Help with wiring a motor

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Unimatic1140

Unimatic1140

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So the good news is I rencetly got a beautiful new vintage machine which I will share with everyone once its up and running properly.

 

The bad news is after a few washloads the motor gave out.  The motor starts just fine (the centrifugal switch is working perfectly) but in ten or so seconds you can hear the voltage drop and it cuts back into the start winding, click-click click click and is intermittent every few seconds after that.  I suspect it needs to be rewound which is an expensive ordeal.  I know for sure its not the timer because I wired it up with a test cord and it did the same thing.

 

The machine uses a 1 speed reversing motor.  I have a spare two speed reversing GE motor from a Kelvinator washer but I have absolutely no wiring diagram to go along with it.  So I took the motor new motor apart to examine the connections.

 

I obviously do not need to use the low speed winding in the circuit, all I want to be able to do is to figure out which wires will enable it to turn clockwise and then later reverse the polarities for counter-clockwise rotation in high speed only.  I suspect the white wire is one side of the low speed winding (odd that they would have used the color beige/off-white for that).

 

Here is an image of the motor terminal board.  I suspect the motor is made to start in high speed and if the low speed winding is called for it the centrifical switch will energize that winding once the motor switches from start to run.  The centrifical switch seems to energize the blue wire in start mode and the white wire in run mode but these two wires are not part of the start winding (black and red are the start winding).

 

I know this is hard to analize (if not impossible) from a far but I thought I would throw it out there.  The motor is model # 5KH47JR47S.  By chance would anyone have a wiring diagram for this motor or guesses on which wires should go to one side of the line and which ones to the other?  I really don't want to guess and short it.

 

Thanks everyone, the new machine is a rare beauty btw. :-)

unimatic1140++12-9-2011-18-32-48.jpg
 
Robert,

I have an older Motor book from Master, but it ends at 1960. I suspect the motor is post-1960.

The 'B' section of the table is for two speed Kelvinator motors. Hopefully this is helpful. I suspect the stripped ends of the wires was to the original harness plug. I'm not sure if the wire is black or blue. Otherwise the GE motor diagrams on this table may be useless.

Ben

swestoyz++12-9-2011-19-13-43.jpg
 
Thank you Ben, I appreciate the scan.  Yes I stripped off the terminal block as it will be useless in the new machine.

 

I'm not sure what those color codes are in the scan.  Is BR for black, BU Blue, Gr green and W white?

 

The motor is from 1966.  Still a mystery yet.
 
Okay,

Bk = Black
Br = Brown
Bu = Blue
Gr = Gray
W = White
# = colored wire lead coming directly from the motor

Yeah, after looking at the table with the correct color codes, the info is of no help.

Rats.

Ben
 
Ok I'm confused...The two pictures above: Is that the old motor, or the motor that you are trying to fit to the machine?
 
The two pictures above: Is that the old motor, or the motor that you are trying to fit to the machine?

That is the new motor, the old motor isn't pictured.
 
Well if anyone can figure this out I know that you can Robert!!  Now you are going to keep us all wondering what this "new" machine is....  

 

Terry
 
Ok, it looks like:
Blue + Black or red is for CW or CCW start windings
White + orange looks like a run winding
White + green looks like the other run winding

Do you have a low AC voltage source, or a variac?
 
Just to cut the fog a little, and more-knowledgeable correct me if I'm wrong:

H and L are main/run windings and use the same start winding. H and L encompass a different number of poles, have the same resistance, and the same common.

To reverse, either winding changes "polarity" with respect to the other. Probably the start winding as H and L run windings are already having to switch for speed.

Not that that helps you sort brown, blue, orange, green, grey, white. Except whatever wire goes to the centrif switch and opens when the weights extend, is start. In a reversing motor only one wire should read continuity to the start winding, as BOTH ends have to swap WRT the run winding at the timer. And if you got the speed wires backwards, just reverse them again.
 
Thanks Everyone

Do you have a low AC voltage source, or a variac?
I sure do have a variac, would that be a good way of testing to prevent shorts if I crank the voltage up slowly? I want to get this hooked up first with a test cord, once I figure out the connections the timer will be easier.

Blue + Black or red is for CW or CCW start windings
White + orange looks like a run winding
White + green looks like the other run winding
Hey Melvin thanks! I'm a bit confused, so to begin testing are you saying you think:

One side of the line (L1) = Blue, Black and White
Other side of the line (Neutral) = Orange and red??

Now you are going to keep us all wondering what this "new" machine is....
Terry not a peep until its working lol :-D[this post was last edited: 12/9/2011-22:45]
 
Hey Robert,
The variac is a good way to yes prevent shorts from burning out the windings, should you wire the motor incorrectly. What I was referring to was: Blue + Black for the starting winding, and white + orange for one of the run windings. So for L1:Blue + White, For Neutral: Black + Orange. Wire the motor through the variac, increase the voltage slowly, watch and check for smells of burning varnish, or the windings heating up quickly. If this starts to happen, unplug everything. This configuration is only my guess from looking at the pictures, so I could be totally wrong. If I were there with you, we'd get it going.
 
Thank you very much Melvin, I'm 90% sure that the start windings are black and red. What I wasn't sure was exactly how the run windings are wired.

I'll try L1=Black+Orange and N=Red+White first leaving out blue and green over the weekend and let you know how it works out.

I never thought of using the variac, that is a good idea!
 
Yes I sure did, 3 ohms with the start switch in the start position and no continuity with the start switch in the run position.
 
Shouldn't that spare Kelvinator motor just drop right in?
Oh that would be a "drop-in" all right lol :-)
 
A motor refit?

Robert, I have no doubt about your engineering skills. Looks like you have something brewing in the (rather large) pot. This should be interesting!

roto204:
I'm not so sure that Robert would be caught with such a creature like a Frigidaire Horizon 2000. Although I'm sure he's got one hiding in a closet somewhere!(ducks and runs)
 
Thanks everyone, none of those diagrams seem to match up to this motor per se, but I think I figured it out last night.

The answer I believe is RED-BLUE-Power  and GREEN-BLACK-Neutral, seem to get the motor to run properly, but I'm not sure if this is in high speed or not. More to come.
 
I'm not sure I like the idea of using a variac on an AC motor, low voltage can cause it to draw too much current and burn up, as often happens in a brown-out.  I would certainly use an ammeter to watch what it draws.

 

Ken D.
 
Robert,

I can't imagine what this is , and I can't WAIT to find out. Good luck. Sounds like you had a Eureka moment when the answer came to you in flash as you were distracted--or concentrating. And now, a big surprise is hiding under the Aworg Christmas Tree. This is exciting.
 
Using the variac worked because its fused and popped its fuse long before enough voltage made it to the motor to cause any harm when I was experimenting with the wires.  When I saw that I finally got the wiring set up correctly and the rotor started to turn slowly I immedialtey cranked it up to 120 volts to prevent any low-voltage issues from harming the motor.

 

Now the problem is the new motor wont fit in the space of the old motor because of the motor end bell sticking out further in the new motor.  I'm going to try and switch the motor end bell that doesn't contain the start controls, but one is a GE motor and the old bad motor that fits properly is a Westinghouse motor so I'm not sure that they are going to be compatible, but we will see.
 
That's great! You got the motor working. Would the surprise get ruined if you posted pictures of the old motor? You never know what I may have lurking about.
 
Unfortunately the new Kelvinator motor is just about 1/2" too big to fit in the motor cradle of our mystery machine, so it wont work.  ***sigh***

 

So I'll figure out something, here is the original motor to the machine.  What is unusual about it is the bearing housing for one of the end bells is on the inside of the motor.

unimatic1140++12-12-2011-23-24-44.jpg
 
Someone to help

Robert: you may want to enlist the help of Electric Motor Repair. They are located @ 2010 N. 4th St. In Minneapolis Ph# 612-588-4693. We used them at my work last summer when the motor on our Hobart Dw was damaged by a power surge. These guys are good, the motor came back like new.
New motor from Hobart= $1400
Repair by EMR= $450
I hope this helps.
Nick
 

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