 

[DADoES]

Wal-Mart here is long-gone with Tide CW powder. HEB still carries it but devotes only one "slot" of shelf space. I must fetch some before it disappears from there as well. I still haven't gotten into the new Walgreens, dunno what they have. I may get to Phase 2 of the detergent test this weekend, but I have enough for that either way.

 

[frigilux]

I bought the last 4 big boxes they had at WalMart in Mankato, MN months ago and have 3 left. Target used to stock it, but they've stopped, too. We have a budget department store chain in Minnesota called ShopKo and I found smaller-sized boxes of it in the Mankato and Worthington stores. Right now I have SO MUCH detergent in my house I can't justify buying more---plus I'm having a ball choosing from all my import detergents---but I'll probably go pick those up sooner than later, hate to find out its been discontinued and run out. I love the stuff!

 

[neptunebob]

I know that chlorine may be less effective in cold water just as any chemical reaction slows down in the cold. When winter comes along, our tap water is like a chlorine cocktail!

Laundress if you are a nurse, do you notice that you can't stand certain product fragrances? My mother, a nurse states: "I can't stand Pine Sol, it smells like public toilets!". Then my sister, also a nurse, says: "That's becuase you work in nursing!".

 

[launderess]

Only completed half of my nursing courses, then switched majors. Long story short worked as an nurse's aide my last two and half years of high school, and were I grew up nursing was seen as a good career choice so off I went. Gradually while still working as a NA in college, decided didn't want to spend my life cleaning up human bodily fluids for very little money and sometimes even less respect, so changed majors.

Yes, various smells do bother me,while others do not. Cannot abide Pine-Sol or any pine cleaner. It does smell like cheap/welfare hotels,public restrooms, etc. Now the "hospital" smell does not bother me one bit, even when visiting. Neither does feces or urine, guess from cleaning up all those patients/emptying bed pans and changing nappies.

L.

 

[washboy2005]

"Are the European detergents such as Persil and Ariel better at color preservation than the American"

Over Here our detergents generally come in four formats:

Biological - Better for whites, and tough stains

Non Biological - Designed for people with sensitive skin as it has no Enzymes

Colour/Colour care - Biological detergent without Bleach

2 in 1 - Biological detergent with inbuilt fabric conditioner, 2in1 detergents generally do not clean as well as a stand alone detergent but usually produce satisfactory results.

So in regards to the question asked above, I would Say yes, Ariel and Persil do look after colours better but that is only if you use the product for colours eg:

Persil Colour Care
or
Ariel Colour & Style

Otherwise I would generally say European Detergents are not better with the Colour Preservation side of things.

Sorry if none of the above makes sense, I have just gotten out of bed.

Take Care
Dan

 

[appnut]

Dan, made sense and was very understandable.

 

[helicaldrive]

Thanks, Dan!

Couldn't be more clear! I'm going to have to get a stash of European detergent and try it out.

 

[washboy2005]

Hey, Thanks :-D for that.

I loved Ariel Biological Powder of the early 2000's but as of late last year Ariel changed their format and gave the powder an overwhelming scent of lemons.

I Tried the new format, didnt like it, as it gave me rashes and no softener could cover the scent.
Although after loads of discussion with Lavamat_jon, I have decided to give it another go, and have bought a 10 wash box today.

I also bought a 40 wash pack of Biological Aquados, Aquados is the powdered equivelant to the liqui-tab, liquicap's, basically its some extra concentrated powder, in a soluble film, you chuck one in the washer drum, add the clothes and away you go. I reccomended these to lavamat_jon when he last stayed with me in early august, he loved them that much that I went to morrisons supermarket and bought a big box of them as they were on Special Offer.

Take Care
Dan

 

[tomturbomatic]

It might well be that healthy people are not falling ill from germs, but sports teams are scared to death of MRSA or Methicillin Resistant Staphylococcus aureus as are operators of nursing homes and other places where large numbers of people come into close contact with one another. The NFL teams are going to extraordinary measures to increase awareness of the this infection and to prevent players from contracting it. Carpet has been replaced with plastic which does not suppport microbial growth as have the shower linings. Personal containers of shower gels are now used. Team members are now outfitted with initialed towels and told not to lend or borrow. They also have personalized shower flip flops, razors (don't share don't borrow) and benches have been replaced by individual chairs or stools. The danger of the Staph bacilli getting into a bruise which is a pool of stagnant blood, through a minor scrape or cut is very real and the blood is an excellent medium in which the Staph can survive and multiply. Fourteen days on an IV drip of powerful antibiotics is not pleasant to contemplate while everyone is gowning up before touching you or anything you have touched. Both are common consequences of oral antibiotics failing to knock out the infection. This is an exceptional case, right now, but as more bacteria develop more resistance to known drugs, keeping clean and keeping the clothing and textiles that come in contact with my skin clean is one way I have of attacking germs and the soils that they feed on. When I come in from outside, I change to house shoes. I do not sit or lie down on any piece of furniture in my house until I have removed the clothes I have worn to work, especially because the commute involves riding the subway. If dark colors have to be washed in cool water, I use plenty of detergent and they get a final rinse in a quaternary ammonia solution.

 

[mickeyd]

Laundress and Frigi

Laundress, You made me laugh when wrote about how germs are not very hardy and how well we've adapted because I remembered those nasty aliens in War of the Worlds who were not so lucky with our earthly earthy germs, and although we could not beat the ugly aliens with all of our might, our much maligned germs sure put them to flight.

Frigi, when I was staying at my mother's the evil gas company turned my gas off.
When I got home last week, I did a load of sheets, one of which had yellowed, in cold water with Clorox and Tide Cold. I was shocked at how white and striking they were as the flapped so gracefully in the breeze.

 

[dalangdon]

"Cannot abide Pine-Sol or any pine cleaner."

I totally agree with you. It always reminds me of the houses on my paper route when I was a kid, where the yard was full of dog poop and the people who lived in the houses paid for their subscription in pennies and other loose change. Those houses always reeked of Pine-Sol.

I'm actually quite thankful for that paper route, and having grown up in an economically challenged place. While my family was quite well off (i.e. solidly middle class) that job gave me insight into what it's like to be poor, and how difficult it is for people. As my mom always says "Rich or poor, it's nice to have money"

 

[mickeyd]

MRSA and other bedbugs

Tom, does ammonia kill germs as effectively as clorox? Does the odor dissipate in the spin cycle? What is a "quaternary amminia solution" ? Very interested in your ammomia protocol because I love to kill bugs even though they saved us from aliens, but I've grown suspicious of chlorine's propensity to prematurely age my clothing. Tell it, Man

 

[frigilux]

Mickeyd-- I've had great luck with whites using that same winning combination Tide CW + LCB) for over 7 months, now. It's freaky, isn't it? It just shouldn't work so well, but it does.

 

[DADoES]

I *have* noticed that whites have an odd propensity to look very white when floating in Tide CW wash water. Would OBAs have anything to do with that, or do they not affect whites?

 

[frigilux]

I'd like one of whatever it is Glenn's had, LOL!

 

[DADoES]

Just a nice bouquet of Foca, Roma, Ariel, Ace, Tide CW, Fresh Start, White King, and Downy Advanced. MMMMMMMMM! Clears the sinses right up!

 

[mattywashboy]

okay to restate my first statement.

I was in cold water because i HAVE to not because i CHOOSE to. The water pressure on the hot water is too low for it to fila hitachi tub in under an hour (seriously, its like a tiny dribble and nothing more). So to wash in Warm water is also outof the question because the cold would outnumber the hot resulting in cold water anyway. Also energy costs are expensive and money is tight. I would love to wash in hot and warm water. I have recently been sick and i took all my bedlinen and towels to the laundromat and threw them in a HOT wash just to kill the germs. It astounds me how so many Austalians can wash in cold water, especially those with kids. My clothes are clean but you can still tell they are not clean clean.

 

[gizmo]

Hi Matty

I hope you weren't offended, not meaning to have a go at you.

I remember hearing many times "it's been through the wash so it's clean dirt" referring to stains that had survived a (probably cold) wash. I guess the laid back, casual Aussie attitude extend to washing.

Environmentally, cold washing is by far the best but my work clothes get greasy and I haven't yet found a cold detergent that can shift the greasy marks.

best wishes

chris