Help! Maytag Repairman recommends euthanasia!

[patpackrat]

My 1977 Maytag CA408 washer recently lost its ability to brake after the spin cycles. An authorized Maytag repairman whom I've used in the past for repairs on a couple of other appliances, told me that with a washer as old as mine, replacing the brake mechanism is like "opening a Pandora's box" -- one part replacement leading to another -- and said (surprisingly to me) that I could go on using the washer with no adverse effects, which I did for the past couple of months. However, the other day a load was finishing and I heard a couple of screeching sounds and then smelled 'rubber burning'. I went over to the washer, lifted the lid, and realized that although it had pumped most of the water out, it had stopped spinning and the tub had seized. So, once again I called my 'Maytag repairman', who basically said that machines this old are all corroded, rusty or whatever and when you take one part out, another breaks. He said I would just have to buy a new washer because he wouldn't fix it at any price! Well, the problem isn't that I'm too cheap to buy a new washer (though I know they're not $300 anymore!); the problem is that -- aside from having no respect for or faith in anything new -- the washer is in my kitchen next to its matching dryer and among all my other 'vintage coppertone' appliances. But, in the words of the Maytag repairMEN (I spoke to another one), after 27 years of service it's life expectancy has more than been met! Something's wrong here -- why are they making parts for these washers if it isn't practical to repair them???

So, like someone just diagnosed with a terminal illness and in denial, I turned to the web, seeking either a ray of hope or agreement with the diagnosis, and I happened upon this site! After reading through many, many of the posts here, it seems there's a wealth of expertise among you guys, and I feel sure I can trust your opinions, negative or positive -- if you'd be so kind as to offer any.

Thanks so much,
PAT

 

[fixerman]

I think it depends how much time and effort you want to spend on it. They are relatively simple machines and parts, new and used, should not be hard to find. Having the work done by a repairman wouldn't be practical, which is probably why they tried to discourage you. If you like the machine and you are willing take the time to learn and do most of the work yourself go ahead and fix it.

 

[gyrafoam]

Oh yeah, I'd either fix it or find a replacement and switch out the cabinet so you will still have a match for your dryer. A friend of mine and I took a coppertone cabinet and the "guts" of an upper-end two-speed and put them together to make one GREAT Coppertone 1968 Maytag A806 with a lighted control panel and tub! No matter what, if you are willing to do the work the job CAN BE DONE!

 

[mayken4now]

Maytag Repair

Pat, welcome to this site.

Go and get yourself a reapir manual for that machine. Has the machine been in your home? (and I mean inside your home, not in a barn, not on the porch not in the shanty etc....) If so, you are in good shape! You will not have much rust to contend with especially if you have kept the Maytag looking new and not sloping bleach all over it.

I have a 1973 pair, and have worked (minimal) on mine, oh so easy, and I have rust! Yea you have to replace a few additional items, but sooooooooooo. Buy the parts in question, which I could not tell you what they are, but find out, then get those obvious ones first. You will probably need a new drain pump located in the right front of the machine on the bottom, so get that while you are at too. The felt under the pedistal that the outer tub rest on will need to be changed as well. Other than that, your in good shape. Do not trash the Machine(s), if you get over it and want new ones, go ahead, but please, let us know on here, someone would want your coppertone.

Steve In Pensacola

 

[peterh770]

The breaking mechanism (which is part of the helical drive) should be basically the same one that is used in the current line of orbital drive transmission machines. That the tub has now siezed up is further indication that there is something wrong in the helical drive. The parts are readily available. Any "Ol' Lonely" who is worth his muster can take care of it. You have a lazy repairman. Call someone else or give it a shot yourself! Welcome to the club!

 

[appnut]

Pat, I'm glad ya found this site. Hope the knowledgeable ones here will steer you in the right direction. BTW, I'd love to see all the appliancews in your coppertone kitchen. Bob

 

[mrmaytag]

Don't scrap it yet!!!!!!!!!

Hi. I too concur with the others here, there is something a miss in the brake package. However, before you start condemning the brake package, take the tub cover off and make sure no clothes have wedged themselves between the basket and the tub. I saw a similar problem with a 80's model (can't remember the model #) Maytag where the machine went into spin, spun a piece of clothing, (As I recall, it was a man's shirt) over into the outer tub, which locked the tub. After going over the edge, the shirt was literally spun into a tight ball between the tub and basket locking the basket. At that point, according to the customer, smoke was pouring from under the machine along with a burning rubber smell. We took off the cover, pulled the basket and agitator, removed the shirt, and put it back together. After replacing the burned up belts, it ran like a charm.

If this is not the case, then I would replace the brake package. You will definitely need to get hold of a copy of a repair manual to study, before you start and to help you along the way if you have questions. Also a brake package wrench will help you as well if you can borrow one.

I hope this helps.

Dennis

 

[patpackrat]

UPDATE

Thanks - You guys are great!

First, here's a brief history of the symptoms in chronological order, but let me just say that when it comes to cleaning I'm obsessive, and I dare to say there aren't many washers out there half its age that are half as clean -- inside the cabinet and out -- which is one reason I can't see trashing it. The only part replaced on it so far was a $1.85 fill injector nozzle. About a year ago the washer began making a grinding noise like something needed greasing. I contacted Repairclinic.com and they diagnosed it as needing a new tub bearing ($52.55) and a washer tub stem seal (63.05). Well, aside from being a procrastinator, the noise wasn't really bad, and it seemed the more often I ran the washer, the less it made any noise and eventually it virtually disappeared. So, I assumed it was just suffering from a little 'rheumatoid arthritis' (you know, the kind that's relieved with exercise) and that it 'went into remission', so I never did anything about it. Then, a couple months ago was the free-spinning thing, etc., as described in my original post.

NEW DEVELOPMENT -- Well, today was the first I touched it since that happened and after reading the posts I figured I would double-check things. Steve mentioned it needing a new pump, which I think may be because I said there was still a little water in the tub when it stopped, but that was only because I shut it down as soon as I smelled the rubber-burning smell, so the cycle hadn't finished. Anyway, I figured I couldn't do too much harm by turning it back on in the Damp Dry cycle and letting it finish emptying. I let it run for about 20 seconds, and much to my surprise, when I opened the lid the tub was spinning, albeit still freely. So, now what does this mean??? Is what had happened the other day symptomatic of a tub bearing dying, or is it related to the brake mechanism having died? It would seem to me that what caused it to seize and make the smell was that something broke away and got jammed (wherever) -- and then somehow freed itself after sitting for a while??? If I had any idea of what these parts looked like, I'm sure I could make a better guess! I'm intrigued by Dennis' post, though since things are freed up now, I don't know if that would still apply. I felt around the top of the tub and can't imagine how anything could get up there and get between the tubs, even if you really overloaded it. There's only about a half an inch space between the two, but I guess anything's possible.

I called Repairclinic.com today and they informed me that they have all the parts I would need, which would be the two tub parts I mentioned above, the brake assembly ($73.55), plus they recommended replacing the two belts ($23.10 ea.). Steve mentioned "felt under the pedestal" which I assume are damper pads, so I would add them ($17.10). If this is all that I would need, it comes to a little over $250, and if I were to do it 'myself', I'd also need to buy the brake/bearing removal tool ($82.40) and a repair manual ($??) which they didn't have right now. Are there other things attached to these parts or whatever that could break while making the repairs that should be ordered at the same time? I know it's impossible to be exact, but does anyone have a rough idea as to how many hours an experienced repairman would need to do this versus a DIY-er? I agree with Peter that my Maytag repairman is just plain lazy. I have one other Maytag guy to call in my area, but I want to make sure I have all the facts straight before I call him (and beg!)

BTW, no one disagreed with running it without the braking mechanism working and it not hurting anything else. So, is it ok?

Thanks again,
PAT

 

[laundromat]

Maytag washer

Hi Pat and welcome aboard!I would recomend that you call an AUTHORISED Maytag repairman.One who is actualy a technician and knows the product inside and out.Usualy,someone who says it isn't worth fixing either wants to sell you one of their rebuilt,used ones or a new one they'll make profit on.The cost of repair may be a little steap but believe me,it's well worth the investment.Call 1-888-4-maytag ant see if they can set up a service call for you.

 

[mayken4now]

Poor old MAY

Hi Pat:

Be real kind to her, as I mentioned, if you do it your self, Newton Iowa will have the repair manual. Yes Yes, laundromat says call 1-888-4-maytag, he is so right! Then you have a "no-strings" ............... to fix the 1977. You can buy all of the parts yourself, if money is an issue. The repair personell will will have them or order them, but at a greater expense to you. Lay it out on the line, to exactly what you want, require a written estimate of labor, time, and add'l parts needed. If the tub wrench is $80+'s, then thats a little steep for a one time fix. You would need to buy a large nice clean or have one built on your property,(a building) to start re-doing Maytag's LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Let us know how you fair. I will email you and share my maytag pic with you!

Steve in Pensacola

Steve In pensacola

 

[goatfarmer]

It's possible that you just fried a set of belts.Easy fix there.
If it is the brake assy.,I don't know of any way to get it off without the wrench,but I suppose something could be rigged up to work.IIRC,you have to remove the brake to get to the bearing.Maybe it's time to call ol' Mr Lonely.

kennyGF

 

[patpackrat]

Fried Belts???

Hey, Kenny - Thanks for the response. I'm just a dumb broad, so tell me -- can the belts be 'fried' without being actually broken??? I just reached under and felt them and they're still intact. But, I did notice that when I rubbed my hand along the belt to the tub, there was some black residue on it. BTW, this belt is pretty taut, especially compared to the one to the pump. Do you think this belt could have started slipping while it was spinning and caused that rubber-burning smell and then possibly stretched out due to friction, stopping the tub completely from spinning? (I did have a bit larger than usual load in at the time). Also, I mentioned earlier about being told that the free-spinning due to the bad brakes wouldn't cause any problems, but my logic doesn't buy this. What's your opinion???

PAT

 

[patpackrat]

Pictures

Steve, I'd love to see your Maytag pictures. My husband is ready to trade ME in along with my Maytag! All reinforcements to the cause of the preservation of good 'ol things will be much appreciated! (Change my address to @yahoo.com). My packrat name didn't come out of the wind -- I collect just about everything, though old clocks are mostly where I apply my mechanical talents -- and test my patience!

PAT

 

[patpackrat]

Authorized Maytag Repairman

Hey, Laundromat & Steve -- I did call Maytag to get the guys in my area. Since I'm in the boonies, one of them was the guy I've been using, who BTW doesn't sell anything new or used, and the other is a guy that's about 30 miles away and who will probably use that as an excuse not to come out if/when I call him. Steve, this is one of the times I wish I lived back in 'the real world' like you where I had a choice of people and could dictate terms as you said. I know from experience with other service people, no one gives anything in writing!

I feel so vulnerable saying money is not as issue, but weighing the price of a new washer & dryer (because I won't be happy without a matching set) and the loss of a faithful, dearly loved 27-yr. old family member and its companion , what price is too much???

BTW, do you have a link to getting a repair manual? Is Newton Ohio a place or name?

Thanks,
PAT

 

[Chrisfixit]

Fried Belts

Hi Pat,

Re the belts, yep it is possible for them to be ground a little when the machie jammed. this will leave a little worn section and cause a thudding noise when running. I read where the machines seized up then was ok after you left it a while and this would have been the cause for the rubber burning smell

Not having and operating brake should not affect the machine unless it is kicking in intermittently and this caused the jamm and burning smell you experienced.

Sounds as if it would be a fair proposition to repair your old
faithfull as the rest of the unit is in excelent condition.

it is a case of finding a repair person who is capable of this and willing. I am on your side by the way as from my limited experience the newew machines are not built to last and you would be looking at a number of repairs and a less robust unit

Good luck with this one and I look forward to hearing the old girl is back to her former glory.

 

[goatfarmer]

Yep,the belts can be fried,without actually being broken.

Is it possible that the washer might have had a heavy load in it,like a lot of jeans or similar? That would cause marginal belts to slip badly,and get the burning smell you had.The black residue is from the belt slipping,time to replace the set.
It's easy enough to check the pump.With the belts off,make sure the pump pulley is turning freely,no binding or noise.I don't think a bad pump will cause the washer to stop spinning,but it would cause the belt slippage if it were locked up.Maytag belts are very easy to replace,about a 10 minute job at most.Feel free to ask any more questions.

kennyGF

 

[patpackrat]

Replacing belts

Hi, Kenny - That last load was a little heavier than I usually do -- not with jeans, but I decided to clean out my drawer of dishtowels and sort of kept feeding them in while the wash was going! I did keep pushing them down in the water, and although it didn't seem 'over' overloaded, under the circumstances it was probably enough to push it over the brink.

You say the belts are easy to replace -- how so? I can get my hand under there and feel everything, but I can't see anything. I tend to ask dumb questions when I'm afraid of the answer, but do you have to tilt the washer back? If so, I only have 18 inches in front of it, so would that be enough room to work in? (In case you're wondering, I closed in a porch to expand my kitchen and of course didn't figure I'd ever have to work on my Maytags!)

One other question: If I replace the belts, do you think I could continue using it without replacing the brake until I can find someone to help me repair it?

PAT

 

[laundromat]

maytag helical drive

Pat,
Newton,Iowa is where Maytag's headquarters are, not Ohio.I think the first thing I would do is replace the old belts with a brand new set.As you replace the old ones,be sure you clean off the pullies and check underneath for any oil leaks.Some of the rubber on the belts may have left a resedue on the pullies.

 

[fixerman]

The belts are designed to slip since these Maytag machines have no clutch. They are fabric coated belts and if the fabric wears of they connot slip correctly. Replace the belts first. See what happens then. it is possible that the brake doesn't work but the rest of it will, however the grinding noise sounds like a bearing, either the tub bearing or the trans support bearing.

To replace the belts one usually tips the machine enough to access the underside. Easy if you have the room.